Boris and Bendies

prj45

I'm actually quite angry about this.

Before the election Boris was putting about the idea that "bendy buses kill many cyclists each year".

He's now answered a question asking exactly how many cyclists have been killed by bendies, and it's a big fat zero.

At the same time though he stated that he wants to get rid of bendies because they contribute to the perception that cycling is unsafe.

Said the man who fu****g said "bendy buses kill many cyclists each year" when it wasn't true!

Remind me, what is contributing to the perception that cycling is unsafe, bendy buses or BORIS JOHNSON?

Caroline Pidgeon AM wrote:

Question: How many fatal and serious accidents involving cyclists and “bendy buses” have there been each year since these vehicles were introduced?

Boris Johnson wrote:

I am informed that, thankfully, there have been no fatal accidents arising from collisions between cyclists and articulated buses in London since the introduction of articulated vehicles. However, this does not weaken the case for their removal. The perception of safety is an important element in whether people decide to cycle or not. The bottom line is bendy buses contribute to the perception that cycling is unsafe, and it is my intention to correct this perception in order to get more people cycling.

Serious incidents are defined by TfL as those where a cyclist may have required treatment, including in hospital. There was one serious incident involving a cyclist in each of the years 2005/06 and 2006/07, and two in 2007/08.

londonlivvy

I just don't buy that statistic, sorry. ONE, per year??? REALLY?

Maybe with a bit of research on here we'll find out. A friend from EMAP got swiped in 2005 and spent three months in hospital.

Anyone else know anyone who got chomped by a bendy bus?

*I feel sure it's bad internet mojo to mention company names but how else are we to ensure we aren't double-counting?

The Chingford Skinhead

prj45 wrote:

I'm actually quite angry about this.

Before the election Boris was putting about the idea that "bendy buses kill many cyclists each year".

He's now answered a question asking exactly how many cyclists have been killed by bendies, and it's a big fat zero.

At the same time though he stated that he wants to get rid of bendies because they contribute to the perception that cycling is unsafe.

Said the man who fu****g said "bendy buses kill many cyclists each year" when it wasn't true!

Remind me, what is contributing to the perception that cycling is unsafe, bendy buses or BORIS JOHNSON?

Caroline Pidgeon AM wrote:

Question: How many fatal and serious accidents involving cyclists and “bendy buses” have there been each year since these vehicles were introduced?

Boris Johnson wrote:

I am informed that, thankfully, there have been no fatal accidents arising from collisions between cyclists and articulated buses in London since the introduction of articulated vehicles. However, this does not weaken the case for their removal. The perception of safety is an important element in whether people decide to cycle or not. The bottom line is bendy buses contribute to the perception that cycling is unsafe, and it is my intention to correct this perception in order to get more people cycling.

Serious incidents are defined by TfL as those where a cyclist may have required treatment, including in hospital. There was one serious incident involving a cyclist in each of the years 2005/06 and 2006/07, and two in 2007/08.

So, let me get this right :? Boris says
"However, this does not weaken the case for their removal. The perception of safety is an important element in whether people decide to cycle or not. The bottom line is bendy buses contribute to the perception that cycling is unsafe, and it is my intention to correct this perception in order to get more people cycling. "

If he meant what he said (he doesn't) then his "intention to correct the perception" would mean declaring that he got it very wrong. What he is saying is that perception of danger is important regardless of stats and if something is therefore perceived to be unsafe by people who would cycle then it is out. This having just announced that he will allow motorbikes in bus lanes. I'm not saying whether the stats on this are for or against, I'm merely pointing out that the perception is that motorcycles in bus lanes are dangerous and will put people off cycling" Don't you just love the double-standards of politicians? :evil:

prj45

I remember thinking at the time that Johnson was just making it up, if they were killing many cyclists each year then I'm sure there would have been a massive hoo haa.

Now, we do know what types of vehicles ARE involved in the death of many cyclists every year.

What's he doing about that?

prj45

The Chingford Skinhead wrote:

I'm merely pointing out that the perception is that motorcycles in bus lanes are dangerous and will put people off cycling" Don't you just love the double-standards of politicians? :evil:

Good point.

On that one I'm really angry because the two groups he chose not to consult with were one's which represented cyclists (in London's case the LCC surely) or pedestrians (I presume there is such a group).

The Chingford Skinhead

prj45 wrote:

I remember thinking at the time that Johnson was just making it up, if they were killing many cyclists each year then I'm sure there would have been a massive hoo haa.

Now, we do know what types of vehicles ARE involved in the death of many cyclists every year.

What's he doing about that?

HGVs - but as business bankrolls his office don't expect any change any time soon

I don't know how many accidents involved mini-cabs with the blue tfl roundel but I've rarely seen one that looks like the driver passed a driving test :x :evil:

Jay dubbleU

Am I being a cynic here guys, or could it be that Boris is drawing attention to bendy buses to take it off HGVs?

biondino

Am I being a cynic here, but is Boris a vastly out-of-his-depth unqualified tory c*** of the highest order?

spen666

prj45 wrote:

The Chingford Skinhead wrote:

I'm merely pointing out that the perception is that motorcycles in bus lanes are dangerous and will put people off cycling" Don't you just love the double-standards of politicians? :evil:

Good point.

On that one I'm really angry because the two groups he chose not to consult with were one's which represented cyclists (in London's case the LCC surely) or pedestrians (I presume there is such a group).

What is the relevance of consulting pedestrians re allowing motorcycles in bus lanes?

I understand the need to consult cycling groups, but why pedestrians?

chuckcork

biondino wrote:

Am I being a cynic here, but is Boris a vastly out-of-his-depth unqualified tory c*** of the highest order?

Since when was being qualified in anything a prerequisite for high public office? Look at Blair, not particularly skilled at anything other than lying with a straight face.

It would seem being a c*** of any flavour is more the requirement, which I don't doubt puts people who aren't off the idea of getting into politics in the first place. We're all the poorer for it.

Jen J

Am I being a cynic here, but do I detect a hint of animosity towards BoJo?

biondino

Just a hint! At least I've calmed down after the realisation that loads of otherwise sane Londoners actually voted for the tool.

(and anyone who thinks "but he's funny/cuddly/a breath of fresh air" should remember he's neither a comedian, a kitten or a f*cking wind farm. He's in charge of spending many billion quid that you've given him. Regretting it yet?)

cjcp

spen666 wrote:

prj45 wrote:

The Chingford Skinhead wrote:

I'm merely pointing out that the perception is that motorcycles in bus lanes are dangerous and will put people off cycling" Don't you just love the double-standards of politicians? :evil:

Good point.

On that one I'm really angry because the two groups he chose not to consult with were one's which represented cyclists (in London's case the LCC surely) or pedestrians (I presume there is such a group).

What is the relevance of consulting pedestrians re allowing motorcycles in bus lanes?

I understand the need to consult cycling groups, but why pedestrians?

The peds step out into the bus lanes and they like to know how many forms of transport they need to dodge or, if you're arrogant/don't care, how many they expect to stop for them.

Littigator

biondino wrote:

Am I being a cynic here, but is Boris a vastly out-of-his-depth unqualified tory c*** of the highest order?

Still not as bad as the bolshevik f***wit who put them there in the first place!

lost_in_thought

Seems a little odd that there is only one per year, as Londonlivvy says. Methinks the statistics may be a little skewed here - how about something on serious injury?

I hope this doesn't stop him on his campaign to remove them.

Or even just retrain the drivers - a previous thread on this had a poster suggest that the warning about the length of the bus be stuck somewhere the driver can see it....

secretsam

Jen J wrote:

Am I being a cynic here, but do I detect a hint of animosity towards BoJo?

Yes, because he's a f&ckwit. A perilous example of what happens when personality politics takes hold.

Back to the buses - frankly, they're a nightmare. They are not suited to London (although work well in other cities) due to the number of small roads and sharp corners.

2 good examples:
1. Outside Marylebone station, bus often has to cross into opposite lane when turning into the road that runs in front of the station. It's no fun on a bike to be riding merrily along and have a bus suddenly heading towards you on the wrong side of the road
2. Junction of Clerkenwell road and Rosebery Ave - there are lights controlling access from left of traffic onto Clerkenwell Road, and buses often run a yellow from the side road (Rosebery), leaving them stranded across the junction as the lights on the Clerkenwell road turn green. Result? traffic backs up until the bus can move.

I hate the damn things. :evil:

prj45

lost_in_thought wrote:

I hope this doesn't stop him on his campaign to remove them.

All indications are it will cost a lot more to run the service with normal double deckers than bendy buses.

If Boris is removing the bendies because he feels they scare cyclists wouldn't the money be better spent somewhere else, like ridding the roads of raised ironworks, or legislation and assistance to fit decent HGV mirrors, then all he has to say is that bendies don't kill many cyclists each year to dispell his scaremongering propoganda?

What's more on these routes that are being debendyfied will be up to eight more vehicles per hour; that doesn't sound good to me and my two wheeler.

cjcp

prj45 wrote:

What's more on these routes that are being debendyfied will be up to eight more vehicles per hour; that doesn't sound good to me and my two wheeler.

I've always said that the problem is the number of cars on the road London, not other vehicles. Just look at the roads during school holidays.