Kona Paddy Wagon

daz51

Hey guys,

I love this bike and with me wanting to get into fixed riding with a free wheel option i have decided to look at getting one .........................

any one got any thoughts on this bike ??????????????

meagain

Never ridden one so thoughts only....at SRP it is, like most Konas, a bit on the pricey side. And I think that the strange stilleto forks look odd - and detract from what is otherwise a NICE looker, but beauty is of course in the eye of the beholder. Didn't notice whether or not it'll take proper 'grds - again entirely personal but I can see no point to a fixed (a major benefit of which is bad weather riding!) without.

The fixed/free option is I think worth having, certainly initially.

Have fun!

daz51

Meagain,

I totally agree with you, If you take into consideration that the giant offering is only £350, Specialized Langster + Lanster London are £399 and even a Specialized Tricross single speed is £449 then yes it does seem quite pricey.

But.......... Kona are alot like Cannondale in the fact that they ride brilliantly well and smooth.

what you think ?

meagain

Yes Konas ARE pretty good but I'm not sure that such a simple bike is worth a brand-premium! Ridden only 1 'dale (their s/s offering from a couple of years ago) and I was very disappointed.

On looks I'd go for the Tricross Single!

NorwegianBlue

Well I don't like the tricross for looks, but only because they've left some "braze" ons on there for gears. A bit silly because they've gone to the trouble of putting track ends on, so why not delete the braze ons at the same time?

Therein lies some of the explanation of pricing differences. Some of the fixies out there share a lot of parts with the budget road bikes, right down to the frame with different rear fork ends. Others don't, sometimes because the brand in question doesn't do a budget road bike so they can't pull that particular financial trick. Then there is the issue of economies of scale, some brands are never going to sell as many as others. The likes of Spesh and Giant sell a squillion more bikes a year than Kona. They therefore have more buying power than Kona, who are pretty big in the MTB arena but a real niche brand in road circles.

However, probably the biggest price differentiator on the Kona is that rather nice Dedacciai butted cro mo frame. If steel is your thing that alone should justify the price premium. If steel doesn't float your boat then you probably wouldn't consider it anyway.

Having said all of that I think that the current trend for fixies is keeping prices artificially high, and most entry level fixies are overpriced IMESHO. A few years back there was little demand, there were precious few models on the market and sales figures were low. Economies of scale would have played a large part in pricing structures. Now demand is high, as are sales, so you would expect to see a significant drop in prices. However they have stayed pretty static, indeed the average price of entry level fixies in has probably risen in the last few years as more bikes have come onto the market around the £500-550 price point. During the same period entry level geared road bikes have either got cheaper, or the spec has improved at the same price point. The only bike that seems to be really bucking the trend is the Revolution Courier S1ngle, not one for the drop bar set but if they make a success of it maybe there will be fixed version of their Continental Race along next year.

As for mounting guards on an off the peg fixie: How many of the current crop of off the peg fixies have the braze ons for this? Looking at the big picture on the Kona website it appears that there are a couple of unusually located allen bolts on the bottom of the seat stays and fork legs. Are these for mounting guards?

meagain

The frameset at Byers has mountings etc

http://www.byercycles.co.uk/bikeprice%2 ... 08/06.html

Looks to be on Offer at 140 quid. Not a bad price. I think they also do complete builds - and if of importance to you (and I can't see why it should be!) it's steel.

NorwegianBlue

Looks nicem but even for that price it would be difficult to build a bike from all new parts for much short of £500. Add wheels and tyres and you're already up to £300.

It's always the same building a bike from parts, the profits on idividual parts always add up to more than the profits on a whole bike. Also it's easy to ignore shipping costs (or the cost of repeated trips to the bike shop) when building a bike up from parts.

meagain

You are of course quite right, not a bad deal if got some/most of the parts on the shelf though! And the complete bike is also on offer at £449.

NorwegianBlue

meagain wrote:

You are of course quite right, not a bad deal if got some/most of the parts on the shelf though! And the complete bike is also on offer at £449.

Now £449 for the complete bike is a pretty good deal, but I'd probably prefer the Kona for the same price simply because I know Kona have tendency to build good solid bikes where everything works right out of the box. No disrespect to Byers, you understand, but I'm something of a conservative in these matters and would rather deal with a known quantity.

meagain

I THINK that (as a shop) Byers been around longer than Kona! But certainly K's buying power for the components is greater - then so are their overheads!

NorwegianBlue

meagain wrote:

I THINK that (as a shop) Byers been around longer than Kona! But certainly K's buying power for the components is greater - then so are their overheads!

It's not so much the length of experience, more that I've dealt with a few Konas in my time and even the cheap ones like the Smoke are solid, well built and designed bikes. Byers may well build bikes to a similar or even better standard, but I've never experienced their bikes.

It may be unadventurous of me, but I'd rather stick with stuff I know when it comes to parting with large amounts of money.

GJ

daz51

well guys i have come to a decision,

I am going to go for the Specialized Tricross single. It will make an excellant winter training bike aswell as making do for some old railway track work.

So anyone got an experiences of this bike ?

NorwegianBlue

Out of interest, does the Tricross single have a fixed/free flip flop like the Langster?

gkerr4

i thought it came with the same hubs, but doesn't come with a 'fixed' cog as std - just the freewheel side for some reason. You need to add a fixed cog yourself.

daz51

Tricross comes with just a freewheel, and the rear is a 18t instead of a 16t. I suppose in Specializeds eyes this bike would be used for a purpose and therefore would not require a fixed as standard.

I will be putting a fixed on though.

meagain

"On looks I'd go for the Tricross Single!" [3 May]

What excellent taste you have daz!

daz51

well Meagain,

If you look at the kona paddy wagon. Its only a steel frame and fork and it comes with road tyres.

If i spend the same amount of money on the Tricross, i get an aliminium frame with carbon fork and nice tyres for the winter.

as i want to use it for winter training, it should be ideal

NorwegianBlue

daz51 wrote:

well Meagain,

If you look at the kona paddy wagon. Its only a steel frame and fork and it comes with road tyres.

If i spend the same amount of money on the Tricross, i get an aliminium frame with carbon fork and nice tyres for the winter.

as i want to use it for winter training, it should be ideal

"Only a steel frame". I like it, I like it a lot.

Dedacciai 12.5 COM butted chromium molybdenum steel could hardly be called "only steel". I would say that was one of the major selling points of Mr White's creation over the anonymous mass produced Taiwanese aluminium of the Langster.

meagain

"only steel".

But it IS! I also would deinitely go with the Tricross - especially for the carbon fork - great on off-tarmac IME.

NorwegianBlue

I've never been a great adherant of steel over aluminium, except these days of spiralling aluminium prices. Only few years ago a quality cro-mo tubeset would cost significantly more than a cheap aluminium equivalent. Which meant that most cheap steel framed bikes were made from plain gauge so called "hi-ten" steel. A couple of years ago you wouldn't have seen a steel frame at this cost simply because they couldn't have done quality steel at that price.

I don't think that an aluminium frame at that end of the market is a good as it was three or four years ago. Certainly the current Langster doesn't feel as lively as the 2005 model.

When it comes to forks I'm also a bit sceptical about any rigid fork that claims to give a good ride of road. Enough flexibility to give any noticeably ride improvement would be too flexible to give good control. Sure carbon will reduce road buzz, but it's not going to absorb trail bumps.

The same argument applies to those who claim a steel frame will give a more comfortable ride than aluminium or carbon. Enough vertical compliance to improve comfort would have your rear wheel wobbling all over the place when cornering.

When it comes to absorbing lumps and bumps you're wheels will flex more than the frame and fork anyway. One of the reasons I don't like aero rims is that they give a harsher ride than traditional rims.

In short a quality frameset is a quality frameset regardless of material.

GJ

attica

My thoughts on the Paddywagon are here.

http://www.bikeradar.com/gear/category/bikes/road/product/paddy-wagon-06-8998

and yes, I am still loving it.