Law on mobile phones at the wheel failure?

Spinner28

Ok, is it just me or am I seeing more people than ever driving(or attempting to)whilst chatting on a hand held mobile phone?
It would seem to me that not only is it becoming more common, but drivers are becoming more cocky than ever about using them at the wheel, despite the recent change to the law that promised 3-points on the licence of anyone commiting such an offence!

And WHY do the worst offenders seem to be drivers with the most expensive cars? Or women on the school run in their 4X4's? Who answer everything you say to them when they've nearly knocked you off with "I've got children in the car!!" Well learn to drive properly then!!

will3

And why is it that if us 'umble cycle commuters can spot all these offences every day the police can't?

Reckon a couple of plain clothes police cyclists with helmet cams would pay more than a Gatso.

spen666

Spinner28 wrote:

Ok, is it just me or am I seeing more people than ever driving(or attempting to)whilst chatting on a hand held mobile phone?
It would seem to me that not only is it becoming more common, but drivers are becoming more cocky than ever about using them at the wheel, despite the recent change to the law that promised 3-points on the licence of anyone commiting such an offence!

And WHY do the worst offenders seem to be drivers with the most expensive cars? Or women on the school run in their 4X4's? Who answer everything you say to them when they've nearly knocked you off with "I've got children in the car!!" Well learn to drive properly then!!

The law "promised" 3 points on the licence of anyone CONVICTED of such an offence

This subtle difference is hugely important.

The law has not failed, the ENFORCEMENT of the law has failed

Keiron Curtis

spen666 wrote:

Spinner28 wrote:

Ok, is it just me or am I seeing more people than ever driving(or attempting to)whilst chatting on a hand held mobile phone?
It would seem to me that not only is it becoming more common, but drivers are becoming more cocky than ever about using them at the wheel, despite the recent change to the law that promised 3-points on the licence of anyone commiting such an offence!

And WHY do the worst offenders seem to be drivers with the most expensive cars? Or women on the school run in their 4X4's? Who answer everything you say to them when they've nearly knocked you off with "I've got children in the car!!" Well learn to drive properly then!!

The law "promised" 3 points on the licence of anyone CONVICTED of such an offence

This subtle difference is hugely important.

The law has not failed, the ENFORCEMENT of the law has failed

I don't think it's a subtle difference, it is major, a malaise of this country, we have lost the ENFORCEMENT of the law, we no longer have LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICERS, but LAW OFFICERS, who make on the spot decisions, of whether or not a conviction is possble, if it's worth taking the matter further etc.. The old idea of spot a crime, report it, and convict is long gone, even murderers are being set free, because of Law Lords and MPs, who are completely out of touch, and have left our police force completely toothless and hamstrung with pointless paperwork. In so doing they have made our streets alot unsafer for everyone, failing the people they are supposed to be there to serve, us the public.

spen666

Keiron Curtis wrote:

spen666 wrote:

Spinner28 wrote:

Ok, is it just me or am I seeing more people than ever driving(or attempting to)whilst chatting on a hand held mobile phone?
It would seem to me that not only is it becoming more common, but drivers are becoming more cocky than ever about using them at the wheel, despite the recent change to the law that promised 3-points on the licence of anyone commiting such an offence!

And WHY do the worst offenders seem to be drivers with the most expensive cars? Or women on the school run in their 4X4's? Who answer everything you say to them when they've nearly knocked you off with "I've got children in the car!!" Well learn to drive properly then!!

The law "promised" 3 points on the licence of anyone CONVICTED of such an offence

This subtle difference is hugely important.

The law has not failed, the ENFORCEMENT of the law has failed

I don't think it's a subtle difference, it is major, a malaise of this country, we have lost the ENFORCEMENT of the law, we no longer have LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICERS, but LAW OFFICERS,

When did we ever have law enforcement officers in England & Wales?

We have now as we have had for a couple of hunderd years, police officers

who make on the spot decisions, of whether or not a conviction is possble, if it's worth taking the matter further etc.

Do you want the police to waste their time pursuing cases that they will never be able to get sufficient evidence to prosecute? And whilst pursuing the impossible, they are unavailable to deal with the important cases eg attending you when you report a burglar on your premises?

. The old idea of spot a crime, report it, and convict is long gone

You can only convict if their is sufficient EVIDENCE to convict

, even murderers are being set free

really?

I'm not aware of any one convicted of murder who has been freed before serving their sentence, imposed by the court, unless their conviction is overturned on appeal because the conviction is unsafe

, because of Law Lords and MPs, who are completely out of touch, and have left our police force completely toothless

Really? That is why the police have more powers than ever before, but never let this fact get in the way of a rant

and hamstrung with pointless paperwork. In so doing they have made our streets alot unsafer for everyone, failing the people they are supposed to be there to serve, us the public.

You may ask the question though, why the senior police officers ( not rank & file) think that Criminal Justice is only a minor part of their role.

I have conducted several interviews this year with senior police officers- Superintendent and above who all say that Criminal Justice is a minor part of the role of the police force.

PErhaps if the focus of the police was Criminal Justice you would find more crime being solved or prevented

dirk_van_gently

Spinner28 wrote:

And WHY do the worst offenders seem to be drivers with the most expensive cars? !!

Big car, Small brain. Cheap shot, sorry.
I think it's the mentality that surrounds having a big car, "I can afford it" puffed out chest optional, therefore the possibility of a fine is considered in the same manner, they can afford it.

Belv

spen666 wrote:

I have conducted several interviews this year with senior police officers- Superintendent and above who all say that Criminal Justice is a minor part of the role of the police force.

PErhaps if the focus of the police was Criminal Justice you would find more crime being solved or prevented

What do they say is their primary role?

el_presidente

Belv wrote:

spen666 wrote:

I have conducted several interviews this year with senior police officers- Superintendent and above who all say that Criminal Justice is a minor part of the role of the police force.

PErhaps if the focus of the police was Criminal Justice you would find more crime being solved or prevented

What do they say is their primary role?

Eating donuts?

Keiron Curtis

spen666 wrote:

Keiron Curtis wrote:

spen666 wrote:

Spinner28 wrote:

Ok, is it just me or am I seeing more people than ever driving(or attempting to)whilst chatting on a hand held mobile phone?
It would seem to me that not only is it becoming more common, but drivers are becoming more cocky than ever about using them at the wheel, despite the recent change to the law that promised 3-points on the licence of anyone commiting such an offence!

And WHY do the worst offenders seem to be drivers with the most expensive cars? Or women on the school run in their 4X4's? Who answer everything you say to them when they've nearly knocked you off with "I've got children in the car!!" Well learn to drive properly then!!

The law "promised" 3 points on the licence of anyone CONVICTED of such an offence

This subtle difference is hugely important.

The law has not failed, the ENFORCEMENT of the law has failed

I don't think it's a subtle difference, it is major, a malaise of this country, we have lost the ENFORCEMENT of the law, we no longer have LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICERS, but LAW OFFICERS,

When did we ever have law enforcement officers in England & Wales?

We have now as we have had for a couple of hunderd years, police officers

who make on the spot decisions, of whether or not a conviction is possble, if it's worth taking the matter further etc.

Do you want the police to waste their time pursuing cases that they will never be able to get sufficient evidence to prosecute? And whilst pursuing the impossible, they are unavailable to deal with the important cases eg attending you when you report a burglar on your premises?

. The old idea of spot a crime, report it, and convict is long gone

You can only convict if their is sufficient EVIDENCE to convict

, even murderers are being set free

really?

I'm not aware of any one convicted of murder who has been freed before serving their sentence, imposed by the court, unless their conviction is overturned on appeal because the conviction is unsafe

, because of Law Lords and MPs, who are completely out of touch, and have left our police force completely toothless

Really? That is why the police have more powers than ever before, but never let this fact get in the way of a rant

and hamstrung with pointless paperwork. In so doing they have made our streets alot unsafer for everyone, failing the people they are supposed to be there to serve, us the public.

You may ask the question though, why the senior police officers ( not rank & file) think that Criminal Justice is only a minor part of their role.

I have conducted several interviews this year with senior police officers- Superintendent and above who all say that Criminal Justice is a minor part of the role of the police force.

PErhaps if the focus of the police was Criminal Justice you would find more crime being solved or prevented

OK spen666,
It didn't take you long to rip apart my opinion, but my opinion it is, and I think alot of people agree with me, as you say why let facts get in the way of a good rant? It's the public's perception that counts, and it is the Law Lords, Parliament, the ruling class etc., that have lost touch, completely, and more importantly fails continuously to communicate with that public. But I am not going to debate this issue with you, who is obviously quite an expert on the matter, and, by the way, can use a computer far better than I.

Belv

Keiron Curtis wrote:

It's the public's perception that counts

Is it?
Shouldn't reality and facts be what count?
Where does 'the public' get its perception from?

karl j

it amazes me that this is still a law.

How can it be called a law if it isn't enforced ?

spen666

Keiron Curtis wrote:

....
OK spen666,
It didn't take you long to rip apart my opinion, but my opinion it is, and I think alot of people agree with me, as you say why let facts get in the way of a good rant? It's the public's perception that counts, and it is the Law Lords, Parliament, the ruling class etc.,
that have lost touch, completely,

but its not the fault of the criminals who break the law? its always someone else's fault

and more importantly fails continuously to communicate with that public.

interesting topic this one - I don't disagree with you re communication issues, BUT consider this. Today on Breakfast TV were stories about road rage being a big issue - the story comes from an RAC ( I think) report published this morning. Same report pointed out the cost of motoring is cheaper than 20 years ago, but that point was ignored. The media only publicize the stories that fit their agenda- so it can be hard to change public perception

But I am not going to debate this issue with you, who is obviously quite an expert on the matter, and, by the way, can use a computer far better than I.