The bicycle as a tool of political opression........
it was a sad sight - watching the police cyclists `protecting` the flame in London.
And another thing - who on Earth selected the Suga Babes a suitable torch bearers - and that Coca Cola bus .........
What a fantastic portrayal of the Olmpic ideal.
Free Tibet.
And another thing - who on Earth selected the Suga Babes a suitable torch bearers - and that Coca Cola bus .........
What a fantastic portrayal of the Olmpic ideal.
Free Tibet.
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I don't know why there is this sudden furore over China and Tibet. This was always going to be a factor. You need to look years back to before China were even awarded the games. They had no concern for Tianamen Square and the public crushing of protesters and didn't reform or apologise since - so what changed in the interim years. Tibet was an issue then also.
Where were all these public and hollywood figures shouting down china then? Its only in the last few months they have been coming out the woodwork and jumping onto a bandwagon. Too many govt were all too easily and readily willing too jump into bed with china for a few $$$s. The genie is out the bottle but for govts to protest now on the eve of the olympics is too little too late.0 -
Top_Bhoy wrote:I don't know why there is this sudden furore over China and Tibet. This was always going to be a factor. You need to look years back to before China were even awarded the games. They had no concern for Tianamen Square and the public crushing of protesters and didn't reform or apologise since - so what changed in the interim years. Tibet was an issue then also.
Where were all these public and hollywood figures shouting down china then? Its only in the last few months they have been coming out the woodwork and jumping onto a bandwagon. Too many govt were all too easily and readily willing too jump into bed with china for a few $$$s. The genie is out the bottle but for govts to protest now on the eve of the olympics is too little too late.
It's never too late if it's the right thing to do.
Free Tibet, stop Chinese support for the Darfur genocide, support free speech for China,amongst other heinous Chinese government crimes.Old hippies don't die, they just lie low until the laughter stops and their time comes round again.
Joseph Gallivan0 -
julianm wrote:it was a sad sight - watching the police cyclists `protecting` the flame in London.
At the speed it was going, police motorbikes would probably be struggling to stay upright, and since the police have forgotten the method of transport known as Walking. It's hardly surprise they used pedal cycles.Do Nellyphants count?
Commuter: FCN 9
Cheapo Roadie: FCN 5
Off Road: FCN 11
+1 when I don't get round to shaving for x days0 -
Can I recommend the Rough Guide to the History of China, a simple but very accessible account of 5000 years of trying to keep control of one of the largest territories and populations on the planet. It is an utter miracle that China is a country at all.
Particularly interesting are the parts about how the free and civilised Europeans have interacted with China over the last 300 of their 5000 years of civilisation. Having read that, if I were Chinese (which I am not), I would spit with rage at the civilised West and its hypocrisy about human rights.
Who made Afganistan the drug factory of the world? Who carried the opium from there to China? Who sent gun boats up the Yangtse to enforce the continuation of the drug trade?
Who is now busy "stabilising" Afganistan all over again? Who stops dictatorship in Iraq (full of evil insurgents) but not in Zimbabwe (anyone for cricket, chaps?).
What is happening in Tibet is unacceptable. Totally unacceptable. But you can't pretend that the "foreign devils" are the only baddies on the planet.0 -
pneumatic wrote:Can I recommend the Rough Guide to the History of China, a simple but very accessible account of 5000 years of trying to keep control of one of the largest territories and populations on the planet. It is an utter miracle that China is a country at all.
Particularly interesting are the parts about how the free and civilised Europeans have interacted with China over the last 300 of their 5000 years of civilisation. Having read that, if I were Chinese (which I am not), I would spit with rage at the civilised West and its hypocrisy about human rights.
Who made Afganistan the drug factory of the world? Who carried the opium from there to China? Who sent gun boats up the Yangtse to enforce the continuation of the drug trade?
Who is now busy "stabilising" Afganistan all over again? Who stops dictatorship in Iraq (full of evil insurgents) but not in Zimbabwe (anyone for cricket, chaps?).
What is happening in Tibet is unacceptable. Totally unacceptable. But you can't pretend that the "foreign devils" are the only baddies on the planet.
If you told us some of the answers instead of asking all the questions it would save some of us from buying the book
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While I support free speech, the West does need to be careful.
China's political and economic power should not be underestimated. The Chinese have siginficant influence on the global economy and as its interal liquidity increases, could be great territory for venting the current economic pressure.
I also remember reading that China has significant control over the global supply chain. If they decided to play hardball, it could make it difficult to import the goods we need to maintain our quality of life.
I rather suspect that other countries kept pretty quiet about Britain's human rights record as we were busy turning the map pink. Upset one of the world's superpowers at your peril...0 -
Nuggs wrote:China's political and economic power should not be underestimated.
If they decided to play hardball, it could make it difficult to import the goods we need to maintain our quality of life.
I rather suspect that other countries kept pretty quiet about Britain's human rights record as we were busy turning the map pink. Upset one of the world's superpowers at your peril...
Oh yes, and it's contribution to Global Warming, (be it mythical or not)
They're planning to open 562 large, coal fired power stations by 2012, they increased their production of atmospheric carbon by 221milliontonnes between 2003 & 2004 (That's, btw, 6.5x what the UK's road transport emits over the course of a year, 40% more than the UK's total CO2 emissions)
What does China make that we actually need? And what do they make that say India & SE Asia can't produce to fill any shortfall.
When we "ruled the world" the idea of human rights wasn't exactly to the fore.
China had a chance to be the dominant power in the world, between 1421 & 23, Chinese fleets and essentially mapped the world during 5 monumental voyages. If it weren't for a lightning strike causing Peking to burn down, they may well have capitalised on this. As it was, they retreated into isolationism.Remember that you are an Englishman and thus have won first prize in the lottery of life.0 -
Look at any goods around your house and I reckon an absurd percentage will have 'Made in PRC' stamped on them.OffTheBackAdam wrote:What does China make that we actually need? And what do they make that say India & SE Asia can't produce to fill any shortfall.
I am certain that such goods could indeed be made in India/SE Asia (were buying from China for one reason only: the price). However, it would take years to tool up those areas to cope with Western demand. Also, a politically-motivated move to alternative producers is likely to drive prices up as competition becomes artificially stifled.0 -
Chaps
I hate to remind you, but if you wish to keep this site available to the 200 million Chinese behind the Great Firewall of China then this thread has to stop.0 -
Brains wrote:Chaps
I hate to remind you, but if you wish to keep this site available to the 200 million Chinese behind the Great Firewall of China then this thread has to stop.
So if we consent to your request we will now be allowing the Chinese Govt to impinge upon free speech in the 'free world' and they will be getting exactly what they want by curtailing ideas and communication to/from its people.
I think you're going down a dangerous road.0 -
OffTheBackAdam wrote:
Oh yes, and it's contribution to Global Warming, (be it mythical or not)
They're planning to open 562 large, coal fired power stations by 2012, they increased their production of atmospheric carbon by 221milliontonnes between 2003 & 2004 (That's, btw, 6.5x what the UK's road transport emits over the course of a year, 40% more than the UK's total CO2 emissions)
I read along those lines as well.
They have social problems coming their way I think. It is miracle that a country that size with that population is one country. When people are poor they must be easy to control. Once they start making money and wanting more they will be harder to control.0 -
In amongst all the MMGW tosh, the enormous elephant in the room that no one's had the guts to take action about so far is the world's increasing population. That's going to be the thing that really stretches our resources...richardjallen wrote:They have social problems coming their way I think. It is miracle that a country that size with that population is one country. When people are poor they must be easy to control. Once they start making money and wanting more they will be harder to control.0
