Avoiding buying stolen bikes

Apollo748
Apollo748 Posts: 61
edited September 2008 in Workshop
I've just bought a cheap frame and forks (Pinnacle Sentinal 2.0) to be built up as a cheap winter hack, frame and forks together cost me £30. Of course I ask the guy if it's knocked off to which he replies no, but in the end you only have the seller's word for it don't you.

Is there anyway to check that a particular bike's not stolen? Like a recognised database listing stolen item/bikes ids and so forth?

Comments

  • alfablue
    alfablue Posts: 8,497
    I think the best ways are asking for evidence of ownership, and questions about the bike. I have seen some eBay listings for fabulous bikes where the seller makes so many fundamental errors in describing the spec, you just know it isn't theirs.
  • bill57
    bill57 Posts: 454
    Like this one?

    http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Hand-Made-720-Pri ... dZViewItem

    First Principia made in Italy, doing it's second stint on Ebay. Ideal for serious enthusiast!!
  • chuckcork
    chuckcork Posts: 1,471
    Apollo748 wrote:
    I've just bought a cheap frame and forks (Pinnacle Sentinal 2.0) to be built up as a cheap winter hack, frame and forks together cost me £30. Of course I ask the guy if it's knocked off to which he replies no, but in the end you only have the seller's word for it don't you.

    Is there anyway to check that a particular bike's not stolen? Like a recognised database listing stolen item/bikes ids and so forth?

    I have the frame number and make of mine registered with http://www.immobilise.com/ for a small fee you can check whether something is stolen.
    'Twas Mulga Bill, from Eaglehawk, that caught the cycling craze....
  • Apollo748
    Apollo748 Posts: 61
    chuckcork wrote:
    for a small fee you can check whether something is stolen.

    Thanks for that, just done a check and it's clean, well at least not reported as stolen.

    Also did my main bike which was bought through 220triathlon, the peace of mind is worth the £4. :)
  • redvee
    redvee Posts: 11,922
    bill57 wrote:
    Like this one?

    http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Hand-Made-720-Pri ... dZViewItem

    First Principia made in Italy, doing it's second stint on Ebay. Ideal for serious enthusiast!!

    Had to ask what size tyres are on this bike :lol:. The listing says 26" :?
    I've added a signature to prove it is still possible.
  • Leedsblue
    Leedsblue Posts: 102
    So how do you report a posible stolen item that is on Ebay and who to, the police or Ebay.

    Any person selling a bike worth £2500 would know what kit was on the bike and would be likely to say so in an Ebay advert. The only facts are those that are obvious (18 gears )
    ============================================

    FCN is minimal as I don't see many bikes on the way to work
  • Apollo748
    Apollo748 Posts: 61
    With eBay you're forced to pay your money before meeting the seller.

    Worst case, you turn up, decide it's obviously stolen then what? Walk away £800 out of pocket?
  • mba007
    mba007 Posts: 95
    I always reckon that the seller should be happy to have a picture taken of him/her with the bike. If not, then either they are camera shy, or don't want to be identified.
  • bill57
    bill57 Posts: 454
    You'll love the description of this one -

    http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Principia-Road-Bi ... dZViewItem
    - and the wheels are getting smaller!
  • alfablue
    alfablue Posts: 8,497
    Shimano Chorus, I love it!!!! He is a real bike fanatic!
  • Apollo748
    Apollo748 Posts: 61
    Maybe we could form some sort of eBay stolen bike vigilante group!

    God knows what we'd do though, maybe request the frame number but if it is stolen he's not likely to give it out is he.

    *shrugs* maybe auction sites should be requiring a kosher frame number before allowing the listing.
  • alfablue
    alfablue Posts: 8,497
    Apollo748 wrote:
    With eBay you're forced to pay your money before meeting the seller.

    Worst case, you turn up, decide it's obviously stolen then what? Walk away £800 out of pocket?
    I suppose if it really is stolen the seller is unlikely to want to enter into a dispute via eBay. On the other hand they may just steal your money an sell it again! When eBay investigate a complaint they never tell you the details so it would be difficult to challenge them or understand their decision. I have reported dubious listings before (like several sellers listing the same TT bike with the same picture) but you never get to hear what action they take. One would hope that with such obvious attempts at fraud they would involve the police, but I suspect eBay don't want the bad publicity and probably just ban the members.

    Many sellers encourage viewing, I suppose if they do that they are much more likely to be legit - even if you don't take it up.

    I do find the listings VERY revealing about the "owner" - I think you can tell someone who has owned and loved their bike. Of course some plead ignorance saying they are selling on behalf of their "uncle" or "brother" etc. May be true, but would put me right off. Another thing is the feedback - if someone has hundreds of +ve feedback / a 100% record, it would make me doubt that they would want to risk losing that. Those who are recently registered or with very few feedbacks...that's a real warning sign if they are selling a high value item.
  • alfablue
    alfablue Posts: 8,497
    Apollo748 wrote:
    Maybe we could form some sort of eBay stolen bike vigilante group!

    God knows what we'd do though, maybe request the frame number but if it is stolen he's not likely to give it out is he.

    *shrugs* maybe auction sites should be requiring a kosher frame number before allowing the listing.
    Yes, I would come unstuck though, my 2001 vintage Rock Lobster Titanium has no frame number, I have inspected every inch - nothing! I bet you wouldn't believe me either! :wink:

    I would encourage everyone to be pro-active and report any dodgy looking listings, better to do so if there is any doubt. eBay certainly don't (and couldn't) police everything so we should do our bit. If you are wrong, it doesn't really matter, a genuine owner will surely be fine.
  • bill57
    bill57 Posts: 454
    Unfortunately Ebay feedback is not a guarantee against fraudulent traders. There are plenty of scams for building up feedback, I believe some people actually buy it.
  • alfablue
    alfablue Posts: 8,497
    bill57 wrote:
    Unfortunately Ebay feedback is not a guarantee against fraudulent traders. There are plenty of scams for building up feedback, I believe some people actually buy it.
    yes, fair point.
  • robthehungrymonkey
    robthehungrymonkey Posts: 616
    Apollo748 wrote:
    With eBay you're forced to pay your money before meeting the seller.

    Worst case, you turn up, decide it's obviously stolen then what? Walk away £800 out of pocket?

    Since when are you forced to pay before meeting the seller?
    I've bought loads of stuff (including my bike) off ebay, and if it's something worth a decent ammount of money i'd pay when i pick it up. If they demand payment by paypal or before you see it when selling a bike i'd leave well alone.
    http://www.KOWONO.com - Design-Led home furniture and accessories.
  • dombo6
    dombo6 Posts: 582
    Apollo748 wrote:
    With eBay you're forced to pay your money before meeting the seller.

    Worst case, you turn up, decide it's obviously stolen then what? Walk away £800 out of pocket?

    No, if collecting in person the seller will often accept cash on collection to avoid PayPal fees. So if you win the auction, take a mate along and if it looks dodgy, walk away.

    Seller may threaten to post feedback that you welched on the deal so you reply that you'll post return feedback that you prefer not to buy stolen goods.

    A genuine seller will be able to convince you he's genuine.

    You go with backup to dissuade a thieving scumbag from trying to "convince" you to pay up.
  • alfablue
    alfablue Posts: 8,497
    I wonder if the new eBay policy prohibiting negative feedback from sellers includes where there is a non-payment, does anyone know?
  • robthehungrymonkey
    robthehungrymonkey Posts: 616
    Dombo6 wrote:

    Seller may threaten to post feedback that you welched on the deal so you reply that you'll post return feedback that you prefer not to buy stolen goods.

    Actually, Ebay have now stopped sellers posting feedback because of this tit for tat kind of thing. The seller can mark it "unpaid", but would have to convince ebay that it was due. The fact he's stolen the item would make that a bit tricky!
    http://www.KOWONO.com - Design-Led home furniture and accessories.
  • Apollo748
    Apollo748 Posts: 61
    'cept you have no idea if it's stolen really do you.
  • alfablue
    alfablue Posts: 8,497
    Apollo748 wrote:
    'cept you have no idea if it's stolen really do you.
    No, but if you have done your best to establish ownership at least morally you have acted in good faith. Of course if you bought something stolen and the police or the owner discovered this you would lose it with no recompense, but the chances of that are remote in the extreme.

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