The dangers of nodding

dang65

I ride to and from work along a "quiet country lane" (i.e. insanely busy B-road through the countryside, used by hundreds of cars during the rush hour). The bit I go along is about 5 miles long and I usually pass one or two cyclists coming in the other direction. Naturally, I give them a nod.

Problem is, I've noticed many times recently that the second I nod at the cyclist, the car directly behind them pulls out to overtake. I'm starting to get a bit paranoid that drivers are taking my friendly nod to the cyclist as some kind of go ahead for them to pull out!? It really does happen a lot.

The other thing is that I have a mirror on my bike. Because of the type of bumpy, fast and busy roads I ride on, I find it really useful to be able to glance down at the mirror and see what's happening behind without having to turn my head.

Problem is, I'm getting a similar effect to the previous one. If I move my head down to glance in the mirror, the car behind me seems to take this as a nod for them to overtake!

I'm getting a bit paranoid about it now, especially as there a number of places on my route where I do a mirror/signal/manoeuvre to turn right. This morning I looked in my mirror, saw a car behind me, put my arm out to tell him I was turning right, turned my head to check as I went to pull out and the guy was half overtaking me already. No indication of course. I'm worried that he saw my head nodding to look at the mirror and decided I was telling him to go.

Anyone else noticed this phenomenon, or am I imagining it and it's just a coincidence?

jonginge

Nodding forward may be misinterpreted but a cyclist on the other side of the road isn't normally enough to stop an overtake. :roll:

On the mirror thing I'd say you are being paranoid. The cars overtake coz they probably don't realise in time that you want to pull out, turn. I over the shoulder check several times way before I need to change lane. Seems to work quite well

Gussio

You are paranoid

mrchrispy

You have to practice the ability to acknowledge fellow cyclists with nothing but a raised eyebrow or the twitch of a finger.
Oh and remember to ignore mountain bikes*



*joke I have both and everyone gets a smile in my book

spen666

Ask Churchill

dang65

JonGinge wrote:

On the mirror thing I'd say you are being paranoid. The cars overtake coz they probably don't realise in time that you want to pull out, turn. I over the shoulder check several times way before I need to change lane. Seems to work quite well

I have to admit that this is one aspect of defensive cycling which I've never been able to take control of satisfactorily.

However much I prepare, look behind, stick arm out, move out into clear road space... I still regularly get cars overtaking me as I go to turn right.

The only defense I have is that I'm aware that so many people do it, so I keep glancing back throughout the whole manoeuvre. But it really scares me that drivers "probably don't realise in time that you want to pull out". Turning right is one manoeuvre where you really do have to rely on other road users being aware of you - unless you get off and push. But how the hell do you get the message across? What does Cyclecraft have to say about this, anyone know?

feaseyrider

hi ,

i too have the pleasure of a quiet country lane commute but has only a few in any passing cars which is pleasing to myself and other nodders on route,

personally i see the cyclists nod as a warming feel to my daily cycle,no matter what your intention on your daily commute your here,your on your way,your route of choice is yours and with a final smile wishing you a safe commute

blimey i lost my nod there

MIRRORS????
i been pondering over this for a while as looking over my shoulder is getting risky like you say one look yep good to move over then next look sure enough driver with no brain must overtake you ...

so would you reccommend if so which?

so long

happy commute
noddy

snooks

dang65 wrote:

However much I prepare, look behind, stick arm out, move out into clear road space... I still regularly get cars overtaking me as I go to turn right.

Just signal a lot earlier than you do at the moment I usually start things rollin' at 3-4 articulated lorry lengths, so I can let 3/4 cars go by if I need to and still make it to the middle with time to spare...If anything I start off a little too early, but I'd rather cycle down the middle of the road for 20-30m checking out the traffic ahead for a space to turn, than leave it till the last moment and run out of room.

A quick check of the blind spot to make sure you'll still have an arm...Big bold arm movement, check for a gap, when it's there, start moving wide (while peddling like fury ) into the primary position..keeping yer arm out move over to the right...if cars want to pass on the inside they can usually...as long as the on coming traffic and those behind you know what you're up to there shouldn't be a problem....But I know I feel vulnerable standing inbetween two lanes of moving traffic waiting for a gap :shock:

dang65 wrote:

But how the hell do you get the message across? What does Cyclecraft have to say about this, anyone know?

Cyclecraft pgs 108-110 and 126-128 say something along the lines of:

Start off 100m off, check behind you at least twice, at 50m choose a gap, check signal move over to the centre - if just the one lane in a quick smooth maneuver. stay about 1m to the left of the line and pick your time to cross...

If it's more than 1 lane..Start thinking about 100m back, indicate, wait for someone to let you in, if they won't, don't force it, wait for someone who will (when they do, say thanks) move across that lane, but don't more all the way across until you can get into the next lane...keep going until you're in the centre, and pick your time

Well that's roughly what is has to say...but go buy the book for yerself, it's worth it
.

dang65

I have to say, that's pretty much exactly what I do at the moment. I don't really have a problem moving out, and I've never had someone drive into the back of me, so I guess I'm signalling clearly enough and making my intentions evident. The trouble is, drivers still overtake me when I'm in the middle of the road, almost at the junction, arm sticking out, about to turn!

There are three places on my commute where this happens, and I'd say it's a minimum of four times a week that I get a blatant overtake in that position. I've often thought of setting up a couple of cameras at those points and then riding through the junction a few times. I don't think it would take long to catch it on film. But who can be bothered with that?

One of the places I'm including is actually a sharp right turn in the road, rather than a junction. On the outside of this corner there is a road off to the left. I often have cars overtake me on the corner, then hang a left into the side turning. Because of this, I actually move out into the middle of the road as I go round the bend, to stop anyone overtaking me at a frankly insane point. Get regular scowls and even beeps from drivers for doing this, and some of them still overtake me, but at least I've given myself plenty of space to escape into.

dang65

feaseyrider wrote:

MIRRORS????
i been pondering over this for a while as looking over my shoulder is getting risky like you say one look yep good to move over then next look sure enough driver with no brain must overtake you ...

so would you reccommend if so which?

Some people are very anti-mirror because they think they stop you glancing over your shoulder. Well, I still glance over my shoulder when I'm actually manoeuvring, but I've found having a mirror to be an absolute revelation when riding along fast, bumpy roads where you're often hanging on for dear life just riding along and concentrating on the road ahead.

So, yes, for this kind of road I would absolutely recommend a mirror without reservation.

I have a hybrid, so the mirror just slots into the end of the handlebar, and you can easily swap it over if you take your bike to the continent.

I use this one at the moment, but there are many different types available.