Cycling nutrition - Before, During, After?

Gav888

Hi,

There are alot of posts about regarding nutrition, but ive found nothing that lists what you should eat and when. Below is my plan, probably overkill for the distances im covering at the moment but your feedback would be good.

At present I can ride 12 miles in 1hr, which is approx 12 mph ave, slow I know, but im working on it. I could have kept going for longer as my legs where fine and I felt like I had a good level of energy, but I got bad cramps in my calf's and had to stop.... So the below plan is based on getting a good amount of carbs to fuel me through the ride and some caffiene which always helps and the salt in the drink and a banana are to help avoid the cramps.

This is for a 2hr bike ride, which is my current goal, any shorter or longer and I will adjust what I take with me but keep the before and after the same.....


1.5 to 2hrs before ride

Porridge with choc powder and skimmed milk or rice pudding with choc powder and a glass of skimmed milk


1hr before ride

Drink 250ml of orange juice or coke with a pinch of salt


Before leaving the house

Banana, 2 caffiene tablets, 250ml of orange juice or coke with a pinch of salt


During

500ml of coke diluted 2/3rds or orange juice diluted 2/3rds or water with normal fruit flavor cordial, with a pinch of salt drinking a bit every 15/20min.
Banana at 45 min
Energy bar at 1hr 30


After

500ml of choc protein shake made with semi skimmed milk
Go-ahead bar

Any feed back / adjustments would be great. As mentioned I cannot do 2hrs at present but im sure I can if my legs dont cramp again....

Another thing while I think of it, I dont really sweat out on a bike run, but I can do an hour on the exercise bike at a med level sweating buckets and not get cramp or even a hint of them?

Thanks

gkerr4

seems an awful lot of sugar to me - i couldn't stomach it

the porridge is fine pre-ride but the choc powder is just unnecessary refined sugar - as is the coke! - and I couldn't ride with drinking coke I'd be sick - an energy drink which uses dextrose of malto-blend will be better for you.

post ride I think a protein based recovery drink with some added dextrose would be better - you can buy raw ingredients for these drinks from places like myprotein.co.uk or bulkpowders and make your own.

richa

For a 2hr ride? Caffeine tablets, etc? Why?

For a 2 hr ride, I would be expecting you to have a normal breakie (cereal, toast, whatever) and some water whilst out in the ride. Perhaps a banana/energy drink. All the rest is overdoing it.

Please add up and report back how many calories you are fuelling for this ride?

gkerr4

it'll be a whole load of calories! - certainly more than you will burn off in a two hour ride so I hope you are not hoping to lose weight from cycling!

I agree with rich - breakfast like cereal, a cup of coffee and off out with either just water or a little diluting juice in the bottles and maybe a bit of toast on return (plus a protein shake if it has been an 'interval' session)

hell, Ive seen me go out for 1hour fasted rides in the morning and it turning into a 2 hour ride through enjoyment - i've never had a problem (although I was starving on return!)

Gav888

Great advise, this is what I was looking for being a newbie to road cycling, I dont know much apart from what ive read and put it together how I thought, so thanks for the advise. Once I had written it all out it did look alot, and def over kill as you say. I will take on your advise and cut down what im having. How does the below look?

The coke on the ride was in a few articles, advising it was really good to drink as it provided carbs and caffiene, here is one of them - http://www.endurancecoach.com/Drinking_for_Cycling.htm about half way down.

There is alot of sugar is I was wrongly under the impression you need alot to fuel you for the ride, I dont want to bonk out, so im making sure ive got plenty of fuel, but then, as you've said, way to much sugar!! :shock:


1.5 to 2hrs before ride - (Is this ok, or should it be closer to ride time, maybe 1hr?)

Porridge and skimmed milk or rice pudding with a glass of skimmed milk


Before leaving the house

Banana, 2 caffiene tablets (I want to stick with these whilst im building my fitness) 250ml of diluted orange juice or water with fruit cordial with a pinch of salt (Is the salt needed at this stage?)


During

500ml of water with fruit flavor cordial or diluted juice with a pinch of salt, drinking about 100ml every 15/20min.
Energy bar incase its needed


After

500ml of protein energy drink
Toast and scrambled eggs

If I was to increase this past 2 hrs (thinking ahead) would I just need to carry more on the bike, such as a banana and another drinks bottle?

Infamous

Why do you need a banana just before you ride?

Gavin Gilbert

The banana just before the ride does seem odd - it'll trigger an insulin response before your muscles are actually working. During the ride hell yes, but I'd avoid it directly before. Knock the caffeine tablets on the head too - the only time you ever need caffeine on a bike is if you're doing 24 Hour events or the longer Audax distances.

I agree with Rich too, your plan is overkill, unless you're going as hard as you possibly can - and I mean race pace - you're consuming more than you're using.

The egg on toast after is good 'lo - as long as you consume it within 15 to 20 minutes of stopping riding. There's a very short window to get a recovery feed inside you.

richa

Gav,
You don't say what your goals are or what intensity you are riding at. I will assume that the purpose is increased fitness, the pace steady.

Coke does provide carbs and caffiene. It is also conveniently sold in most village shops etc. However, it is fizzy and that means doesn't sit in the stomach so well. It also isn't as good as a 'proper' sports/energy drink and so it is better to leave with an energy drink. Saying that, your body is a great store of energy and will have 2,000+ KCals in glycogen stores plus serveral hundred thousand KCals in fat stores. For a 1.5-2 hr ride you should have plenty of energy on board and shouldn't need much extra. To be safe consider an energy drink, OJ&water or a banana.

What is the caffeine adding? AFAIK the effect of caffeine as a stimulant is reduced in those that regular consume caffeine. Thus you caffeine will be reducing the effect that they will have when you want them for that race/sportive/special day in the saddle.

Do you want to lose any weight. Plenty of us cyclists in training could do with losing a little/reducing body fat. In which case a little calorie defecit over the day is welcome.

Is your post ride consumtion part of a normal meal or are you adding an extra one in here (before a full/normal lunch say)? Post ride consumption can have some benefits in that glycogen stores are restocked and protein is provided to assist with muscle regeneration. The former is less important in a desired weightloss scenario, as you want your lunch/supper to be contributing to restocking your storews so that there is less surplus/more of a deficit. The latter protein point is most important when you are working the musckles very hard and breaking them down/building them up, this is likely to be minor in shorter/slower rides.

Salt shouldn't be required at this stage. The cold weather will reduce your sweating, the rides are 2 hrs steady and you shouln't be getting dehydrated, low on electrolytes. On longer rides (3+ hrs), you will possibly move energy drinks (which often include electrolytes)

I would try with a lot less and see how you get on.

1-1.5hrs before ride
Breakfast i.e. Cereal & toast or Porridge. + Water/Juice (ensure that you are not dehydrated)

Before leaving the house
Nothing. Maybe something to drink. You have not long ago had breakfast and have expended very little since.

During
100ml every 15/20min is not enough.
500-750ml of water/hr is closer to the mark.
Energy drink or banana or bar as needed

After
Water to rehydrate as required.
Lunch as normal

As you do 3+ hrs you just increase the energy intake on the bike, by moving to energy drink, sdding a banana, flapjack, etc. Then have a recovery drink on return.

softlad

I think there is some danger of over-analysis here Gav.

Food and drink will not get you round a two hour ride - your legs will. You just need to be riding more - perhaps a little further each time. Filling your face like that is likely to make things worse, not better - while the blood supply which should be going to your muscles will end up being diverted to your stomach to help it digest all that stuff.

I would not be thinking about energy or fluid replacement on a sub-two hour ride. Just eat 'something' before you go out and maybe take a bottle with you. The rest is up to you and your legs - not your diet.

I sometimes get back from a two-hour ride to realise that I haven't even lifted my bottle out of its cage - its all about what you are used to...

Brian B

Gav888 wrote:

Hi,

There are alot of posts about regarding nutrition, but ive found nothing that lists what you should eat and when. Below is my plan, probably overkill for the distances im covering at the moment but your feedback would be good.

At present I can ride 12 miles in 1hr, which is approx 12 mph ave, slow I know, but im working on it. I could have kept going for longer as my legs where fine and I felt like I had a good level of energy, but I got bad cramps in my calf's and had to stop.... So the below plan is based on getting a good amount of carbs to fuel me through the ride and some caffiene which always helps and the salt in the drink and a banana are to help avoid the cramps.

This is for a 2hr bike ride, which is my current goal, any shorter or longer and I will adjust what I take with me but keep the before and after the same.....


1.5 to 2hrs before ride

Porridge with choc powder and skimmed milk or rice pudding with choc powder and a glass of skimmed milk


1hr before ride

Drink 250ml of orange juice or coke with a pinch of salt


Before leaving the house

Banana, 2 caffiene tablets, 250ml of orange juice or coke with a pinch of salt


During

500ml of coke diluted 2/3rds or orange juice diluted 2/3rds or water with normal fruit flavor cordial, with a pinch of salt drinking a bit every 15/20min.
Banana at 45 min
Energy bar at 1hr 30


After

500ml of choc protein shake made with semi skimmed milk
Go-ahead bar

Any feed back / adjustments would be great. As mentioned I cannot do 2hrs at present but im sure I can if my legs dont cramp again....

Another thing while I think of it, I dont really sweat out on a bike run, but I can do an hour on the exercise bike at a med level sweating buckets and not get cramp or even a hint of them?

Thanks

This seems a bit much for a two hour ride. A two hour ride and I dont even eat anything different to what i would eat when not riding and would perhaps fling a banana in my pocket to eat at the most.

Dont think the cramps are anything to do with salts in you case but perhaps you are trying too high an intensity. I know you said your average was 12mph but dont focus on speed and listen to how you feel when your riding. I only start worrying about cramps if I dont drink right during 100mile plus rides or sportives.

Exercise bikes are nothing like riding on the road when dealing with hills etc and much more demanding and you may be sweating but not just realise how much. I dont know your fitness or background but I think you should just relax and enjoy at the moment and fitness/speed will come in time. Remember its still winter and come summer you can get more time to train.

Gav888

Thanks guys for all the advise, this is great, just what im looking for.

Alot of this does come from the fact that I work as an analyst and always over analyse, hence the feeding plan!! Alot of it come from reading websites about you should eat this, or eat this lot etc etc and it did get confusing, so I thought I would put down what I though, and I got it wrong, thankfully ive corrected that now and plan to have a good run out tomorrow and I wont be consuming anywhere near as much as I though.

At present im working on distance, I would like to be able to ride 30 miles comfortably, once I can achieve this I will work on making the 30 mile journey quicker. At present my speed is normally 15 mph on the flat, which is an effort, and pedalling max effort in the highest gear I can do 24mph.....

I thought the caffiene would help on the ride, not being a coffee / tea / coke drinker I thought it would help me ride better whilst im building to my current goal, then once I can get there, stop using caffiene.

Coke on the ride would be flat, ive already de-fizzed a bottle to try it out, if it doesnt suit I will give energy drinks a go, or swap it for juice / water mix.

Although I could do with loosing a bit of fat, im not too worried, my goals are more important to me than loosing a bit of fat, that can always come later..... and regarding the salt, im worried my legs will cramp again when I get near an hour, and I dont want to be stuck miles from home with cramped legs. Is there anything I can do on the ride to help, or should it happen miles from home, what should I do?

RichA - I didnt realise the body had such a large store, 2,000+ Kcal is easy enough for a 2hr ride, and thanks for the diet plan. I will follow this going forward.

Thanks again everyone, I feel this will help me out no end with my riding....

r3 guy

Gav, for a 2 hour ride (especially in the morning), i dont eat anything....great for fat burning.

Did a 5 hour ride this morning this is what i had.

No breakfast

2 hours in - SIS gel

3 Hours in - Banana

4 Hours in - Egg bap bought from a cafe (mmmm!)

5 hours - Bowl of oats.

Everyone is different, i have fat to burn, if you dont then you will need to fuel more than me.

r3 guy

Gav, for a 2 hour ride (especially in the morning), i dont eat anything....great for fat burning.

Did a 5 hour ride this morning this is what i had.

No breakfast

2 hours in - SIS gel

3 Hours in - Banana

4 Hours in - Egg bap bought from a cafe (mmmm!)

5 hours - Bowl of oats.

Everyone is different, i have fat to burn, if you dont then you will need to fuel more than me.

softlad

must have been tricky eating a bowl of oats on the bike..?

nferrar

As others have said, way too much for a low intensity 2 hour ride. Just have the porridge a couple of hours before and take water on the bike (maybe with a Nuun tablet in it if you're getting cramp) and stick an energy gel in your pocket in case you blow

trickeyja

Seems a lot to be having just for a two hour ride, as others have mentioned.

I might bring a couple of bananas on a ride longer than 40 miles (2-2.5 hours) but any less than that and I'll just have a good meal/breakfast beforehand. On very long rides I'll bring a packed meal or buy something en route.

Gav888

Thanks again.

Any advise on what to do if your legs cramp miles from home?

softlad

depends how bad the cramp is. If it is bad, stop and rub (don't stretch) the affected area. Usually caused by a lack of sodium/potassium, so providing you are replacing these minerals, you might even be able to avoid it...

fuzzynavel

Just make sure you are well hydrated before the ride and maybe have a bar of chocolate/tablet etc incase you are struggling...you are only planning doing 24 miles (2 hours at 12mph average) I would guess that your intensity won't be that high at that speed so your body should have more than enough stored energy for that. Don't forget to take a water/juice bottle with you.

Gav888

Cheers, I did 15m in an hour yesterday, no cramps, then when I stopped at home, OMG how much pain was I in from cramps in my calfs.....

Reason was probably because I thought I drunk enough going round, taking some every 15m which for me is alot. When I measured it I only had 100ml!! :shock: Need to drink more I think....

monkeypoo

I've just started road cycling, i don't know much about nutrition, but i know that is overkill, This is what i'd go for.

1hr before ride

Bowl of Porridge , Tea , Bananananana


Before leaving the house

Pint of water


During

500ml of Isotonic drink mix, 750ml pure water , Bannana, Energy bar ( or flapjack )

After

Bacon Sarnie/ Bowl of pasta

That'd last me 35-40miles easily.

gkerr4

Gav888 wrote:

Cheers, I did 15m in an hour yesterday, no cramps, then when I stopped at home, OMG how much pain was I in from cramps in my calfs.....

Reason was probably because I thought I drunk enough going round, taking some every 15m which for me is alot. When I measured it I only had 100ml!! :shock: Need to drink more I think....

sorry - but I still think you are overanalyzing things - i often go for a 1hr+ "blast" on the fixie - i use it for interval training around town and in traffic I can usually get about 13miles or so - it's PROPER hard work.

I usually don't bother to take a bottle out with me let alone any pre-ride prep. I get in from work - the last I'll have eaten is an apple or piece of fruit around 3pm - having had a sandwich before that around noon. When I get back from the warm up on the fixed gear I do around 30minuted of weight training in my gym - squats, leg extensions, calf raises and some physio exercises i still do following knee surgery last year. I am drinking in the gym but I don't think too much about the ride .

If you are suffering from cramps then I would say it might come from your diet in general rather than any prep required. If you are following a healthy diet are you actually being 'too' healthy anc cutting too much salt out? - the obsession with reducing salt only really holds weight for your average couch potato - those of us who exercise and sweat need some salt in our diet.

fuzzynavel

gkerr4 wrote:

I usually don't bother to take a bottle out with me let alone any pre-ride prep. I get in from work - the last I'll have eaten is an apple or piece of fruit around 3pm - having had a sandwich before that around noon. When I get back from the warm up on the fixed gear I do around 30minuted of weight training in my gym - squats, leg extensions, calf raises and some physio exercises i still do following knee surgery last year. I am drinking in the gym but I don't think too much about the ride .

For my evening rides I am much the same as you....I eat up until about 4pm as normal and then have nothing apart from water/juice until 7pm when I go out. I take a bottle of water with me and then it is off for 17 miles and 1500ft of climbing taking about an hour...then back home for a shower and dinner...I don't do anything special to prepare for the shorter sub 40 mile rides.

SlightlyFuzzy

Ayup,

Erm, I'm not a nutritionist, sports scientist, or physio (etc, who may be able to offer more evidence-based advice)... but I'd ask whether your cramps may be due to your position on the bike?

How long have you been riding for, and how comfortable is your position for your legs? Too much or too little stretch can play havoc with your muscles if they aren't conditioned to it.... just a thought.

If you are new to riding for an hour or so then your legs may well cramp due to prolonged use, after all professional footballers still get cramp (apparently - okay they may just be putting it on!)

I'm still trying to find my own 'perfect fit' on the bike (after 3 months on this one) and I'm sure I'll forever be experimenting with what diet works best for me, but I'd certainly agree with the 'too much' opinions already offered regarding your initial diet plan.

I'd like to bulk up a bit, but I find that riding on a full stomach really doesn't agree with me. From what I have read it's more what you take in within 20 minutes of finishing exercise that matters more for recovery and muscle building anyway.... obviously you do need a certain 'store' of energy to use initially too, but surely we do usually have this available to us otherwise we'd all be crawling, half dead towards our cereal bowls in the mornings......?!

Happy hunting,

SF.

Gav888

Hi,

Posted this back in Jan and looking back I was consuming way too much food... thanks for all the advise at the time. But im wondering if I still am consuming too much, my riding has come on alot since then but im not sure about nutrition, ive still got this doubt that im having too much still?

On a recent 50 mile ride (which I completed in 3hrs 20, which was quick for me keeping up with the fast guys) I had a bowl of porridge at 7am, went out at 8am and had 3 x 500ml of Gatorade and a nutra-grain bar at half distance, felt ok going round and felt like I had more energy to keep going when I got home, but a couple of the guys were using water and having snacks as they went round, such as energy bars and banana's, and another guy said I should only need 2 x 500ml bottles of Gatorade and a snack to get round, did I have too much for the 50 mile ride?

My main concern is not getting enough or getting to much as both can cause you to have less energy and I want to make sure im getting the right amount....

John.T

I did the WRC 133K on Sunday. Breakfast one hour before, mug of coffee, glass of grapefruit juice and 4 slices of bread and spread. On the ride. 2 Go gels and 750ml Alsports winter training. Pasta as supplied at finish. Average riding speed 15mph. No sign of bonking or dehydration. No weight lost either.

bristolpete

This has been an amazing thread and perhaps testament to the science of road riding that can bamboozle the rider into submission and one has to consider that no two riders are the same....

I did 45 miles today - as I am off work I got up late, had a shower, drank a couple of pints of water through the morning, had beans on toast and then left. Stopped at 20 miles, munched a banana, drank all the way around. Got the train home and had a bottle of lucozade on the train then went for food at the Mud Dock in bristol, where I had pasta.....

But, I think the OP has a definite point in that this is still such a grey area for many new road riders, myself included, despite not being overly new to it. I simple list would be ideal, what to eat before, during and after. I for one would have always said that a banana is ideal before but after reading this, it seems a big no no.

Pete.

Garz

A sound breakfast is all you need when starting out. Granted when you are doing some serious mileage and fast paced 50 milers, however if your new to the road its more important to work on fitness/form and getting your bike setup proper before split nutrition planning.

Gav888

Just looking back on my original post... LOL oh dear, but I didnt know back then!!!

Joe86

One thing to consider in any nutritional plan, which I believe you are following from your porridge, is that before a ride you should be aiming to have low glycemic index (GI) foods. Not only does it help keep blood sugar levels more stable, there have been studies showing improved performance in several sports when athletes have eaten a low GI based breakfast or meal, when compared with a high GI food. Low GI foods will also make you feel less hungry during your training. Here are a few potential foods for you, http://www.the-gi-diet.org/lowgifoods/

Conversely, you should try and eat high GI foods immediately after exercise. This way you should have a better chance of replenishing glycogen, as glycogen synthesis declines if you don't consume within 1-2 hours at the most after exercise. I would also recommend a salty snack after exercise, as well as high GI foods.

As for beverages, you have three types that you could have depending on the timing. Firstly, because you are going for low GI foods before training, you should try to consume a hypotonic beverage of about 1-2% carbohydrate. If you consume 6-18% which several istonic or hypertonic drinks provide, the effect of a low GI meal may be negated. So either water or something like the hypotonic lucozade is best before exercise.

During exercise, 6% is generally the concentration you would want. It has been found to be best, as gastric emptying will be not be able to meet the high concentration beverages. So one of the general lucozade isotonic or powerade beverages would be ideal during exercise. After exercise you need to get the sugars back in asap, so you should go for a high energy drink such as the hypertonic energy lucozade drinks.

You can alternatively water down some of the beverages you have to meet the requirements, because if we are being honest the lucozade and other beverages are expensive for a small quantity.

If you have anything else to ask, just let me know, I hope I was able to give you some info that would have helped.

fungus_the_muffin_man

Gav888 wrote:

Just looking back on my original post... LOL oh dear, but I didnt know back then!!!

out of interest where are you up to now with your mileage, fluid/food intake? Have you seen any benefits from modifying your pre,during and post diet intake?