Hmm. I dont mean to offend anyone but.......

Mr Wu

Ive got a bit of a gripe and need some more advice,

On a daily basis to get to work I have to cross a park, of which I cycle on the gravel paths along with other bike riders, now on several occasions ive come accross the ultra brave ankle biter, running at break neck speed either after me or towards me, now its fair to say that im a very big bloke, (i.e rugby player) I've tried both methods, slowing down and hoping the said mutt would lose interest in a moving object, which resulted in it biting my leg and ripping my trousers, also speeding up and out running the idiotic dog. This has how got to the point where im having to do this every single morning on my way to work. The other day I was cycling along and what can only be described as a rocket dog came sprinting over to me, I saw this from a distance and shouted to the owner to call it back, he never and the dog proceeded on course, upon reaching my pedals it took an almighty big swipe at my moving legs and feet, (I use SPD's too so you can imagine my initial thought of this dog bringing me off my bike) of which i took a mighty sweep at its gaping mouth, the rest they say is history.

Can anybody tell me what they do in situations like this as its begingin to get on my t*ts now and i feel all bad for dogs that no no better. As I see it if the dog bites me or goes to bite me then its fair game for my size 12's as if it draws blood from me then it would be put down anyway as the owner clearly doedsnt have control over it. What if i were a child riding my bike down the same path at similar slow speed?

Now before you get all defensive, I own a dog myself, believe it or not i opted for a whippet, when i take my dog to the park i walk her on the grass, well away from everything and if i so much as hear a chain clunking ill put her on her lead so she doesnt become a new addition to an XTR chainset.

If i were to take another route to work it would add considerable time to my journey, that and the fact that i should be able to cycle through the park without fear of being bitten. Ive actually gone down the park in the morning and tried speaking to the dog owners, most responces ive gotten are telling me to f.off and the such, all of which add's fuel to my fire.

Ideas please.

BorisSpencer

Ride across the park, and kick the owner.

Mr Wu

I tell you what, its nearly come to that, I actually did go down one morning on foot and spoke to some of them politely and just asked them to keep the dog on a lead if its prone to chasing people. One guy got very aggressive and defensive, and had I not been on my way to work I wouldve probably levelled him for being a di*k.

Mr Wu

Just been having a look on the internet about my issue, apparently there is a product called HALT, anybody ever tried it? Does it work or should I stick with Mace? ;-)

stubs

Last time a dog went for me I rode at the f**cking shi*ehound and ran over it unfortunately it survived :x Oh well better luck next time

Johnny Napalm

If it comes down to kicking the dog in the face (or something a little more extreme) or getting bitten...I think there's only one answer. I agree, a lot of dog owners are arseholes...for this reason, and many others. Hey, who doesn't love riding through/walking in dog shit!

I once got bitten on my side by a huge German Shepherd guard dog (from a scrap yard), that the owner saw fit to walk, without a leash, on a public walkway/cycle path. It happened so quick, I didn't have a chance. The hospital said that I was lucky I didn't end up with a punctured lung. Still got the scar.

I used to cycle along there twice a day (to and from work), and there was always families with little kids on bikes etc. I dread to think what damage that thing would've done to a kid on a bike.

That said, I reported him to the police, and needless to say I never saw that dog in the scrap yard ever again. Hopefully, it got the ol' needle. Pity you can't also do that to some of the owners!

Mr Wu

Is there any law that prohibits us good lot from rearranging troublesum dogs faces?

-liam-

I'm not scared of dogs and neither am I shy about upsetting owners. Being that I'd prefer not to give the dog the chance to bite me and as, in my view they are less likely to if they'd prefer not to come near me, I've been happy on two occasions in the last couple of years to kick the dog in the head if it appears to want to get arsey with me for some reason...1st of these occasions I had my kids with me and the mutt in question wanted to have ago at my little lad. The dog was not on a lead and my lad grabbed the fur on its back. It went for my lad and it got a bloody nose for its trouble. The owner wanted to get a little agro, which I wasn't interested in, as I said I had my 3 kids with me. I just asked him if he wished to get the police involved, at first he said yes as he wanted to charge me with "assaulting his dog" but he calmed down abit as I went to dial 999 on my phone.

I understand that owners want to let their dogs loose when walking, however in my view, if they come to any harm when doing so it is their own faults, just as they are held responsible when the dog bites someone.

Mr Wu

Glad someones on the same wavelength as me!

I do try and use it as a last resort, but if its a choice of me coming off my bike, costing me loads of money to repair bits, trip to the hospital etc or the dog getting , you can put your life on it that I will always choose the latter. What pishes me off is when the owner then starts giving you hassle like its your fault the their dog chased and tired to bite you!

Id just like to know where I stand should the police get involved, I would quite happily fight my corner as all im doing is cycling to and from places, I didnt ask for any bother. I certainly hope that they would do something to the owner and the dog. I can take getting bitten, a child most probably couldnt thats the way i see it, and if its ok to put a dog down when it bites a child then the same rules should apply for adults.

cougie

Honestly cant remember the last problem i had with a dog ? I also do a lot of running and come across stacks of dogs - worst thing they do is get in the way. A lot of then want to just say hello - but its hard to judge what they want at a distance. I think i would get off the bike and keep the bike between you and the dog - try that before kicking it - that could take you to court ?

strodey

The problem wih dogs is they dont learn the first time.

You better kick it more than once.

Mr Wu

cougie wrote:

Honestly cant remember the last problem i had with a dog ? I also do a lot of running and come across stacks of dogs - worst thing they do is get in the way. A lot of then want to just say hello - but its hard to judge what they want at a distance. I think i would get off the bike and keep the bike between you and the dog - try that before kicking it - that could take you to court ?

On a serious note, I do actually have public liability insurance for me and my bike, you think that will cover me?!

cougie

Dont think so - you're talking of a potentially criminal act ?

Its a bit like punching some bloke as he runs up to you in the street - is he asking you for help or gonna mug you ? I think you at least have to make some effort to find out ?

Hope you can resolve the conflict peacefully anyway. I know there are some mad dogs out there - but the odds are that its one of the 99+% that want to play ?

chuck75

I'm a animal lover but have had my fair few experiences of suddenly realising a dog is chasing me from the time I was a kid delivering papers to now when I go training through lanes and find someone has left their dog to roam wherever it likes and to scare people half to death!

As I said I love animals – in particular dogs but I would suggest either trying to out sprint the things (which is excellent training) or taking a good boot at it and shouting at both the dog and the owner – it sounds like you’ve been very understanding already. Don’t forget when you do boot the thing don’t stop but continue riding – overtime these irresponsible dog owners will realise they need to do something about their behaviour and lack of thoughtfulness. It may be an idea to take notes each day of the description of the dog and the owner if you see them.

allthegearnoidea

i've always had a minor fear fo dogs ever since i got bitten on the 4rse by a collie dog that wanted to play football with a load of us,
not being one to willingly hurt an animal as such and not knowing anyone like that (and am pretty sure no one on here is either!) i have to say if it were a situation of either me falling off and hurting myself or booting the mut int he chops then for me the dog would get it!

but that said, all the dog owners i come across down here are generally good as gold! allways polite and controlled over the dogs,

the only time i have ever come close was a while back when giving it some beans down the old mineral tramway when a little white yappy dog shot out from under a gate and into the path of the runner coming the other way! que emergency stop from me to take avoiding action of both, runner stopped and gave the young girl owner some grief about it, understandably!!
as it happens i now know the lass through a local toddler group and can honestly say she has little control over the child so the dog was really no suprise now!!!

that said another mum has 14 dogs (breader) and they are all good as gold! even the boysterous Newfy! but her husband rides so they are used to it! (he has said much the same though about dogs whilst riding!)

Tank-slapper

This seems good advice:

http://www.kenkifer.com/bikepages/traffic/dogs.htm

Mr Wu

cougie wrote:

Dont think so - you're talking of a potentially criminal act ?

Its a bit like punching some bloke as he runs up to you in the street - is he asking you for help or gonna mug you ? I think you at least have to make some effort to find out ?

Hope you can resolve the conflict peacefully anyway. I know there are some mad dogs out there - but the odds are that its one of the 99+% that want to play ?

You see this is the bit where im having a problem, is it a criminal act? The act of me defending myself from a dog attacking me? Surely the dog attacking me is a criminal act? That is why I said above that if the dog shows me teeth then I show it the imprint of my boots. If a dog mearly chases me then i will slow down till it gets bored. My issue is when they try and bite you, it is honestly no exageration when i say that it happens at least once a day and i for one am worried that if its happening to me as a fully grown man then it will happen to a child who wont have the befit of quick responce and defense skills.

I think the example of a bloke running upto me in the street is largely different, as you wouldnt normally expect a bloke to try and take you off your bike, not that ive ever come across, besides which you could out pace him, dogs are quicker and have more stamina.

I would like to sort this out with my local dog walkers but when their backs go up as soon as i mention putting dogs on leads I fear its falling on deaf ears.

redvee

Isn't a park a public place and shouldn't dogs be kept under control in public places. Letting them roam free isn't under control, yes there are dogs that will be free and trot along beside/nearby their owner and come to heal when called but there is always those that spoil it for other and give the good dogwalkers a bad name as there are with cyclists.

Report the issues of chasing and out of control dogs to the local council and they should get the dog warden down there to monitor the situation and have words with the owners.

cougie

Its hard to call really - but you could be asked to defend your actions in court - and how can you prove the dog is out to bite you ? Can the dog really be that dangerous ? Isnt it two bites and its put down - so it prob hasnt much of a history. What dog is it ? If its a big one - then i can see why you are a bit reluctant to stop !

Spider987

I own a dog and i can honestly say that if my dog tried biting you. You may kick it.
At the end of the day i care about a human more than a dog.

I remember when we used to walk hounds. We had a whip to keep them in place, so if they ever tired it on with a horse they got one!

counterculture

if you want to try a technique Dog Borstal would be proud of:

take your water bottle, and when it starts to chase you, let it get close then splash it in the face and shout NO!!. The dog wont like being splashed and after maybe 2 instances the chasing should stop.

Failing that Kick it!!!

davomrmac

I think it should be the owners responsibility to keep it on a lead.

I have kids and hate it on the beech when dogs are running around... you can never trust them.

downfader

Have had 7 dogs in one year go for me seriously. I was out doing photography on a couple of those occassions and so had a big tripod to put inbetween me and the animal. One time I had lost me voice ad was walking with two boxes in me arms of christmas presents, this labrador went for me - it had been left on its own in a front garden and began snapping at my legs. I ended up dancing in the road trying to fend it off. :x

I have said before and I'll reitterate - all dogs in public places should be muzzled and on a leash. In the states they have this law - even in parks, so why not here. If you want to play ball, get a garden. :?

Perhaps we should all write to our MPs?

Mr Wu

cougie wrote:

Its hard to call really - but you could be asked to defend your actions in court - and how can you prove the dog is out to bite you ? Can the dog really be that dangerous ? Isnt it two bites and its put down - so it prob hasnt much of a history. What dog is it ? If its a big one - then i can see why you are a bit reluctant to stop !

I dont think any dog specifically sets out to bite me on my way to work, i think its just natural for them to chase moving objects, just as its natural that I get the urge to kick them when they run at my pedals snapping away at my ankles. Not sure how many bites it is before they put them down. Also, it isnt a spcific dog, there are quite a few of them that walk round with their owners (about 5/6 owners, and at least 6 dogs) trouble is when one runs at you they all do, which can sometimes leave you looking like bruce lee fending off unruly teeth. If my dog was to go for someone whilst cycling, id fully expect her to take a shoe in the mush. Hence I keep her on her lead, she still gets a walk/run everyones happy.

-liam-

downfader wrote:

Perhaps we should all write to our MPs?

Good thinking Batman, however I fear they are far to busy discussing Jonathon Ross/Russell Brand and x factor to implement laws that may at some point in any of our lives, perhaps save any of our children from serious injury....(and my ankle from being chewed )

gillyboc

I like dogs & mountain biking ,i don't think any responsible dog owner would mind someone defending themselves if there dog attacked someone, but as a dog owner i wouldn't be very happy with someone being aggressive if my dog only went to say hello,
its seems a bit anti dog ,when lets face it 9/10 times its the owner.
gilly,

getdownmonkeyman

Electronic intervention?:

http://www.maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx?Mod ... &U=strat15

-liam-

getdownmonkeyman wrote:

Electronic intervention?:

http://www.maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx?Mod ... &U=strat15

What ? Like a tazer ? yeah man !!

tlw1

Owners responsibility - simple as that.

To be honest I am sick and tired of stupid owners with dogs to match who think its ok for them to bound up to you & your kids. They always shout "its ok he likes kids", well that realy helps if my kids don't like dogs!

dave_hill

Mr Wu wrote:

You see this is the bit where im having a problem, is it a criminal act? The act of me defending myself from a dog attacking me? Surely the dog attacking me is a criminal act?

The Dogs Act of 1873 makes it a criminal offence for the owner of a dog to "attack, or cause apprehension of an attack" by their dog.

Similarly, the same act also demands that owners must keep their animals under control. It also allows that you are allowed to use "reasonable force" to defend yourself.

The problem is that the Act does not give a definition of what "under control" is, or what "reasonable force" is. "Under control" is not the same as "on a lead" - the owner could claim that the dog is under voice control.

Similarly, you might consider throttling the dog or giving it a good kicking to be "reasonable force" - the Magistrate might not.

The Dangerous Dogs Act of 1991 prohibits the ownership of some breeds and also makes it necessary that some breeds (including, but not limited to Rottweilers, English Bull Terriers, Tosa Inu, etc.) are on a lead and muzzled at all times when in public. Breach of this act is a very serious offence and is usually dealt with pretty harshly, including having the dog destroyed if it has attacked someone.

There is a simple answer to this as you clearly have a serious problem - the next time it happens, make a note of the time, date and location; get a good description of the dog and it's owner; and then report it to the police. And keep on reporting it until the police are so fed up with it that they do something about it.

It's the only legitimate way forward. Taking the law into your own hands MAY feel good at the time but it can lead to all sorts of complications.

For the record, I am a dog-owner - I have greyhounds which are re-homed from a refuge for retired (for which read abused) racing dogs. My lads are NEVER off the lead in public. Mind you, they're too lazy to chase anything!!

uk_mr_brownstone

gillyboc wrote:

I like dogs & mountain biking ,i don't think any responsible dog owner would mind someone defending themselves if there dog attacked someone, but as a dog owner i wouldn't be very happy with someone being aggressive if my dog only went to say hello,
its seems a bit anti dog ,when lets face it 9/10 times its the owner.
gilly,

Totally agree

Most dogs would probably just be overexcited at the spinning legs and shiney crank arms! I wouldn't kick out at a dog unless it was clearly trying to bite me.