Avid Juicy 3 lever travel

Sikora

Went to have a look at a Rockhopper Pro today, but found that the Juicy 3 brakes had loads of travel in the levers, with the rear brake almost touching the handlebar grips before it started dragging on the disc. Can this be sorted with a simple bleed, or is it just a case of them not having been bedded in yet?
Also found them to be quite spongey too, is this just an Avid trait?

muddylegs

I had the same problem with my 3's my LBS said that is how they are. (Rubbish)
So when i finally found the instruction i managed to get them sorted.
All i did was increase the reach of the lever by turning a tiny allen key behind the lever they are absoultly great now.
When you have done this remeber you dont have to pull on the levers as hard

dav1

there is a small (2mm I think) hex key bolt in the lever which you can use to ajust the lever travel. Read the manual and it will tell you exactly how to do this.

My 5s came in the same way, it seems they wind it down to minimum in a new brake.

Sikora

Brilliant, i'll have a fiddle when i pick the bike up.
The lad in the LBS said to cable tie the brake lever to the handlebar and leave it to re-presurize over night? Anyone heard anything like this before? can see how on earth that would work on a sealed unit?

Marjory Stewart BAxtor

Sikora, I have same trouble
http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtop ... t=12561322

I'll try it on mine when this blasted hangover has passed and we can compare notes

Sikora

Let me know how you get on. If its just a case of adjusting a screw, i'll have a go at it myself, otherwise i'll get the LBS to have a look at them before i pick the bike up.
Only problem i can see with adjusting this screw so early in pad life is that once they start wearing down, there will be no adjustability left on the screw.

I have read though that Avid brakes do have a distinctive feel to them. I currently have Magura HS33's on my Scott and i love the wooden on/off feel and have the lever travel set to almost minimum movement before enagement.

Marjory Stewart BAxtor

easy adjustment. just make sure you turn the smaller screw as the larger one next to it is a lug nut that keeps the spindle for the lever in place. I adjusted that by mistake and the lever fell off lol.

had to screw the adjusting lug quite far in but seems to be working okayish now. Still concerned that my lever piston isn't working but have a sensible amount of ravel now

Sikora

Could you tell how much travel was left on the screw for future adjustment?

Marjory Stewart BAxtor

not a lot. was recessed into the thread quite a bit

heez29

it will probably need more fluid in it. That occasionally happens to brand new juicys (well in my experience) out the box or on the bike. never felt right. Sometimes it goes once youve pulled the lever a few times (well like a hundred :P).

What you could try n blag is a free bleed as it should fix you're problem! sounds like there is too much air in the system!

dav1

1 click alters the lever travel by 1mm, I remember i had to do anout 20 od clicks on my 5s to get em sweet when i first set them up.

Sikora

Think i'll get the shop to tinker with them before i pick it up. I'm spending enough on the bike, so they shouldn't have a problem with it.

Marjory Stewart BAxtor

didn't hear any clicks

nicklouse

there is no clicking device on the lever adjust. More likely to be the allen key slipping or catching on the lever.

PHC

There's no audible click but you can feel "notches" when turning the adjuster and these can be counted (should you feel the need).

nicklouse

PHC wrote:

There's no audible click but you can feel "notches" when turning the adjuster and these can be counted (should you feel the need).

nope there are no notches. like i said. allen key slipping or pressing on the lever.

it is a plain threaded adjuster.

PHC

nicklouse wrote:

PHC wrote:

There's no audible click but you can feel "notches" when turning the adjuster and these can be counted (should you feel the need).

nope there are no notches. like i said. allen key slipping or pressing on the lever.

it is a plain threaded adjuster.

My experience and Avid's technical manual suggest otherwise.

From the manual - "Use a 2mm hex wrench to adjust the reach if necessary.
One click equals 1mm of adjustment."

http://www.sram.com/_media/techdocs/95. ... 03%205.pdf

Sub 10

I'm going to try this on my Rockhopper Comp '08, they feel ok at the moment, but I would like them to 'come in' a little quicker.

Have fun with the Pro, I bought my Comp a few weeks ago and absolutely love it!

mr mangos

Don't know about the 5s but the 3s definitely don't have a clicking adjuster. I've got mine wound out so the lever's at full stop when parallel to the bar. I one-finger brake and this leaves plenty of room for the rest of my fingers.

PHC

mr mangos wrote:

Don't know about the 5s but the 3s definitely don't have a clicking adjuster. I've got mine wound out so the lever's at full stop when parallel to the bar. I one-finger brake and this leaves plenty of room for the rest of my fingers.

Must be a difference between the 5s and the 3s that's not clear from the face of the manual. The 5s definitely have a "clicking adjuster". Oh well, I stand corrected!

Marjory Stewart BAxtor

the manual is for the five and three

dhutch

mr mangos wrote:

Don't know about the 5s but the 3s definitely don't have a clicking adjuster. I've got mine wound out so the lever's at full stop when parallel to the bar. I one-finger brake and this leaves plenty of room for the rest of my fingers.

Yeah i did the same.
- When i got them (rockhopper disk 07) they came back miles and you couldnt even lock the wheel before the lever hit the bars.
- Twiddled a bit to get the reach as you described, broke them in a bit, and they've been good as gold all of last year.
- Gone in for there second set of pads and a whole bike service this lunchtime and he said he would rebleed them although they bearly need doing. The front ones just a bit out, presumably from the number of times ive had the front wheel house and knocked the lever a bit.


Daniel

dhutch

mr mangos wrote:

Don't know about the 5s but the 3s definitely don't have a clicking adjuster. I've got mine wound out so the lever's at full stop when parallel to the bar. I one-finger brake and this leaves plenty of room for the rest of my fingers.

Yeah i did the same.
- When i got them (rockhopper disk 07) they came back miles and you couldnt even lock the wheel before the lever hit the bars.
- Twiddled a bit to get the reach as you described, broke them in a bit, and they've been good as gold all of last year.
- Gone in for there second set of pads and a whole bike service this lunchtime and he said he would rebleed them although they bearly need doing. The front ones just a bit out, presumably from the number of times ive had the front wheel house and knocked the lever a bit.


Daniel

Inverted8

This adjustment is only for reach. It does not alter the bite point for the brakes! If you adjust the reach to the min it will bottom out on the grips and the bite point is not reached. I just upgraded from Rockhopper with Shimano discs to Stumpjumper Avid Juicy 5s. The Shimanos had much better bite point. The Juicys - you have to pull the levers to at least 75% until it bites. WTF? I don't like it. I should have noticed this when I test rode the bike, but unfortunately I didn't think much of it until I ridden it after a while especially downhill when my fingers are constantly pulling on the brake levers

I'm taking my new Stumpy back to the shop to get this sorted.

nicklouse

give them time to bed in and settle. brakes need using for a bit until they are right. if you wish you can force the issue by removing the wheel and applying the brake a bit to cause the pistons to sit out abit.


But just adjusting the lever reach for the start does much the same until things have settled.

skyliner

When I set up a bike for sale with Avids I set the brake lever span adjust to the customer's preference, then make the brake work to suit them. Not the other way around.

Poor setup is the cause of this. Mostly at the caliper. Another cause is shortening hoses then not bleeding afterwards. It's laziness on the part of the shop mechanics in most cases. Although it may not beome apparent until after a few rides.

andy__h

This exact problem had been bugging me since I picked up my 08 'hopper pro last year. I also read about the spongey feel to Avids and after doing the trick with clamping the lever overnight (and making little difference), assumed that the brakes didn't need bleeding and that was just the 'feel' referred to and the nature of the brakes. Note that I'd read the manual previously and that the screw adjustment mentioned is classisifed as setting the lever 'reach', which was fine, so I never bothered trying it. I should have done. After reading this thread and adjusting the screw a few mnutes ago, i can safely state that this adjustment doesn't set the 'reach' of the lever, but I assume screws in & out the 'piston' at the lever end so setting the amount of travel required by the lever until the pads start to move. Hence, a turn or two of the grubscrew now sets the bite point perfectly and means that the levers don't threaten to crush my fingers on the grips when I need to brake hard. Perfect - this is the only niggle I had with these brakes. Wish I'd have found this earlier so thanks for that! Otherwise I'd thoroughly recommend Avid 3's and quite like the 'spongey' progressive feel.

Inverted8

Thanks for the replies.

I phoned the shop (won't mention them). The guy said to let them bed in, which is reasonable. The bike is brand new. He also said that I would probably never be able to get the Avids to bite any better! This sounds like they are trying to fob me off! I'm still going back to get them checked out. I have small hands and I don't like to stretch for the levers. It is interesting what you said Skyliner that it is large part in the set up. Also what you said about the cable lengths - looks like they did not bother setting them to the correct lengths. The cables stick out below the bottom bearing below the cranks.

My suspicions on the person who built the bike for me were confirmed when I had my front wheel come loose at the end of riding the Whites Level trail in Afan. The brake caliper assy was also loose! I could not believe this - these things don't just come loose. This was my first ride on my new bike. They must not have been tightened up properly in the first place. I looked at the pre-delivery check list when I got home and the person who assembled the bike was also the person who did the pre-delivery check.

Anyway I have got some harsh words for the shop tomorrow when they open.

andy__h

OK, I may have been a little hasty in my response that the grubscrew doesn't affect the reach :oops: . After taking a ride soon after they do feel a little further away but still OK for me and 10 times better than the previous set up. Roughly, there is an inch to an inch and a quarterof lever travel from open to locked which by setting the screw correctly, you will be able to acheive without it hitting your fingers (unless you have real small hands). Funny how the default setting appears to be too 'close' and a shame the shop tech's don't seem to realise this.

The good doctor

I've just ridden my Giant zero for the first time time today aside from around the road I live in just to get the set up ok. Anyway and to the point , the bike came with Juicy 3's and although the rear brake ssems ok the front is definately not. The wheel will stop ok when I lift the wheel off the ground but when I'm on it I need the stopping distance of a supertanker.
So if I just adjust this screw then things will be ok? These are my first disc brakes and I know very little to say the least, I wasn't aware they needed bedding in, do they get more efficient over time.

Thanks

mr mangos

Sounds like you either need a bleed or something is contaminated.