sprint triathlon advice

ris

i signed up for the highworth sprint / novice tri at the end of the month and wondered if i could get any tips or nuggets of advice from the race bods?

there is nothing in the tri that strikes me as particularly worrying (400m swim, 20k bike, 5k run); i'm a reasonably confident swimmer, cycle 100+ commuting miles a week and have trained for 1/2 marathon in the past without experiencing any problems.

i've not done any of this together though, and i'm aware that i might hit a few blocks in transitions, liquid or energy intake. i figured i would stick two full 750ml water bottles and maybe tape some geobars on the bike, and take a small bottle of water for the run.

is it worth taking repair kit and tubes or just assume that if it goes wrong like that then i'm not going to finish?

thanks... at times i feel like i'm heading for a fall with this...

Kléber

ris wrote:

i've not done any of this together though, and i'm aware that i might hit a few blocks in transitions, liquid or energy intake. i figured i would stick two full 750ml water bottles and maybe tape some geobars on the bike, and take a small bottle of water for the run.

Whooah there. It's important to eat and drink but this might be too much. It's better to take too much but a 20km ride is half an hour, after a 10 minute swim and before a 20 minute run. In an hour, a bottle and maybe a banana or an energy gel should be ok but it's always personal.

Good luck 8)

ris

i was thinking of carrying it, although i've never found that i drink a lot when excercising (even when running 11-12 miles i was rarely getting through 250-300ml). more of it goes over my head than in my mouth to be honest!

a banana is a good idea, i can always fill a bottle with scoff instead.

thanks

drenkrom

I competed at these kinds of distances in the juniors in my glorious tri-days, so I may have a tip or two for you.

Anyone who's reasonably fit should get through those distances. You more than fit the bill there. If this is your first triathlon, the logistics of the affair will be a lot more important for you. When it comes to the transition, you need a system. It's through races that you perfect it, but you need one to begin with. You'll probably not be in a wetsuit for that kind of swim, so one less problem for you. Know what direction you'll be coming from during transitions and place your stuff accordingly. Plan which hand will be holding the bike when you run into the second transition. If it's your right hand, for example, be sure your running shoes are on the left side of you bike spot. Stuff like that seems trivial at first, but a bad transition will frustrate you and guarantee you start off your next leg too fast. Practice hooking and unhooking your bike on the morning of the race. In fact, practice transitions beforehand. You'll probably want elastic running shoe laces, a dab of Vaseline on the cloth that hugs you Achile's tendon and maybe even on the sides of your saddle nose if you'll be going "speedo-all-the-way". Practicing the "having-your-shoes-preattached-to-the-pedals" transition is also well worth it. Unless you like running in carbon soles, of course.

Most important of all, practice your bike-run transition. There is no feeling on Earth that's weirder than pushing a big gear on the bike for some time, then spinning the legs fast on the run. That is the crux of the race right there. You may not b going to compete, but that is where races are lost. Remember to spin a lighter gear for the last few km's on the bike.

For transitions, you can learn for one of the masters: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=69Vf_X6iYfo

Apart from transitions, you just have to slog on. Give it all in the swim, those arms won't be of use anymore afterwards anyways. You can also give it full gas on the bike, keeping in mind those hamstrings will be used in the run, too. Stay way up front in the saddle to spare them a bit. Then, survive the run, which is the hardest part if you have real cyclist legs.

Fuel-wise, you should be alright if you carbo-loaded good. A gel at the end of the bike split can give you a lift in the run, when you may need it, but it's pretty borderline at those distances. If the race is well-organized, you don't need to take a bottle on the run, there should be at least two water points and you don't want to drink too much when running anyways. Drink enough, but never ever have anything sloshing around in you stomach by the time the running shoes go on your feet.

I hope you enjoy your first tri and develop the appetite for bigger distances. That's where the real fun is at. Well, in a "my legs are cramping, I just threw up for the fourth time, I may have to crawl but I'll finish this motherf?$%?@" kind of way.

method

ris wrote:

i signed up for the highworth sprint / novice tri at the end of the month and wondered if i could get any tips or nuggets of advice from the race bods?

there is nothing in the tri that strikes me as particularly worrying (400m swim, 20k bike, 5k run); i'm a reasonably confident swimmer, cycle 100+ commuting miles a week and have trained for 1/2 marathon in the past without experiencing any problems.

i've not done any of this together though, and i'm aware that i might hit a few blocks in transitions, liquid or energy intake. i figured i would stick two full 750ml water bottles and maybe tape some geobars on the bike, and take a small bottle of water for the run.

is it worth taking repair kit and tubes or just assume that if it goes wrong like that then i'm not going to finish?

thanks... at times i feel like i'm heading for a fall with this...

I don't generally take any fuel on a sprint, I do get a bit thirsty but I find when you're going flat out, there doesn't seem to be the inclination or chance to drink. Regarding the repair kit, it depends really, if you get a flat your race may be over in terms of a good time, but you might also be 10+ km from the start. I'd take a small kit to prevent a walk.

idaviesmoore

Great to hear you're doing a sprint and as you rightly said you're more than fit enough to complete. Just think about:

1. 'Brick training'- Set your bike up on turbo (if you haven't got one then go on the road). Spin easy for 10 minutes. Have your trainers ready (if you're using clipless pedals). Hop off bike and jog for 5 minutes. Repeat this 4-5 times. It'll help your legs understand the differance between cycling and running.
2. I'm not sure about the advice of 'giving it your all' in the swim (sorry drenkrom). This depends on how efficient your swim is. If (like me) you're not a natural swimmer then you will tire your body quickly if you are thrashing with the arms and making no progress. Triathlon is about consistant effort across the 3 disciplines, not about going as hard as you can. This is particularly relevant to you as it is your first event.

All the other advice is spot on.
Enjoy and welcome to the '3 Wayer'

cougie

Some good tips there.

I'd not bother with 1500ml of water on the bike - thats a big weight there and I cant see how anyone could get through that in the distance. By comparison - the weight of a spare is negligible. I'd always take repair kit just so you can get back.

Practice your transitions - so do a bike ride and come back to your house and throw the bike away and get out running straight away. Its an odd feeling in the legs to begin with.

I'd also not take water on the run with me - they normally have water stations on the course.

I dont think you should need fuel for this race - how far can you ride without taking on any ?

graeme_s-2

I tend to just have a bottle with a small amount of liquid in it on the bike (which I never drink all of, but I like having it there), and then take a gel with me which I take in at the end of the ride/start of the run.

What I do make sure I do is have a big carby meal the night before, get a good nights sleep, then get up and have muesli and toast for breakfast. Then I slowly drink a bottle of energy drink on the way to the race, finishing it not too long before I start the swim.

Taking a drink on the bike pulls you out of your aero position. I always find that psychologically that puts me off doing it.

cougie

I think that for this - if you were to have a gel - you'd have to take it half way round the bike. If you leave it for the run - it takes 15 mins to kick in anyway = and its only a 5k ?

hammerite

Take a spare tube, pump and some tyre levers. If you p*ncture in your first race and don't finish it'll probably put you off tri for life! It could be a long walk home, plus triathlon aren't cheap so you want to get round, even if you don't get a great time, use it as training.

Fuel wise I just put a small 500ml bidon on the bike and take a drink if I need to, sometimes I feel a bit thirsty getting out of the water, so it's there just in case. You shouldn't need to eat anything or take a gel. Chances are you'll be done and dusted in about an hour.

With it being your first race don't worry too much about getting any specialist kit, as a cyclist and runner already you probably have a fair amount of kit that you can make do with. As others have said elastic laces are useful, but I can get my running shoes on easy enough and don't need them. Most triathletes wouldn't wear socks, but I'm a wimp with feet that blister easily so I put socks on with talc in (so they're easier to get on
when wet). You may want to look at tri shorts, these are like cycling shorts, but with a thinner pad in so you swim, cycle and run in them.

Practise getting dry t-shirt/cycling jersey onto a wet body, it's surprisingly difficult when you are in a rush!

ris

thanks everyone, there is a good deal of useful advice there.

i like the idea of giving it some with the arms in the pool, my crawl technique isn't too shocking, and my legs do next to naff all in the water!

i did manage to get a cheap pair of tri-shorts (the colours though...the horror :shock: ), and i've got a few cycle jerseys i can use for the bike / run.

i might try the shoes on the pedals lark, if only to see if i fall off. my spd-sl pedals have been hard enough to get used to the normal way round, but the thought of walking the transition area is bad enough, let alone running.

drenkrom - the transition advice (positioning, etc) is excellent, thanks. it was interesting watching that vid - i've never been able to do that push off thing but maybe i need to practice that too.

hammerite

Whilst you want to be quick during tranisiton try not to rush too much. My last tri I went out on the bike without attaching my number belt :oops: luckily I didn't get a penalty as my bike and helmet numbers were quite visible.

Also in two races this season I've gone to set off on the run with my bike helmet still on! This may have been mentioned earlier in the thread, but whatever you do make sure you have your helmet on and fastened before you touch your bike, then make sure your bike is fully racked before unclipping and removing your helmet (you can get penalties easily).

The other thing to remember is do not draft on the bike (three bike lengths long, one wide as a rule). This could be useful but a bit OTT! http://www.triduo.com/articlesPage/draftingrules/drafting.htm

ris

hammerite, that drafting link is excellent - i'm sure i would have fallen foul of it otherwise. i had no idea the draft zone was so long or wide and it is something i shall have to bear in mind especially as i can't make the tri induction for newbs thing next week.

i am all but certain to start running with my helmet on, or start the cycle with my water wings attached.

does it make sense to pin the race no to the cycle shirt so that they go on as one thing? it's a pool swim so i won't need a top in the water and just have to hope it's not too cold when i get into the transition to cycle.

i got the tri odds and ends in the post this morning, the shorts are great. i also bought a tri top not realising how short it was (thought it would be a bit baggier like a running top), and wife was nearly incoherent with laughter. :oops:

hammerite

ris wrote:

does it make sense to pin the race no to the cycle shirt so that they go on as one thing? it's a pool swim so i won't need a top in the water and just have to hope it's not too cold when i get into the transition to cycle.

i got the tri odds and ends in the post this morning, the shorts are great. i also bought a tri top not realising how short it was (thought it would be a bit baggier like a running top), and wife was nearly incoherent with laughter. :oops:

Yes, if you are wearing a cycling top pin the number to it in advance, or if you want buy a number belt (not a necessary purchase, but worthwhile if you plan to do more tri).

You probably won't notice the cold getting out of the water and out into transition, and you should be ok if you are putting a dry top on. I find I only get cold if it's windy/raining as you don't dry out.

It's a bit risky buying tri stuff online, I too made the mistake of buying a tri top, looks like a ladies crop vest. My Mrs behaved pretty much like yours! If you are getting a tri top look at the long distance style tri tops, tend to be a tad longer, and looser with pockets. Like so.....

http://www.cycleworld.co.uk/product/14888/Orca_226_Distance_Tri_Singlet_Male_White again for your first tri I wouldn't worry about it too much, but worth looking into if you decide to do more.

knedlicky

I’d only take a 2/3-full 500 ml bottle on the bike, and perhaps have a gel in the cycling shirt ready to consume about a third/halfway along the cycling bit, so it kicks in by the run (though I suspect this extra ‘fuel’ isn’t really necessary, more a placebo).

For a short event like this, the time you need in the transition zone is very important, the less the better. If not organised, you can easily lose 1½ minutes at each transition to rivals (which means 1200+ m on the bike and 600+ m in the run, there being two transitions).
Practice your transitions (in the garden at home if necessary) to see how you can speed things up.

Because of this, at short duathlons, I sometimes ride in my running shoes (to skip both shoe changes). The time I lose on the bike because of the 'wrong' shoes I don't feel that great, especially if the ride is hilly, not a flat ride needing constant power.

For a short event I’ll also sometimes ride in my running shorts (I don’t find the padding on cycling shorts comfortable when running fast, which should be the case for just 5 km, and I can cope well enough for 20 km on the bike without padding).

I can usually find my racing bike in the transition zone, it being distinctive enough, but if it’s a MTB-duathlon, my bike is so similar to many others, I usually attach something bright (e.g. a piece of neon-pink plastic ribbon) near to where it’s parked, so I can spot it immediately when entering the transition zone – in the hectic, one can forget where the bike is parked.

I get around the number problem by having mine attached to a homemade number belt – a piece of elastic, the type used in clothing with elasticated waistbands, which I swivel from at back (for the ride) to at the front (for the run). It’s often required your number should be at the front during the run, and some organisers will penalise you if it’s still at the back, because it’s on your cycling shirt.

drenkrom

Yeah, maybe take that "give it your all in the swim" advice with a grain of salt. I used to be a sub 17min 1500m swimmer, so it might not translate too well.

ris

knedlicky wrote:

I

For a short event I’ll also sometimes ride in my running shorts (I don’t find the padding on cycling shorts comfortable when running fast, which should be the case for just 5 km, and I can cope well enough for 20 km on the bike without padding).

I get around the number problem by having mine attached to a homemade number belt – a piece of elastic, the type used in clothing with elasticated waistbands, which I swivel from at back (for the ride) to at the front (for the run). It’s often required your number should be at the front during the run, and some organisers will penalise you if it’s still at the back, because it’s on your cycling shirt.

i can't find a reference in the tri guide to whether the number needs to be on the front for the run and the back for the cycle. this would be a bit of a fiddle to sort in transition if it is pinned - unless i swap shirts. is it likely to be the case or could i wing it? i'm happy to rig something up if need be!

interesting about running in the swim/cycle shorts, i think i'll do a couple of runs in them to see how they feel, i'd hate to find they would chafe after 100yds.

under 17min for 1500, drenkrom, that's cutting it some! i used to manage 3km / hr swimming but my stamina has dropped off a bit since i stopped going regularly. i hope that i could get a reasonable time for 400, ideally between 5-10 mins.

andrewgturnbull

Hi there.

Sorry - coming late to this thread... I've been trying to avoid the forum as I was spending waaaaaaay to much time on here!

Here's my top tips for you:

- Numbers: if the organisers require you to wear a number on the back while cycling and one on front while running they'll provide you with two numbers. Else they'll hand out a free number belt like they did at the world champs last year.

- T-shirts: make sure you pick something that you can put on when you're wet. Some tight fitting running tops can be a nightmare - I've watched people really struggling trying to slip a helly hensen over a wet torso... It's not going to happen. A half-unzipped cycling jersey might be the way to go. You can buy a snazzy one-piece for your next race!

- Shorts: Don't run in cycling shorts... If they're wet from the swim, that chamois is going to be flapping around like a nappy. When I started everyone competed in speedo's. Modesty prevails now, but swimming shorts would be a better bet. Tri-specific shorts (or one piece suit) with a very thin chamois are ideal.

- Drenkrom's transition tips are spot on. If you're not in the first heat, watch the earlier competitors to see the right way and wrong way to do it. I got caught out yesterday as I slipped in a grass transition zone which had become very, very wet by the time my heat went...

- Pacing: Don't go all out in the swim! If the person in front of you is going at a good pace just sit in and draft. It's legal in the swim and will save you 10% effort. On the bike I'd go 90% effort for a sprint. By this I mean slower than 10 mile time trial pace, more like 25m TT pace, or even a touch slower. If you've got anything left give it all you've got on the run.

- Bike-run bricks: Here's my key training session I do once a week. 7 mins cycling (at 10 mile TT pace), transition, 5 mins running (5k race pace), transition, spin easy 3 mins, repeat 4 tims. I call this the brick-stack, and it does hurt. This will teach your body to run after riding hard - you need to really concentrate on running form, stride length and turnover during that 1st kilometer, then really push hard to the end. The transition practice is full-on race stylee, no stopping for a cup of tea. This is when you need to practice starting with your shoes on the bike, mounting and dismounting cyclocross style without breaking stride, etc, etc. You'll find out what works for you, little things like not getting your helmet strap twisted up and remembering to put your sunglasses on.

- Enjoy!

Cheers, Andy

ps The drafting guide is american - make sure you keep left, not right over here!

andrewgturnbull

pps Fueling for a 1 hour race: Half a 500ml bottle of energy drink. No gels, no cakes etc.

wildmoustache

Graeme_S wrote:

I tend to just have a bottle with a small amount of liquid in it on the bike (which I never drink all of, but I like having it there), and then take a gel with me which I take in at the end of the ride/start of the run.

What I do make sure I do is have a big carby meal the night before, get a good nights sleep, then get up and have muesli and toast for breakfast. Then I slowly drink a bottle of energy drink on the way to the race, finishing it not too long before I start the swim.

Taking a drink on the bike pulls you out of your aero position. I always find that psychologically that puts me off doing it.

Exactly what I do Graeme! and I think you've got it right there. for a 20km tri leg I would take about 1/2 of a medium sized bidon of energy drink. I'd probably either not drink any or have a gulp at the beginning/ or grab the bottle at the end and have a gulp going into the run and then chuck it. if you start well hydrated, you're not going to have a problem over that distance (unless it's in ridiculous heat).

Agree with the big healthy carb loaded meal and the muesli (but not alpen which is rubbish ... go for sainsburys/waitrose/dorset)

ris

thanks again to everyone who has commented helpfully on this - i'll admit to being a bit aprehensive about it at the moment.

andy, i've usefully picked up a full-zip cycle top recently which i hope will be easier to put on if damp, unless i snag it on myself.

the shorts i have up are apparently for tri with a thin chamois pad, but i will give them a test in the pool, bike and run to make sure they aren't uncomfortable or ridiculous.

i wasn't planning to do much in the way of training other than changing my swim pattern to shorter sprints. i think i shall give some of the transition suggestions a go so at least i know what to expect. as it is my first go i am expecting a few cock ups, with any luck i will enjoy it enough to do another.

i shall have a look at the morning timetable when i get it - highworth is a little way from here so i can see myself being up pretty early to get set up. at least i will have plenty of time for breakfast to settle.

ris

completed the event now, feeling a little tired (as much the early start as the effort i think - my start time was an unsociable 8.30am). many thanks again to everyone who kindly gave advice or suggestions.

swim and bike went fine but the grass-course run was a killer on already sapped legs and i was a few mins slower than i would have liked. annoyingly i felt fairly good when i finished and suspect that i had more in my legs than i thought.

i think i ate a bit too much on the bike and felt a touch queasy on the run - i'll know for next time!

it was great fun and i'd certainly do another, if only to see if i could better my times.

hammerite

ris wrote:

completed the event now, feeling a little tired (as much the early start as the effort i think - my start time was an unsociable 8.30am). many thanks again to everyone who kindly gave advice or suggestions.

swim and bike went fine but the grass-course run was a killer on already sapped legs and i was a few mins slower than i would have liked. annoyingly i felt fairly good when i finished and suspect that i had more in my legs than i thought.

i think i ate a bit too much on the bike and felt a touch queasy on the run - i'll know for next time!

it was great fun and i'd certainly do another, if only to see if i could better my times.

8.30am??? that's a lay in!!

seriously though, Well Done.
Don't worry too much about feeling like you have energy left after finishing. The trouble with a sprint is that you will be going at a fair pace, that while you are putting the effort in you'll actually feel pretty wasted, but come finish you recover quickly because it is a relatively short/hard effort. The reality is that you probably were going as well as you could at the time.

Glad you say that you'll know for next time!! These events are stupidly addictive.

Now back to that lie in...... I was all wet suitted up at 6.30am on Sunday ready to get into a lake. It was my first Middle distance triathlon, and I have to say, whilst it was bloody hard work, I loved every minute of it (including the swim which I usually struggle with). If you want to up the distance next year, New Forest MD is a perfect course for it, quite tough, but ever so scenic to take your mind off the pain!!

FSR_XC

8.30 is definately a lie in. I've done 3 sprints now and 8am has been a normal start.

Congrats on doing the event. As Hammerite says, tri's can become terribly addictive.

I missed the start of this thread (on holiday). My transition (along with my race) times have improved with each event. Mostly due to getting ideas from others. The biggest improvement in transition was by using tri shorts, a base layer and a belt for my number. I wore base layer & shorts for the whole event, meaning I didn't have any probs with putting a top on. Both dried very quickly & remained comfortable.

Good luck for the next one.

ris

cheers hammerite, it wasn't so much the start as the getting up at 6.30 to get over to highworth (akthough i'm sure you did similar to get to the lake for 6.30!).

you are right it is addictive, i've been looking for events but suspect it might be 2009 before i can get some more in this area. doesn't stop me from training a bit though, which might help as i didn't really do any before highworth. i think a winter getting some running miles down would do me good.

i took a look at the MD tri's, i think i'll build to a standard before i take on one of those - i'm still soft and woolly as tri's go!

hammerite

ris wrote:

cheers hammerite, it wasn't so much the start as the getting up at 6.30 to get over to highworth (akthough i'm sure you did similar to get to the lake for 6.30!).

you are right it is addictive, i've been looking for events but suspect it might be 2009 before i can get some more in this area. doesn't stop me from training a bit though, which might help as i didn't really do any before highworth. i think a winter getting some running miles down would do me good.

i took a look at the MD tri's, i think i'll build to a standard before i take on one of those - i'm still soft and woolly as tri's go!

I was up at 4am to be ready for New Forest!!

This weekend and next will probably be the last of the sprints for the season (i've got Bedford a week on Sunday). But plenty of good races to look forward to for 2009.

BTW....... I only did one sprint last year, then built up over this summer up to MD. Not sure I'll bother going the step further to do an IM, too much commitment to training.