My headset is ticking

Jamey

My headset makes a reasonably loud click when the handlebars are turned past the central position but it only does it when there is weight on the bike. If I get off the bike and just lift it up and turn the bars the click is barely audible, almost silent, but not quite.

Is this repairable (ie with a bit of extra grease) or do I need a new headset?

If I carry on riding the bike without doing anything, is there a risk I might damage something serious?

The headset was last serviced (bearings removed, cleaned, replaced, regreased) in September, five months ago. I'm no expert on headsets but I do know how to adjust them properly and it definitely wasn't that tight. It was as loose as possible yet still had no play in it.

According to the Specialized website my bike (pic in sig) has the following headest:
Specialized Mindset, 1-1/8" integrated threadless, steel cage bearings, 20mm alloy cone w/ 10mm alloy spacer.

If I need to get a new headset is it worth upgrading to try to increase the length of time before I need to mess about with it again? What would you recommend? I could do without needing to fiddle with the headset more than once a year, ideally.

ride_whenever

If you know how, strip it down and have a look to see if it needs replacing, if unsure post pics...

Jamey

I was planning to replace my cables in about a month, which would be an ideal opportunity to do the headset since you need to remove the bars to do the headset and you need to release the cable to remove the bars (unless I heard wrong, but I was under the impression you shouldn't leave bars hanging by the cables)... But I don't have enough mechanical experience to be able to judge whether it's safe to leave the headset that long (a month or so) without attention.

Also, while my mechanical knowledge of bikes has come on in leaps and bounds over the last year, headsets are still one of the areas I'm not completely au fait with. I'm definitely the sort of person that will need to use a cable tie to keep everything in the right order, otherwise I'd spend hours figuring out which order to put stuff back onto the bike. I wouldn't know how to tell if it needs replacing on my own, I don't think.

ride_whenever

Rightyho, you don't need to remove cables to do the headset, zip tie it to the top tube!!!!

Rather than using a cable tie on the headset, just take photos and use a big bit of paper to put the bits on so you can write labels!!! Much easier.

All you're looking for are broken bearings/cages (unlikely) and pitted races (more likely) pitted races are a replacement job, if the bearings have gone but the races are okay then you can just put in loose bearings (fill completely then remove two)

Often just undoing and re-greasing will fix it. Remember, to determine if play is the headset, turn the wheel 90 degrees and see if there is rock, that usually eliminates other forms.

Jamey

Thanks, for that.

Am I right in thinking that for each race, one half can be removed and the other half is pressed into the head tube? I presume that if the pitting is located in the half that's pressed into the tube then I'll need to get the LBS to replace those, will I? Or can it be done at home?

Oh, and when you say 'zip tie it to the top tube' I presume you mean the handlebars, do you?

Sorry if I'm being stupid.

ride_whenever

Yup all correct, generally if you've got caged bearings you'll only get pitting on the race where the bearings are as opposed to the cage.

As for replacing the cups (frame races) yes, it's an lbs job. You can do it at home with a hammer and bits of wood and scredrivers, but i really wouldn't recommend it for the sake of a few quid, and if you are buying a decent ~£40 headset, they should fit it for free if you're a regular.

Jamey

Nice one.

If you were me, would you just buy a £40 headset from the LBS and get them to fit it anyway?

How much of an upgrade would that be to my current headset?

The really annoying thing is that I'm working overtime both days this weekend, both ten-hour shifts. And I need the bike to commute Monday morning really (gonna drive over the weekend, just because the car park's free at weekends) so I've got extremely limited time tomorrow and Sunday to do the work, and even if I do it, it'll probably be dark by the time I get home (I have no garage and live in a one-bed flat so have to work on my bike out in tthe street).

This is why I was asking about whether I could get away with riding the bike in its current state, you see.

daddylonglegs

Are you sure it's the head set? Assuming we're talking about a road bike here, this sound could be the STI cable outers moving in the braze-ons at the top of your down tube. I had this problem for months and it drove me mad.

What happens I think is that when the bars turn they pull and twist the cable outers. Due to the design of STI compressionless outers they tend to twist and wind up slightly when the bars are turned and then slip fractionally when the tension reaches a certain point. The sound occurs where they join the frame and is amplified by the frame tubes giving you an audible sharp click. I think it's a particular problem with wider gauge aluminium frame tubes. I've seen several mentions of this problem on this forum and others. Unless you're absolutely sure it's your headset, check out this possibility.

I have to say it's a tough one to solve, but begin with new cables, or even try trimming a centimeter or two off your existing ones if there's enough to spare.

Jamey

That wouldn't explain why the noise is quiet when I'm off the bike (moving handlebars in the air) and louder when I'm riding, though.

But I'll check anyway.

daddylonglegs

That's true. But I remember the problem for me was particularly bad when I was climbing out of the saddle as the bars moved from side to side. The cause is very subtle. It might be wise to eliminate this possibility by disconnecting the cables and slipping the outers out of the braze-ons and trying to get the sound again with the cables out.

Jamey

Daddylonglegs, I could kiss you. You're a genius... I just went out and wiggled the front mech cable about... Lo and behold, the telltale sound. My solution was to wodge some lithium grease into the hole at the top of the barrel adjuster on the down tube, that seems to have sorted it for now.

This is where somebody tells me that lithium grease eats plastic cable stops in a matter of days, isn't it... I can feel it coming.

daddylonglegs

I think there should be a world wide public notice on this one. There must be millions of riders out there going nearly insane over that mysterious nasty click...click...click...click every time they move their bars.

Don't forget, you heard it here first!

nicklouse

Daddylonglegs
having just seen this post and as i was reading through it i was thinking cables... cables.

As headsets dont really click if turned even if worn.

the will click if pushed against a applied brake. and they will feel graunchy when turned if worn and indexed if over tightend. But clicking is normally cables (MTB or Road).

Jamey

And the best news of all is that lithium grease isn't a corrosive danger to plastic... Yay!

(At least I'm assuming so, since no-one's told me off yet)

nicklouse

well the plastic of the adjusters should be fine and the plastic coating on the cable... who cares.

Jamey

Apologies for dragging up this old thread again but the ticking sound has returned and this time it's not the cables (first thing I checked).

I think it might be a slight amount of play in the front hub bearings but (once again) would like to hear your thoughts.

Here's what I've discovered so far:

- The noise only happens when the bike is being ridden. It does not happen without weight on the bike.

- The noise only happens when turning. It does not happen when riding in a straight line, although you only have to make a very tiny turn to get the noise.

- If you stop pedalling (but keep coasting forwards) and zig-zag the bike from side to side the noise is like a machine gun of ticking sounds, you can make it occur loads.

Do you think this might be the wheel bearing at the front? I haven't had a chance to remove the wheel and wiggle the axle yet (lots of late nights due to overtime) but I'm hoping to investigate more this weekend.

alfablue

A bit left field this idea, but do you have a computer fitted? If so, the strain on the wheel whilst turning may make the magnet graze the transmitter.

Jamey

The answer to that is yes and no. I have a computer but it's a Garmin Edge so there's nothing on the wheel, it uses GPS instead. Nice idea though, thanks. Here's hoping it turns out to be that simple.

alfablue

Ah well, it was wishful thinking (that it would be so simple). Is there anything else that could do it when the wheel flexes? Like a high point on the rim that touches brake, mudguard fitting, rim decal sticking up? Does it hapen once per revolution or more than once?

(Wishful thinking is cheap and easy , though I have learned that I tend to think of the very worst case scenario, usually to find it to be something trivial). )

Jamey

When you do the zig-zagging thing the tick definitely happens more than once per revolution of the wheel, so it would need to be more than one 'lump' (for want of a better word) that's catching on something.

It's one of those noises that you sort of hear through the frame, if that makes sense. Like when a bottom bracket is clicking and it can be difficult to hear exactly where the noise is coming from because the sound travels through the frame itself, so you sort of hear it coming from whichever part of the frame is closest to your ear. But I'm fairly sure it's something at the front because of the way it's linked to the steering and despite what I've just said it does actually sound like it's coming from the front. I was just trying to illustrate the kind of ticking noise I mean, that's all.

alfablue

Same rpm regardless of gear?

In keeping with pedalling effort or wheel rotation?

It may well be the hub, but tickings can be really hard to isolate. I replaced some pedals once and re-did all my chainring bolts, turned out to be seatpost clamp too loose! Turns out that as my bum moved on each pedal stroke it fooled me that it was something in the drive train. The noises always seem to be referred to somewhere else! What about handlebar/stem interface? Loose spoke?

alfablue

Ah, sure it won't be this, but I was once fooled there was a catastrophic hub problem, and it was just the nut on the tyre valve loose :oops:

Jamey

Same RPM regardless of gear - yep.

Pedalling effort etc - noise is same regardless of speed or effort.

I've tried zig-zagging standing up (to rule out saddle/seatpost etc) and noise is the same.

Have also tried wiggling handlebars with bike stationary and noise does not occur when I do that, so doubtful it's the bars of stem, I try to keep them fairly tight having encountered that creaking before on the old bike.