Is Shimano 105 worth £150 ?

OldSeagul

Not really a beginners question as I have been around for a few years, more a 'which bike' question:

I commute to work six miles there and two miles back. I don't do any time trials, audax or races. I have been using an Edinburgh Country (3 x 8 spd Sora) but fancy a lighter bike. I've narrowed it down to either a Cannondale Synapse Tiagra Triple (3 x 10 spd Tiagra for £700) or a Felt Z70 (3 x 10 spd 105 for £850). The question is; for the amount of riding that I do, is it worth paying the extra £150 for Shimano 105 instead of Tiagra?

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AntLockyer

If you think the only differences are the groupsets I would say go for the Sora and save the cash.

AntLockyer

That wasn't supposed to sound shitty by the way

sloxam

will you ever ride more? possibly. lots of people who get on a light, responsive machine start to ride more. if this could be you, get the felt. the difference between tiagra and 105 is huge imo.
why do you only commute 2 miles home? do you cadge a lift for the other 4?

Steve I

Tiagra is 9 speed versus 10 speed for 105. Tiagra is easily good enough for most peoples' needs, the current version is very nicely finished too. It all comes down to whether you really want 10 speed or not.

meagain

Everything else being equal (which of course it rarely is!), I can't see that Tiagra to 105 is worth plus 150 quid. Difference in cost of production is, oh, maybe as much as a tenner!

peanut

I'd go for the new 9 speed Sora. Brilliant shifters and classy looking gear. Totally unique styling .I have seen a brand new 2008 complete 9spd Sora groupset on ebay for just £150 :shock: :shock: :shock:
Add a nice frameset and you could build yourself a nice bike for less money.

ajohn9

Go for 105.
i rode tiagra for 3 years, then got a new steed with 105. Pretty big difference imo

cycologist

As indicated by the responses, some favouring Tiagra and others 105, it comes down to the old adage "you pays your money and you makes your choice". No on else can do it for you and only time and retrospect will inrform you as to whether or not you made the right choice for yourself.

Lagavulin

If the whole groupset on the Felt is 105 (and not just the rear mech, levers etc.) then I'd of thought that'd be worth the investment.

I've ridden Tiagra for the past 18 months. Its good enough for what I've used it for but if I was in the same prediciment and I could afford 105 then I'd get it (I read the 105 brakes are particularly good).

System_1

Don't buy a bike based on groupset alone. That's an easy thing to upgrade in the future bit by bit if you really feel the need to. The heart of any bike are it's frame and wheels, everything else is just there to make it move, point it in the right direction and give you somewhere to put your bum.

If you have the opportunity, give them both a test ride and choose the one you like best based on the ride quality rather than the groupset. Personally I'd get the Cannondale, it looks like a MUCH nicer frame and would be a better base for upgrading in the future. That Felt is just proper fugly.

The new 10spd Tiagra is meant to be miles better than the old 9spd and is probably just as good as the previous version of 105. I've been running 9spd Tiagra on my commuting bike for over 5 years now and it has performed faultlessly, needing nothing more than chain, cassette and cable replacement as they wear out.

OldSeagul

sloxam wrote:

why do you only commute 2 miles home? do you cadge a lift for the other 4?

It's only two miles to work, but on a morning I go the long way round for the exsercise and do six miles. Coming home I go the short way 'cos I'm knackered!

OldSeagul

System wrote:

Don't buy a bike based on groupset alone. That's an easy thing to upgrade in the future bit by bit if you really feel the need to. The heart of any bike are it's frame and wheels, everything else is just there to make it move, point it in the right direction and give you somewhere to put your bum..

This is what a friend I used to work with says. He has a cannondale which he paid £500 for a couple of years ago and then discovered recently that the frame is a CAAD8. He says the frame is the important thing and that you can upgrade the rest later. He's now spent another couple of hundred upgrading the wheels and fork and has got himself a bike he's happy with

If, as you say, the 10 spd Tiagra is the equivelent of the 105 from previous years, then that is probably all I need. Once I have a good stiff frame like the Cannondale, I can always upgrade to a complete 105 spec later on.

alfablue

I would choose Tiagra over Sora, Sora uses a thumb lever, Tiagra is like the rest of the shimano range, both levers combined with the brake lever. 105, probably diminishing returns though.

fast as fupp

get the 105-chainrings etc are made of harder metal than tiagra and the whole groupset is higher quality and will last a lot longer

sora is junk for commuter bikes

meagain

"sora is junk for commuter bikes"

That's telling all us poor folk!

OldSeagul

Everybody says that the Cannondale has a stiff frame, what difference does that make over a normal frame? Does anyone have experience of riding a Felt, do they have stiff frames?

System_1

I think stiffer frames are said to be more efficient as there is less energy wasted in flexing the frame and all your power therefore goes to pushing the bike forward. Stiff bikes tend to be less comfortable though and the only people that would notice any real benefit from extra stiffness would be people who race or big heavy guy's (okay, fat) like me.

Also keep in mind that although Cannondales are known for their stiffness, the Synapse is their more comfort orientated model. Most manufacturers have models like this these days (Spesh Roubaix, Giant SCR) aimed at riders that don't race and are really just looking for a frame with a bit more comfort than a full on race bike. For commuting or fast blasts around the countryside these frames are perfect.

OldSeagul

System wrote:

...the only people that would notice any real benefit from extra stiffness would be big heavy guys.

So, say I was a big heavy guy; why would a stiff frame (CAAD) make a difference - is it because of the extra weight pushing down on the pedals and therefore the extra flex on non stiff frames? What would happen to the frame of a 'comfort' (Synapse) frame if a big heavy guy rode it up a big hill and would it be easier on a stiff framed bike?

System_1

I'm not sure I have enough experience to give a decent answer. All I know is that between the two bikes I have the stiffer one handles a bit more directly and doesn't 'wiggle' between bars and saddle over rough ground as much as the more flexible one. All bikes flex in this way to some extent, just that heavy guys notice it more due to the extra weight. I've noticed no real performance benefits between the two. Hills are just as hard on my stiff frame as they've ever been.

Here is a link to a very good article on choosing a frame which explains the benefits and drawbacks better than I ever could.

http://www.cadencecycling.com/products/ ... /overview/

simon_e

I have 2007 spec 9speed Tiagra (4500) and find the STIs, the most expensive bit, as good as I could ask for. Admittedly I haven't ridden any distance on anything else, but it works very well.

I deliberated before buying but I'm glad I didn't feel obliged to find the extra for 105. Not saying it's no better, just I couldn't justify it. I don't think I would have appreciated the difference.

All this talk about cheap &' nasty chainrings that wear out is just hot air IMHO. I have some OE rings on my inexpensive mtb that have seen 4,000 miles of commuting/road riding as well as offroad and they aren't anywhere near worn out. That bike has just 7 gears on the back and I'm not even ashamed of it. Threads like this just remind of old phrases about workmen & tools, that it ain't what you got etc.

I'm obviously a lower life form (as opposed to an ad man's dream), wouldn't you say fupp? ;-)

benyoung098

I bought a cannondale CAAD 5 fitted with Tiagra, I replaced some parts with 105 (cranks and brakes). It's a much better bike now, a vast improvement. IF you feel the frames and finishing kit and importantly wheels are on equal ground then the £150 for 105 would be worth paying

marky2484

" Sora is junk for commuters....."

Wot a load of borrocks. Ask yourself this question. Are you better than your bike. What would benefit you most -losing a few pounds, or spending a load of cash on the next groupset up?

Shock announcement - they all work. Well. Buy what WORKS. I have no problem with people spending their money however they want. If you like the idea of Dura Ace - fine. Buy it. Just don't pretend that it has more than a tiny effect on your performance.

We all seem to be on a kind of treadmill -the mags review the newest kit, which is soooo much better than the old kit, people buy into this absolute nonsense, feel inadequate if they are not running top end kit...... I understand why this is, but it doesn't make it any easier to stomach.
A couple of examples. Bikes with square taper b/bs are now derided in the mags as cheap, old fashioned etc etc. THERE WAS NOTHING WRONG WITH SQUARE TAPER B/Bs!!!! Compact chainsets. Apparently, we are now incapable of riding up hills with 52 /42 . Soooo - were previous generations stronger, or are we so much weaker? Or is it just a ploy to sell more product?

Ride your bike. Get off this seasons treadmill.

Steve I

Well said marky, people seem to forget that Shimano et al are commercial companies and have to sell to survive. What has far more influence on the ride character of a bike is the frame, fork and wheels, not the brakes and gears (modern dual pivot brakes excepted).

dazzawazza

fast as fupp wrote:

sora is junk for commuter bikes

I'm constantly reading in the 'Road Beginners' forum that Sora is junk or crap.
I assume that all these people have actually owned a Sora equipped bike and have had massive problems with the equipment. :roll:

I've had a Sora equipped Allez for almost a year now and it has functioned perfectly, without any adjustments needed so far.
In fact the build quality and changes are better than Acera on my MTB and I don't read in the MTB forums that it's crap.

And, with the right technique, you can make quick gear changes on the drops using the Sora thumb shifter.

George Murdoch

My No. 2 bike (Giant scr3) has Sora levers & I find them OK. My No. 1 bike (Genesis) has 105 which may be superior but to me both work the same. What I need is 'more cycling'