Stopping in the wet

Alibran

I'm not sure if this is normal for a road bike, but it wasn't the case on my old hybrid, and it's making me a bit nervous when it's raining.

I've never had any problems with grip from my tyres - probably because I'm way too scared to go fast in the wet - but I have had problems with the brakes themselves. Once you get a bit of water on the road, and the brakes and wheel rims start to get wet, I sometimes find it very hard to stop. The pads just seem to slip against the rims, and nothing happens, and if I'm on the hoods, I sometimes can't get the leverage to pull the brakes on much at all. I have to get on the drops to stand any chance of stopping.

My bike is a Trek 1.2 WSD, and the brakes are the standard specification, described on the Trek website as "alloy dual pivot". The levers are upgraded to Tiagra, but I can't see that makes much difference. The wheel rims are Alex alloy.

Is this something I just have to put up with or is there something that can be done about it. Better pads? Brakes? Rims? At the moment, I don't feel very safe, and it's really putting me off riding in the wet.

(I don't mean really heavy rain and massive puddles on the road, by the way. Just normal, steady rain.)

John.T

No rim brakes work as well in the wet. The wheels need to turn a couple of times for the pads to clear the water. Some pads are better than others. Hard ones do not clear as well as soft ones. I have found that Koolstop Salmon pads are pretty good in all conditions and are kind to rims as well.
Try Spa cycles here. http://www.spacycles.co.uk/brands/http--wwwkoolstopcom-.php . The Dura ones are good. If you have one piece pads you will need to get the Dura holders first time, then just the pads as they wear out. They are fairly long lasting, the ones on my summer bike have been in for over 3 years now, about 10000 miles and the ones on my winter bike should do a second winter with no trouble.
Swiss-stop also get good reports but I have not used them.

dvlrnr

I've yet to try them myself, but I've seen Kool Stop brake pads recommended on several occasions.

biondino

10,000 miles on one set of brake pads? Wow! I have Ultegra pads and maybe get 1,000 miles out of them. But then about half my riding is from traffic light to traffic light commuting in central London.

feel

better brake pads will help, but also try cleaning some of the horrible black gunk off your rims first. Use kitchen towel ,white spirit and wire wool.

Mark Alexander

water makes breaks slippery. keep it all clean to work as best as possible. I find that Campag breaks are more effective than my Shimano by a huge margin.

I've just changed some Campag brake blocks that have lasted 4 years and 12,000 miles in wet and dry conditions.

John.T

Breaks are when you knock off for tea. Brakes are what you stop with. Not being pedantic but this mistake is creeping in everywhere.

fizz

I had shimano 105 pads, I've just changed to black koolstops.

The koolstops dont have as much initial bite in the wet as the shimano pads did.The benefit for me is that they give a better level of feel through the lever and also they dont seem to be picking up little flinty bits of alloy of the rims either.

the Shimanos do give better overall performance in the dry though

biondino

Actually this thread reminds me - my back rim (an Alex 450, I think?) has a substantial score all the way round it from, I guess, a stubborn piece of grit that was at some point stuck there. It's less than a millimetre deep but should I worry about the whole rim losing integrity at a catastrophic moment?

Hmm, I'm sure there is an existing thread about what to look out for in terms of equipment fatigue and failure warning signs, should go and see if I can find one...

John.T

The Salmon ones (orange) are for wet conditions but they work OK in the dry. Definately better than the 9sp Shimano Ultegra ones. The 10sp Ultegra seem better but I have not done many wet miles with them yet so can not comment. They do seem very good in the dry, almost too keen.

gtr mart

I have the ultegra 10 speed and had to pull the bike up from 40+ mph in the wet this morning without any problems - other than the rear wheel intermittantly locking.

Was an emergency stop too - as had to retrieve my mobile phone which had flown out of my (unzipped) jacket pocket! :oops:

dazzawazza

Also make sure your cables are clean and lubed, or get new ones if they are corroding.

DavidBelcher

feel wrote:

better brake pads will help, but also try cleaning some of the horrible black gunk off your rims first. Use kitchen towel ,white spirit and wire wool.

Halfords/Weldtite (it's all made at the same factory) chrome polish is also good for cleaning up the braking surfaces on rims - it's a gooey, toothpaste-like polish as opposed to the runny "Brasso" types and is very slightly slightly abrasive. The fishy niff is a bit off-putting at first, but it does get rid of the grease and other muck that causes squealing brakes etc. and should improve braking in the wet a little.

David

Alibran

Thanks. I'll give everything a good clean (do this weekly, anyway, but I'll make sure I'm really thorough), and have a look at some of the pads mentioned. All I want at the moment is to feel safe!

jed1978

agree with earlier poster that rims are just as important as brake pads.

ensure that your rims are not overly worn as well as clean.

on the road

You just need to give yourself more braking distance when it's wet.

cooper.michael1

Dual pivots are crap, and id say almost leathal in the wet!

ean

biondino wrote:

Actually this thread reminds me - my back rim (an Alex 450, I think?) has a substantial score all the way round it .

That is probably the wear indicator. When it's gone change the rim.

John.T

C.M1. Yours might be but all mine are OK. Perhaps you should do something about them.

Alibran

on the road wrote:

You just need to give yourself more braking distance when it's wet.

But how much more distance? Twice, like they suggest in a car? Three times, four times, five times?

This isn't a problem with my brakes taking a while to grip the rims, or the tyres not gripping the road as well. (My tyres have never lost grip when braking in the wet, probably because I can't brake hard enough to make them lose grip.) The biggest problem is, when I'm going downhill on the hoods, and it's wet, I can't stop at all. And it's really frightening when you're approaching a roundabout, and you have to slow down so much to make sure you can stop that it would almost be quicker to get off and walk.

feel

If you can't improve the performance of your brakes in the wet (by cleaning rims, lubing cables and changing blocks) then you also need to slow down as you can't always predict when you are going to have to brake suddenly.

John.T

When descending in the wet you should just ease the brakes on to the rims well before a corner. Then when you need to use them the rims are drier and they will work far sooner. I think I allow about twice the braking distance in the wet but I am more concerned about locking up than the brakes not being up to the job. I have total confidence in the Koolstp Salmon pads. The other year I came down the Toumalet to St-Marie-Campan in thick cloud and heavy rain. I was touching 35 mph in places but never had any 'moments'. The Salmons and Conti Attack and Force tyres were well up to the job.

W5454

I'm using some Wilco brake blocks which cost 50p a pack about 5yrs ago.The packet says "for steel rims" but they work on my alloy rims in any weather.