Cheapest Cycling Club to join? Explanation of a CTT rule?

frenchfighter

I was wondering whether anyone knew of the cheapest cycling club to join in London? Failing that, could you let me know how much you paid if you are a club member?

The reason I ask is that I want to do some TTs this year - not too many; maybe a handful - yet I cannot participate in any without being a member of a club.

I find this rule a bit odd, and would like to know if anyone can explain why someone cannot simply turn up and ride a TT if they are not a member of a club?

The only ting I can think of is safety, but then that reason has so many holes in I don' think it is worth explaining.

Any thoughts are appreciated!

Gavin Gilbert

On one hand, I think it's a very odd question. On the otherhand I understand it totally.

The CTT thing will be down to Club affliation and Insurance. And down to the Cloak & Dagger way time trialing has always been run in the UK.

Which club depends on where abouts in London you are based, most of them are still reasonably territorial. A good club will be all about opening up your cycling horizons, and if you approach them with an "I don't really want to join" attitude I guess many wouldn't be that accepting.

Bronzie

You only have to be a member of an affiliated CTT club for open events (ie the ones that appear in the CTT Handbook) - you can ride club events (ie evening 10's etc) without being a member of any club.

SteveR_100Milers

Maybe look at it this way, why should you benefit from all of the organisation that goes into a TT, plus the actual participation of actually officially racing without some form of affiliation to an organisation? Bike racing doesnt exist to service the interests of just anyone who feels like simply turning up when it suits them - after all its a private club activity, if you want to take part you have to abide by the rules.

In any case, I'm not sure that opening the entries to anyone would be a sensible approach from either a safety perspective, or an organisational one. If you really do begrudge spending around a £10 plus the race entry fee (usually £7 for this year for all distances of 50 miles and under), then you could of course simply ride against yourself along a designated course, and time yourself....

frenchfighter

SteveR_100Milers wrote:

Maybe look at it this way, why should you benefit from all of the organisation that goes into a TT, plus the actual participation of actually officially racing without some form of affiliation to an organisation? Bike racing doesnt exist to service the interests of just anyone who feels like simply turning up when it suits them - after all its a private club activity, if you want to take part you have to abide by the rules.

In any case, I'm not sure that opening the entries to anyone would be a sensible approach from either a safety perspective, or an organisational one. If you really do begrudge spending around a £10 plus the race entry fee (usually £7 for this year for all distances of 50 miles and under), then you could of course simply ride against yourself along a designated course, and time yourself....

Thanks for your reply, it got me thinking.

You pay an entry fee so you are paying for the things you mention in your first paragraph anyway.

Safety issues: being a member of a club doesn't mean you will ride safely. In fact you could be a member of a club and never ride. Although I do apprecaite that those who are club members and who ride regularly will typically be 'safer'. The point that strikes me though is that TTs are individual affairs. You are not bunch riding so the likelihood of causing another participant any harm is very little. Furthermore, being on open roads as most TTs are, anyone could simply turn up and ride the exact same route and be a laibility.

Organisation: Being a member of a club simply means that the name of your club appears after your name in the entry lists and results sheet (unless I am missing something in which case please let me know?).

Anyone know of a club whose membership is £10 - my local one is £25? Any that do student discounts too?

As for timing yourself, I indeed do that but it is not equivilant. Conditions need to be the same to be able to judge yourself against others.

Obviously I don't begrudge paying an entry fee, but I would really apprecaite it if there is someone that can break down what this money goes towards then I would be grateful. I have tried doing this but it seems that most goes to the club coffers.

Some of the TTs I've been to, don't give refreshments for free - I had to pay for them, so that cannot be included in the cost.

Also this business starts getting rather expensive when you consider the £15-20 train fare to get to the place.

Adamskii

I recently participated in my first time-trial after only being with a club since Christmas.

The club joining fee for the first year was £5. The entry fee for the time-trial was £2.50 which hardly broke the bank considering the effort and time that goes into organising the event and especially considering the conditions. The time keepers and marshalls were standing around in the p!ssing cold rain for two hours and for what?! The support they gave allowing others to ride is commendable.

As for a break down of club costs. I get meeting notes and club event details posted to me at a cost and the valuable advice of other club members to help you become a better and hopefully faster rider.

Bronzie

frenchfighter wrote:

I would really apprecaite it if there is someone that can break down what this money goes towards then I would be grateful. I have tried doing this but it seems that most goes to the club coffers.

Haven't organised an open TT for years but as I remember
- £1-£2 goes straight to CTT as entry levy (insurance, organising the annual calendar etc)
- £varies goes to prize list
- £50-60 for hall hire (if needed)
- £10-20 petrol money for the timekeepers although many refuse it
- £20 on food etc although the T-bar should normally pay for itself
- £30-70 postage and copying for start sheet / results
- remainder to club (pays for purchase of equipment like rider numbers, signage etc)

I used to organise TT's on the A1 on a Saturday afternoon and they would always be full fields as it was a fast course. Would probably make £200 "profit" for the club if lucky.

Most events rarely run with full fields these days (although it varies wildly) so the promoting club be lucky to break even in most cases.

Compare the TT entry fee for road races (£10-15), sportifs (upto £50!), triathlons (upto £60 I've heard) and they start to look pretty good vfm.

hambones

I've always found that most clubs will allow you to ride 2 or 3 TTs without joining just to see if you like them. You're never then duty-bound to join. I think around £15 is the annual fee for most clubs and certainly all club TT's around my way are £2-£3 to enter. Most would be grateful to have a few people turn up and ride - often some of these mid-week TTs only have 3 or 4 people taking part!

AntLockyer

What a ray of sunshine you must be. I'm glad our club costs more than a tenner

frenchfighter

Bronzie, many thanks for breaking it down. Many of those things I didn't consider so am glad now as I feel happier that the money is actually needed rather than being profit.

All I need to do now is find a local club whose membership is around the £5-£15 mark many of you have said. The TTs at my local club cost £7, so I guess another club would be good if they charge £2.50 etc.

geoff_ss

frenchfighter wrote:

You pay an entry fee so you are paying for the things you mention in your first paragraph anyway.

That's a very narrow way of thinking. Clubs of all kinds (and I've been a member of motor cycle, sailing, aeromodelling, gliding and cycle clubs at various time in my life) depend on the good will of their members to organise events for their mutual enjoyment. The last thing a club needs is free loaders who don't put anything in to help the club operate either competitively or socially.

Have you thought that events don't organise themselves? If organisers and helpers at all levels charged even a modest fee for the time they put in, it would put entry costs into the stratosphere. In the past I've spent countless hours helping to organise international tandem events (amongst other things) and I am far from a major organiser. Sports and pastimes rely on willing volunteers at all levels. Looking for the 'cheapest' club is hardly in the spirit of what's required. At club level it isn't a simple financial arrangement - there's more to it than that.

I don't have much to do with my local cycle club these days but my wife is the treasurer/membership secretary. In order to qualify for the evening TT championship a rider has to marshall at some events.

You seem to have an aversion to a club making a profit on events. Profits in clubs are necessary for various purposes: to offset events that lose money; to buy essential equipment (numbers, stakes, rope, tape etc); to subsidise club clothing; to pay for trophy engraving and replicas. Remember profits are for the benefits of the membership as a whole rather than individuals.

Geoff

BeaconRuth

I completely agree with Geoff's sentiments. I organise an open TT for my club and I put hours and hours of my 'leisure' time completely free of charge into ensuring the event is a success. The entry fee last year was £7.00 and the club only broke even because about half a dozen of the club's members donated generously and covered various costs out of their own pockets. Coupled with that we had approximately 50 club members from teenagers to octagenarians out on the course marshalling, time-keeping, putting out signs, ensuring safety, baking cakes, serving tea, taking photos, pushing off, car-par attending, transferring results, operating results boards. If a few pounds of profit were made by the club, I am incredulous that anyone would begrudge this going into the club funds given the hours and hours of work and effort involved by so many people.

When I enter open TTs I am extremely grateful to all the hard-working members of all the other clubs for the efforts they make............... and this manner of mutual cooperation and contribution is how the community of cycling clubs and club cyclists operates. I am quite sure that none of the events I ride make anything more than a tiny profit.

Unfortunately the spirit of club-life in which everyone contributes their time and energy for the love of their sport seems oddly quaint when compared to professionally run triathlons and cyclo-sportives, but the reality is that it is on such goodwill and amateur dedication that the British TT scene operates. Of course it is less accessible because of the requirement to be a member of an affiliated club in order to enter an open event, but I really don't think this is an insurmountable hurdle. And besides, as other people have already said, you would probably be welcomed at club events without being a club member.

Ruth

SteveR_100Milers

Thanks Geoff (and Ruth) the word freeloading sprang to my mind when reading the OP, but I was trying be constructive ish in my reply. Agree with everyhitng Bronize wrote too - I'm orgainsing an opne event this year and its a pain in the ass to be honest. If you want to ride and race in the cycling community then you're going tpo have to cough up. If you don't like the idea of spending just £15-£20 to join a club (of any interest) then I wouldn't bother contemplating racing at all.

redddraggon

frenchfighter wrote:

Anyone know of a club whose membership is £10 - my local one is £25? Any that do student discounts too?

What's wrong with spending £25 on club membership for a year?

I'm guessing you're a student? If you can't afford £25 for a club membership, you need to stop your boozing and get a part time job. Student freeloaders just piss me off, you give us all a bad name.

I'm a student and wouldn't consider £25 on a year's membership a lot.

alecstilleyedye

frenchfighter wrote:

SteveR_100Milers wrote:

Maybe look at it this way, why should you benefit from all of the organisation that goes into a TT, plus the actual participation of actually officially racing without some form of affiliation to an organisation? Bike racing doesnt exist to service the interests of just anyone who feels like simply turning up when it suits them - after all its a private club activity, if you want to take part you have to abide by the rules.

In any case, I'm not sure that opening the entries to anyone would be a sensible approach from either a safety perspective, or an organisational one. If you really do begrudge spending around a £10 plus the race entry fee (usually £7 for this year for all distances of 50 miles and under), then you could of course simply ride against yourself along a designated course, and time yourself....

Thanks for your reply, it got me thinking.

You pay an entry fee so you are paying for the things you mention in your first paragraph anyway.

Safety issues: being a member of a club doesn't mean you will ride safely. In fact you could be a member of a club and never ride. Although I do apprecaite that those who are club members and who ride regularly will typically be 'safer'. The point that strikes me though is that TTs are individual affairs. You are not bunch riding so the likelihood of causing another participant any harm is very little. Furthermore, being on open roads as most TTs are, anyone could simply turn up and ride the exact same route and be a laibility.

Organisation: Being a member of a club simply means that the name of your club appears after your name in the entry lists and results sheet (unless I am missing something in which case please let me know?).

Anyone know of a club whose membership is £10 - my local one is £25? Any that do student discounts too?

As for timing yourself, I indeed do that but it is not equivilant. Conditions need to be the same to be able to judge yourself against others.

Obviously I don't begrudge paying an entry fee, but I would really apprecaite it if there is someone that can break down what this money goes towards then I would be grateful. I have tried doing this but it seems that most goes to the club coffers.

Some of the TTs I've been to, don't give refreshments for free - I had to pay for them, so that cannot be included in the cost.

Also this business starts getting rather expensive when you consider the £15-20 train fare to get to the place.

http://www.macclesfieldwheelers.org.uk. bit of a long way for the saturday club run i suspect

schlepcycling

Do you want to join a local club because they are local or just to be able to enter TTs?. If it's the second why not join a not so local club that's cheaper. As far as I know there's no 'rule' that says you must join a local club, although most people do because they want more out of it than just needing to have joined a club so they can go racing.

Maidenhead & District CC only charge £15 a year for seniors http://www.maidenheadcc.org.uk/

Bronzie

schlepcycling wrote:

why not join a not so local club that's cheaper

As a committee member for my club, we occasionally get requests to join from people who live miles away. We always tell them to come on a few club runs first so we can get to know them - if they can't be bothered to make the effort to do this, it usually indicates that when their services are needed to help run a club event, they will be unable/unwilling to do so.

That said, I know of riders who have moved away from their first cycling club, and yet are willing to make 300 mile round trips to help marshal at events.

Membership of a club should not be a one-way process. You need to give a little back too sometimes.

schlepcycling

Bronzie wrote:

schlepcycling wrote:

why not join a not so local club that's cheaper

As a committee member for my club, we occasionally get requests to join from people who live miles away. We always tell them to come on a few club runs first so we can get to know them - if they can't be bothered to make the effort to do this, it usually indicates that when their services are needed to help run a club event, they will be unable/unwilling to do so.

That said, I know of riders who have moved away from their first cycling club, and yet are willing to make 300 mile round trips to help marshal at events.

Membership of a club should not be a one-way process. You need to give a little back too sometimes.

Bronzie, I'm with you 100%, I would always advise someone to join a local club as there's more to being in a club than just using it as a flag of convenience for racing purposes.

SteveR_100Milers

Mine is only £5.

Tom Butcher

Ours is £8 to join and £7 to renew and we'd welcome you as a member even if it is as a flag of convenience, there are plenty of members I've never met and I'm sure most clubs are the same - Derby Mercury - http://www.derbymercury.org.uk/ (contacts page for joining form) - the new Giordana kit is pretty cheap too !