This is why we're in a crisis: Tour de Georgia...

donrhummy

The state of georgia has announced that givent he economic crisis they're not running the TDG next year. Sounds like a smart decision, no? I mean it cost them $1,000,000 last year to put on (that's about 500,000 pounds), so they're saving all that money - good for their economy.

Um...actually they're idiots and doing it all backward.

While it DID cost them $1 million, it generated $38.6 million in business last year! Apparently, the economy of Georgia's better off with $1 million than 37 or so of them. :roll:

"Over the course of six years, the Tour de Georgia has attracted 3.2 million spectators, many of whom traveled to Georgia from out of state, and generated a direct economic impact totaling over $186 million. The 2008 Tour de Georgia, our most successful Tour yet, yielded over $38.6 million in direct economic impact for the State,"

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news.php?id= ... nov14news3

No wonder pro-cycling can't get off the ground in the U.S. It's apparently making too much money and screwing the economy up.

blazing_saddles

I wonder what Dennis thinks?

King Midas fails to breathe life into this ailing race.....fancy riding that pesky Giro.
Another major pro race bites the dust. Fewer US continental teams, next season.
Crisis, what crisis?

I can't see the Tour of American getting off the ground, under any format.

OllyBianchi

It's all to do with liquidity - the state of Georgia may love to earn millions of dollars from getting tourists in to watch the race, but it hasn't got $1m in cash to fund the race. Many American state haves been dabbling in the credit markets and the collapse of the housing market has taken a lot of revenue away. A state or two will go bankrupt during 2009...

meagain

Two issues overlooked I think!
1. For the STATE to be seen spending such an amount might simply be "bad" politics/PR: the electorate will see only the headline spend figure.
2. How much of the 38.6m ends up in STATE coffers? That's the sum that the Treasury has to do.

Also, I have seen (and indeed *devised* for political consumption) many estimtes of "economic impact" resulting from so called investment. The "direct" impacts/outcomes are at best doubtful and the "indirect" usually laughable!

calvjones

meagain wrote:

Two issues overlooked I think!
1. For the STATE to be seen spending such an amount might simply be "bad" politics/PR: the electorate will see only the headline spend figure.
2. How much of the 38.6m ends up in STATE coffers? That's the sum that the Treasury has to do.

Also, I have seen (and indeed *devised* for political consumption) many estimtes of "economic impact" resulting from so called investment. The "direct" impacts/outcomes are at best doubtful and the "indirect" usually laughable!

I spend my professional life doing this and unfortunately most economic impact assessments rival the pro peloton for integrity & honesty.

calvjones

Except mine, clearly

LangerDan

Same situation in Ireland less than a decade ago when Pat McQuaid went looking for a government grant to host the Worlds in Killarney, citing the massive cash benefits. If these things are such great revenue generators, why don't the hotel operators, travel agents, merchandisers etc.stump up the seed capital? At current rates it would be a far better return than having your cash under the mattress.
(Local) government holding the risk, private busines reaping the gains. I'm sure I heard of that again recently.......

meagain

"most economic impact assessments rival the pro peloton for integrity & honesty."

What an apt - and accurate - comparison!

chuckcork

LangerDan wrote:

Same situation in Ireland less than a decade ago when Pat McQuaid went looking for a government grant to host the Worlds in Killarney, citing the massive cash benefits. If these things are such great revenue generators, why don't the hotel operators, travel agents, merchandisers etc.stump up the seed capital? At current rates it would be a far better return than having your cash under the mattress.
(Local) government holding the risk, private busines reaping the gains. I'm sure I heard of that again recently.......

I think the statement is 'privatised profit, socialised risk'.

No reason why a local chamber of commerce wouldn't support an event though?

blazing_saddles

According to the BBC, :roll: the organisers have only cancelled for this season and are preparing to re-start in 2010.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/other_s ... 730361.stm
Same as the Tour of Aragon, then. :oops:

iainf72

Blazing Saddles wrote:

Same as the Tour of Aragon, then. :oops:

And Zurich. Although they reckon it'll be back next year.

Georgia has been in trouble for a few years now. As I recall, the 08 version nearly didn't happen. How many other planned multiday races have been canned in North America. I can think of 2 or 3 this year alone.

afx237vi

It's not all doom and gloom. Doesn't the Tour of America start next year? :twisted:

GroupOfOne MkII

iainf72 wrote:

Blazing Saddles wrote:

Same as the Tour of Aragon, then. :oops:

And Zurich. Although they reckon it'll be back next year.

And the Niedersachen Rundfahrt, not on again in '09.

dennisn

Blazing Saddles wrote:

I wonder what Dennis thinks?

King Midas fails to breathe life into this ailing race.....fancy riding that pesky Giro.
Another major pro race bites the dust. Fewer US continental teams, next season.
Crisis, what crisis?

I can't see the Tour of American getting off the ground, under any format.

Didn't they say they would be back in 09?? I have to say that I can't imagine the amount
of work and planning that must go into one of these big stage races. I'm the Race Director
of our local club and we race every Thursday night April thru September. Crits, time trials, things like that and the amount of effort to get even these little local races up
and running is not the easiest thing in the world. I don't know what went on down in Georgia but "they" must have had their reasons and "they" did say that it would return in 09. Like most big races, the people who do the actual work to make them come to life have my admiration. Seems like the races themselves and the riders are secondary to the
behind the scenes details.

Dennis Noward

blazing_saddles

Yes, it will be back for you in 2009, Dennis.
For the rest of us, it will be back in 2010, with the finances hopefully all tied down.
Btw: What's it like living in that time warp?

dennisn

Blazing Saddles wrote:

Yes, it will be back for you in 2009, Dennis.
For the rest of us, it will be back in 2010, with the finances hopefully all tied down.
Btw: What's it like living in that time warp?

You're right, got my years all screwed up. It's hell getting old and you don't remember what year it is. :oops: :oops: According to most people I do live in a time warp with my lugged steel Gios and it's chromed fork. It's about 5 years old and I am considering
actually joining the real world with a, dare I say it, carbon or titanium frame and
electronic DA. All this hinging on whether I can get a 3rd. and 4th. mortgage on the house.

Dennis Noward

blazing_saddles

Gios have "Cred"
What does a new carbon cost, US? $7-8,000?
If you do decide to join the 21st century, don't go typically Trek.
Try these:-
http://www.trialtir-usa.com/2009-derosa/derosa-mp.htm

dennisn

Blazing Saddles wrote:

Gios have "Cred"
What does a new carbon cost, US? $7-8,000?
If you do decide to join the 21st century, don't go typically Trek.
Try these:-
http://www.trialtir-usa.com/2009-derosa/derosa-mp.htm

Not sure I'm cool enough to ride a Derosa. New carbon over here? You can get a top line
Look, Cevelo, carbon frame and fork for $4000 US give or take, depending on if it's the very latest or simply the latest. Can't even begin to compute the cost of DA electronic
into this equation so if I go electric it may have to be on my steel Gios for a while. The irony of something like this, however, is not lost on me.

Dennis Noward

dennisn

Your title just sort of struck me the other day "This is why we're in a crisis - Tour de Georgia". " WE'RE in a crisis". I'm not in any crisis and don't know anyone else who is because they stopped it for a year. How about the rest of you out there? Are any of you in crisis mode because of this? Maybe I should be in a crisis and don't even know it(I'm
not the brightest bulb in the closet). Please tell me how I should be reacting to the above crisis. Should I panic and run screaming down the streets, yelling something akin to "the
sky is falling" or should I be digging a fallout shelter(of sorts). I guess I'm just no good in crisis situations. I certainly hope you're OK over there. Hopefully this terrible crisis will pass
and you will be able to resume a somewhat normal life very soon.

Dennis Noward

blazing_saddles

Dennis: You must be in some sort of a crisis to want to dig up this old debate!
How about the current World economic crisis?
If we weren't in recession, could you go for that carbon fibre number?

We not I. The collective, not the individual.

Hope it's not a lack of debate on here, crisis.

DaveyL

dennisn wrote:

Your title just sort of struck me the other day "This is why we're in a crisis - Tour de Georgia". " WE'RE in a crisis". I'm not in any crisis and don't know anyone else who is because they stopped it for a year. How about the rest of you out there? Are any of you in crisis mode because of this? Maybe I should be in a crisis and don't even know it(I'm
not the brightest bulb in the closet). Please tell me how I should be reacting to the above crisis. Should I panic and run screaming down the streets, yelling something akin to "the
sky is falling" or should I be digging a fallout shelter(of sorts). I guess I'm just no good in crisis situations. I certainly hope you're OK over there. Hopefully this terrible crisis will pass
and you will be able to resume a somewhat normal life very soon.

Dennis Noward

I believe the "we" refers to the community that is made up of pro cycling and its fans. Dennis you have already stated you don't care much for pro cycling which I guess means you are immune to this crisis. It also makes me wonder why you frequent the "Race" section, other than for trolling purposes.

dennisn

Blazing Saddles wrote:

Dennis: You must be in some sort of a crisis to want to dig up this old debate!
How about the current World economic crisis?
If we weren't in recession, could you go for that carbon fibre number?

We not I. The collective, not the individual.

Hope it's not a lack of debate on here, crisis.

Really not sure if I'm carbon fiber material. I like to do my own wrenching on my bike and
I'm not really the gentlest of wrench turners. So metal seems to be the way go. A little chipped paint has never bothered me. To be perfectly honest I just can't seem to bring myself to spend mega money on a frame when a decent steely will get me where I want to go. I do spend a fair amount of money on wheels, tires, components, clothes and the like. I'm just not a carbon fan. I recently took the Easton EC90 seat post off my bike and
replaced it with a metal Thomson. I got a little paranoid with it because 3 of my friends have actually broken carbon posts. Am still thinking about DA electronic as a 60th birthday
present to myself(I know, Oh the irony of DA electric on a steel bike). A few years back I was considering a Scandium(spelling?) frame, but, for whatever reason, these seem to
have fallen from favor. Titanium sounds good also but it would have to be painted as
I don't really think that just bare titanium looks that good. Sort of plain you know. My 5
year old blue steel Gios seems to attract more attention than my riding buddies new
titanium Seven. Possibly because no one can believe that anyone still rides one or worse,
they don't know what it is or maybe it's because it's shiner and more colorful than his.
Yeah, I know, but I gotta have a bit of bling in my life too. Anyway I'm rambling on and it's about time to get my *ss in gear and hit the road for a couple of hours of riding. A strange break in the weather looks to allow me a bit of a rare window to do it and I'm already sick
of the basement trainer.

Dennis Noward