Upgrading from Sora to Tiagra shifters + higher components?

dazzawazza

I've purchased some Tiagra shifters second hand for £20 so I’m planning to upgrade from Sora on my Allez.
My plan is to upgrade the rest of the components to a higher grade than Tiagra; either 105 or Ultegra.
I have many questions, but will start with the chainset, as I have a component on special sitting in a website's checkout, so I need an answer quite quickly:

I can purchase a Shimano Ultegra Chainset Octalink Double 6500 9spd (39.53 ratio) for £39.00, which seems a bargain?
Will this be compatible with the triple Tiagra shifters?
Also, I know that I'll need an Octalink BB, are these ok as there are rumours of them coming loose?

I have more questions that I'll add later, thanks.
(I'm in no hurry as Sora has been very reliable and is still going strong, so will buy parts as they become available on special.)

redddraggon

Chainsets aren't really groupset or speed specific (even if they say they are), so the chainset would work fine.

(Octalink - I don't know anything about that)

keef66

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/gloss_n-o.html

and scroll down a bit

explanation of octalink with lovely pics. It's Shimano's proprietary way of attaching the cranks to the bb axle. So if you have Octalink cranks, you need to have an Octalink BB too

dazzawazza

I'm looking to buy the Shimano 105 Bottom Bracket Octalink 5500, but don't know which size to get:

'68-109mm' or '70-109mm Italian' ?? What is meant by Italian?
Is an Allez compatible with a 68mm or 70mm shell width?

I'm assuming that the 105 BB is compatible with the Ultegra 6500 Chainset as they are both Octalink V1?

Also can someone confirm that a Tiagra triple shifter (older style, not the current model) will work perfectly with a double chainset? Thanks

John.T

68-109 is the BB for most non Italian frames and is to fit a 68mm BB shell and a double chainset. It has a LH thread on the drive side. The Italian 70-109 is to fit a 70mm BB shell with RH threads on both sides. As the name says, for Italian frames although some of these are now made with English or BSA 68mm BB shells.
Octalink BBs are fine. As good as the same level square taper.
The shifter should work OK with a double. You may need to change to a double front mech as the geametry is slightly different but it may work. Try it first.

dazzawazza

Thanks John.T.
I have read that the Ultegra Octalink BB is far superior to the 105, but I can't source it at 68-109. So I will have to settle for the 105 BB, which I can get for £16.99 at 40% discount so it isn't too bad.

dazzawazza

Here is my full drive system upgrade:

Tiagra 9spd Shifters (Secondhand) £20
Shimano Ultegra Chainset Octalink Double 6500 170mm 39.53 £39.99
Shimano 105 Bottom Bracket Octalink 5500 68-109mm £16.99
Shimano Ultegra Front Derailleur Double 6500 31.8mm £21.99
Shimano Ultegra Rear Derailleur 9 Speed 6500 GS Short Cage £29.99
Shimano HG93 Chain 9 Speed £14.99
Shimano Ultegra Cassette 9 Speed 6500 12-25 £24.99

Total cost £168.94 (plus the cost of bar tape and cables if required)

I’m also planning to spend £150-£200 on new wheels when funds permit.

A few questions:

1) Am I spending too much on upgrading a £530 Allez (at the time the full Tiagra Allez Sport was about £700)?
2) Should I purchase an SRAM powerlink chain instead?
3) Instead of the 12-25, I could purchase a 12-27 cassette to go with the 39.53 chainset. Will this combination work with a short cage derailleur? It may be a better lower range considering I’m used to a triple and there’s the possibility of me moving to a hilly city in about a year. I have considered a compact or remaining with a triple chainset, but finally decided to try a double chainset.

Thanks

redddraggon

dazzawazza wrote:

2) Should I purchase an SRAM powerlink chain instead?

KMC or Wippermann chains are the best. (Although SRAM is probably OK)

John.T

Short cage will work with 12/27 on 53/39 with room to spare. The official limit is 50/34 with12/27 but it will push a little further with great care in set-up. I would go for the 12/27 as it gives a better spread of low gears without compromising the higher ones.
If you like the frame then it is worth upgrading.

SDP

get some new cables allround

i would go for a KMC or SRAM chain ( easier maintanance with quick link )

i wouldalso go for a 6600 REAR derailleur & spend a few quid more...i have had both & 6600 runs spot on with a 9 sp ...

you couldsave a few quid on a 105 cassette...

andy_wrx

Agreed.
- SRAM or KMC chain with joining link rather than Shimano with that bl**dy silly joining pin

- 105 5500 cassette would be cheaper than Ultegra 6500 and you'd probably not know the difference, on a part which will wear-out in time anyway

- in same vein, I might even go for a 105 5500 front mech to save a few quid, but do go with Ultegra rear

- *definitely* new cables, as if your existing cables are gunked-up, £-for-£ you'll get a much better gearchange quality from this alone rather than changing the mechs, etc.
And if the ends are frayed, you'll be forced to anyway when you fit the shifters.

- and definitely new bartape too - what's it cost, a fiver ?
Don't 'spoil the ship for a ha'p'orth of tar' !

What about brakes - you're surely going to upgrade them too rather than stick with the Tektro things it came with ?

You will notice an upgrade to the wheels as you say, but the ones on the Allez Sport are probably not that much cop either, it's the single item which tends to be the lowest spec on any bike you buy and the best upgrade you can do.

I upgraded my 2004 base-model Allez with secondhand Ultegra 9sp shifters and various 105 or Ultegra bits I bought bit-by-bit cheaply on eBay last Summer.
It serves as Winter/wet/occasional commuter and was worth upgrading inexpensively - it's judged to be one of the lightest and best frames on £500-range bikes, the same frame as Spesh used on the £750 Sport and £1000 Elite in 2004, only the Comp had the E5 frame

dazzawazza

Thanks for the advice.
I'm going to place the order tonight as haven't had time from work.
I quickly visited the site at lunch and discovered that the chainset has increased in price by £10 so I'm gutted.
I'm going to visit the site from home and see if the cached shopping basket keeps the old price.
I have a feeling that my basket has affected the price as in the 'people who purchased this product also purchased' section it lists everything I had in my shopping basket, but I never completed the purchase.

acorn_user

A few questions:

1) Am I spending too much on upgrading a £530 Allez (at the time the full Tiagra Allez Sport was about £700)?

No, Specialized generally uses quite a nice frame for the Allez, so your upgrades are sensible.

2) Should I purchase an SRAM powerlink chain instead?

Yes!

3) Instead of the 12-25, I could purchase a 12-27 cassette to go with the 39.53 chainset. Will this combination work with a short cage derailleur?

Yes, that will be fine.

I don't recall whether Tiagra shifters are specific to double or triple. I know that Sora and Dura Ace are/were, but I think the midrange ones will be ok.

Italian is the bottom bracket threading. You need British (also known as BSC).

dazzawazza

andy_wrx wrote:

What about brakes - you're surely going to upgrade them too rather than stick with the Tektro things it came with ?

I have Koolstop Salmon pads and the braking performance is good so I wont be spending money on brakes at the moment.
I have noticed that it's harder to pull on the brake levers since Winter, concluding that the cables need cleaning. So replacing my cables is a good idea.

dazzawazza

Which KMC or SRAM chain should I run with the Ultegra components?

SRAM PC971 Chain 9sp 17.99
SRAM PC951 Chain 9sp £11.99
SRAM PC991 Chain 9sp £19.99
KMC X9 Light Chain Silver 9 Speed £18.99
KMC X9 93 Chain Silver - Silver 9 Speed £11.99

I don't really want to spend more than £20 unless it means a considerable performance increase for the extra money. Thanks

John.T

Any of them will do. The dearer ones may last a bit longer. That is about all.

redddraggon

The £11.99 KMC chain would do you fine, it's definitely a winner.

Of course gold KMC chains make you go faster

dazzawazza

Apart from new cables I have completed my upgrade orders:

Shimano 105 Bottom Bracket Octalink 5500 68-109mm
Shimano Ultegra Front Derailleur Double 6500 31.8mm
Shimano Ultegra Cassette 9 Speed 6500 12-27
ShimanoUltegra Rear Derailleur 10 Speed 6600 GS Short Cage
KMC X9 Light Chain Silver 9 Speed
XLC Handlebar Tape Cork Gel Bar Tape Red
Shimano Ultegra Chainset Octalink Double 6500 170mm 39/53

XERO Lite XR-1 Bladed Wheelset

Total cost £368 (I'll be eating home made tuna sandwiches for lunch for a long time).

Can someone please recommend where to order some well priced good cables for road bikes? The housing needs to b e black.

John C.

dazzawazza wrote:

andy_wrx wrote:

What about brakes - you're surely going to upgrade them too rather than stick with the Tektro things it came with ?

I have Koolstop Salmon pads and the braking performance is good so I wont be spending money on brakes at the moment.
I have noticed that it's harder to pull on the brake levers since Winter, concluding that the cables need cleaning. So replacing my cables is a good idea.

I thought my tectro brakes were good untill I upgraded to 105 with koolstop pads. These were superb on the Fred Whitton where good brakes are as important as good legs

dazzawazza

I'll see how my cashflow is in a couple of months then I might get a new brakeset.
Is the 105 brakeset the best value for money? Also do they come with cables?

The spending never ends :shock:

dazzawazza

I've completed the upgrade. It took quite a while as I haven't had a lot of spare time over the last month.







I'm unsure about the bar tape colour and will probably change it back to black (it's not the deep red colour I was hoping).
I'm also worried about flex in the XR-1 wheels after reading some negative reviews (after the purchase of course). Hopefully it won't be an issue as I only weigh 160 pounds. After a hundred miles or so I’ll get them trued up and the spoke tensions checked. Any recommendations where in London to get this done properly? I’d prefer to spend more for a good job?

FSR_XC

Looking very nice.

How much were the wheels?

I like the look of them. Has anyone got any opinions on them?

I'm currently using Mavic CXP22. Anyone know how they compare.

dazzawazza

The Xero XR-1s were £190 with the bladed spoke option.
The advertised weight has been stated as 1520g, however the verified weight is 1608g.
I weighed them on my kitchen scales and got a figure very close to the verified weight.
I've read mixed reviews about the wheels. Some reviews say the wheels are very strong and stiff and others say they aren’t very stiff and flex.
I haven't gone for a proper test ride yet, but will let you know the verdict after a blast around Richmond Park. I'll adjust the brakes very close to the rims so if there is any flex, it will be noticed.

dazzawazza

I've been for several rides now and haven't noticed any flex at all so I'm happy with the wheels. Also, after commuting a couple of times on them and hitting a few pot holes they are still true.
I’ll take them to the bike shop in a couple of weeks to get the spoke tensions checked, just to be sure.

Lagavulin

That's a tasty looking bike you've got there. 8)

FWIW my front Tiagra calliper was buggered so I upgraded to 105 5600. It's got the stock Shimano pads in at present but it does feel noticeably better. Since I've decided to keep my Allez (at least for the short-term) I'm tempted to buy a 105 rear calliper as well.

Richamp

Dazz, I'm halfway through the same process having changed the cassette to 9 speed and the the levers to the latest Tiagra, works prefectly. The chainset is a triple and I want to change this to a double, however this has implications for the bb and I've noticed you changed yours, getting an octalink bb. The 2004 allez has square taper and I'm not sure if I can just change to octalink, I should add I have nothing against square taper other than the chainsets are becoming hard to come by.

Did you change from square taper to octalink?

dazzawazza

Hi Richamp

My 2007 Allez originally had a Sora Triple with Octalink V2. The Ultegra double chainset required an Octalink V1 BB so I changed it to a 105 BB 68-109mm.
Be aware that there are two different versions of Octalink, V1 and V2. I think that Sora and Tiagra use V2, whilst 105 onward use V1. Also for the Allez don't get the Italian version of the BB.
In regards to replacing the square taper BB with Octalink, I don't think this will be a problem, but I'm not absolutely certain.
Which chainset are you planning to get? I would recommend looking on the chainreactioncycles website as there are some good deals on the Octalink 9spd chainsets.
I'm very happy with my Ultegra 6500 170mm 39/53. I've got a 12-27 cassette, but I haven't used the lowest gear yet. It's good to know it's there though.
Post a picture on this thread when you've finished. Cheers

Richamp

Dazz, thanks for the info, I'll likely get a 39/53 probably tiagra, I use this bike to go to work but I also want to have a bash at time trialling to see if I like it but without, initaitaly at least, spending much.