What kit do you actually NEED?

Matteeboy

I love riding my MTB all over the place as does my wife who is a very fit rider.
But I do ask myself, how much kit do we actually need?

Until recently, we both rode old fully rigid steel framed MTBs - I now have a 2007 Stumpy and she uses the older rigid Stumpy (with new parts) most of the time.

We go out quite often, have as much fun as everyone else, are fitter due to 10 miles a day riding and don't feel the need to have all the kit we are "told" to get.

We don't need SPDs (I had them for two years and hated them), we don't need full suspension, we don't need £3k rigs, we don't need heavily overpriced MTB clothes (hat,.gloves and coat excepted), we don't need sub 20lb fragile bikes - we (and our mates) just have fun. Lots of it.

How many people of here have stuff because they have been brainwashed into getting it?

Aluminium got very "normal" for frames - mainly because good steel got very pricey. Now steel is coming back - not because either it better, it's just what we are told we need.
Everyone seems to "need" an FS rig but they just overcomplicate what is a simple sport and add weight.

So how about a bit of getting back to basics, looking beyond what the industry tells us we need and try ploughing more time and energy into actually riding our bikes?

Controversial maybe but true.

thewaddys

No offence but things evolve and if we all stuck with what we knew we'd all still be living in caves and fending off Sabre tooths! I love my full suss 2K cannondale and I'll whip the ass off any one of my mates who's on a HT, thats what its all about, going faster, dropping higher and generally largin it! If you don't want to do that then thats fine but don't question the ones that do. Ta.

milese

The bikes we ride change but the terrain doesn't.

Its great if you can enjoy it on a shoe string and but it depends what your into and what you can afford.

Personally, I enjoy to have decent stuff and like to spend money on my bike and bike stuff. If I didn't have the money I obviously wouldn't buy a posh bike and bits.

Your right though, most of it is far from essential, overpriced but nice to own and use.

I'm not heavily into the scene but I would be happy to state that those are the fittest and have the most enjoyment per pound are those that dont really care about consumerism and just ride.

I love my Stumpy FSR and enjoy it, but bought it secondhand for half its RRP, and just bought a new Giant SCR 1 road bike at 42% off. I buy all my stuff online where its so much cheaper, I cringe at the price of stuff in my LBS!

stumpyjon

Each to their own. I didn't need a full suss bike, my 97 Giant Terrago got me round, my cheap gloves stopped my hands hurting, my cranks turned before I went for SPD's and I certainly didn't need a Garmin Vista.

My 07 £ 2k stumpy gives me lots of pleasure, it rides IMHO so much better than the Terrago, I've done more miles this year than in the last five and I weigh less and am fitter than I have been in ages.

I dont' drink (much), I don't smoke, I don't have any other money eating hobbies so I spend my hard earned on my bike and accesories (sold a load of stuff on Ebay to finance the Garmin).

So to answer your question, to go riding you need nothing more than a £ 150 - £ 200 hardtail and a helmet. However if you've got the cash and don't mind parting with it you may get more pleasure out of your hobby (or maybe not) if you buy better stuff. And yes more expensive stuff is generally better (not necessarily value for money but does perform better).

Don't think many people are brainwashed into buying more and more stuff, it's a bit sad if they are but again what harm's it doing as long as they can afford it and get out and ride, there's plenty of worse ways of spending money.

orangechimp

what kit do you actually need?

whatever you can afford, as long as it makes you happy. that's the important thing.

most of us started on a rigid bike, but i can ride faster for longer and bigger on my FS. if i want to go simple i ride my s/s.

paulym31

If I didn't spend my time and money on the bike I'd be hanging around on street corners, pimping out old ladies to fuel by massive crack habit. Not a pretty thought. I'll stick with the bike, it's more fun anyway, which was sort of your point matteboy.
If you come back smiling and with a full set of limbs everything else is fluff.

Paul

dav1

depenends what you do entirely. None of us actually NEED bikes but we like to ride them so we buy bikes.

I don't need good forks, i don't need avid juicy 5s to upgrade my brakes but i don't regret buying them at all. If you want to improve your bike to suit your riding better then why not? I have bought things on what i have read but that's because i wanted to make said improvement anyway.

I can see where you are coming from though. When i started getting into riding again i was riding in the woods on an old reiligh max 21 gear bike id had since i was a kid until i bought my current rig. Sure it got me around the woods but would i be as into the sport as i am today if I hadn't made the purchases i have? Im going to guess at probably not.

omegas

No one has told me I need anything, (especially the industry) I purchase what I need for the bike rides I am doing. I might have my £8 base layers from ASDA and £80 Ventura jacket and Shimano shoes but that’s what I require.

Commute 30 mile a day off road at this time of year 5 days a week and you need quality clothing, gloves and shoes.

I used to watch the 28mm forks bend and brakes boil on my old hard tail along the black routes, now I have a quality full sus that eats those routes up.

Some weekends I will cycle 70 to 100 miles off road in one day and could not imagine not using clipless pedals on such a journey.

With any sport all equipment is overpriced especially clothing, with time and trying different makes you can find what you require for a lot less, even Aldi have a great line of cycle cloths.

As the technology drips down we end up with better equipment and clothing that makes life that bit more comfy, so no I am not been brainwashed I see the benefits of the new things I buy.

If Matteeboy is doing 10 mile a day I am sure a shockwave from Halfords some sunglasses and trainers is all that is required. (oh and a helmet)

Matteeboy

Oh come on Omegas - Let's not be silly. You strike me as being a bit if a muppet with your patonising attitude. We cycle ten hilly miles each day before work just for some base fitness. It's a fraction of what we do in additions to this - Regular 30 mile rides at the weekends too :roll: Plus running, surfing, weights, etc - I'd steer away from fitness patronisation if I were you - you won't "win" that one.

I have a 2007 Stumpy but feel it's more thah I'll ever need really.

Just sick of mags pushing products so much - I love the fitness/riding articles, just hate the fact that they don't seem to think you can ride on anything less than a £2k rig.

Funny how whenever anyone questions the cost of kit, they are immediately considered to be skint.
Well sorry but we're far from skint.

I'm off for a nice cheap surf now (in the sea, not the internet)

zero303

I see Mattee's point - to an extent, I was out not long ago hosting a club ride and we had a novice (first time mountain biking) on a Kona Stinky deluxe and we were riding a fairly simple single track based ride. He even then managed to come of and almost break his knee against a tree.

I'm sure his LBS saw him coming a mile away... although I'd pray they'd have been honest.

Where I don't agree is Mattee's attempt to paint us all with one stick. I'm looking to drop up to £2k on a full-susser in the new year because I like riding black routes at welsh trail centres and quite frankly my Steel 2001 old-skool Orange P7 is holding me back and I want to ride faster and stronger.

Also, these new AM full-sussers - they really are the future of the sport for a lot of us. They're fast, reliable, comfortable and they can take almost anything - the only person brainwashing me is me![/b]

dave_hill

Matteeboy wrote:

I'm off for a nice cheap surf now (in the sea, not the internet)

Perhaps that's why you talk so much bollocks because you're suffering from semi-permanent hypotheria and you can't get enough oxygen to your brain.

Hellooooo?? Bridge? Ricketty? Under the??? :evil:

Splasher

This is a perenial debate, and can be quite and interesting one if people stick to objective persuasion and avoid the temptation to make judgements and personal remarks.

For my part, I think there is a sliding scale of what you need depending on the kind of riding you do. For simple cross country any bike will do with the correct tyres (I've been passed many a time by an old boy on a cyclo-cross bike). But personally I wouldn't want to ride off Edale Cross on a fully rigid - you could do it but it would be no fun - and that's the point I think.

Matteboy has asked a question what do you NEED and assumed that anything you buy beyond that is because you have been brainwashed by the magazines.

I disagree only in that I think MTBing is a pleasure and like any pleasure whatever makes you happy is what is important. For me it's two things - building/maintaining my bikes and riding bigger or faster each time and I find 6" of travel compensates nicely where my talent is lacking. As I approach 40, I have more money than time and whereas a 15 year old can spend hours getting better, I can only spend $$$$s

Oh and I'm the fittest on the forum, everyone knows that, so put your swinging dicks back in your pants

milese

You can say the same about everything.

Why buy branded food? You only need the basic smartprice stuff.

Why buy a posh car? They will still get you from A to B.

Why buy anything more than a 1 bed flat? You can only be in one room at a time.

I could go on. The simple answer is that people like and can afford quality.

You pay your money you make your choice, and you can't take it to the grave with you.

Anonymous

i get your point matteeboy, the job can be done on very basic equipment, which is a very good thing as it means its not out of everyones reach (unlike polo or sailing or summat) and once you have bought your equipment (no matter how much or little you want to spend) its pretty much a free sport.

the weight sacrifice we make by riding full sussers is far out-weighed by the speed and comfort gains.

also, even though bike mags extol the virutes of expensive bikes(which lets be honest, tend to be better, its just a fact), they also are quick to include cheaper more accesible models to people too, often the top version of a bike model is not the recommendation for riders other than the high roller wealthy guys out there as the extra cash spent isnt always money well spent.

plus, in wmb earlier this year, a 250 quid "halfords special" was 3rd place against some very very expensive boutique brands.

i ride some very expensive bikes and have spent alot of time and money choosing parts etc but i am the first to admit that i am a pump rider, i just like owning bikes and riding them to the best of my ability. i dont ride with any one else so i just do it for me.

i regularly get my arse handed to me by old geezers on the kind of bikes i wouldnt pull out of a canal!!

omegas

I stand by what I say, what I purchase is what I need.

This forum brings a wealth of information for fellow bike enthusiasts were people young or old ,beginner or veteran can share there knowledge its not a place to vent your own insecurities because someone has something better than you.

Society today means a lot of people have more income than before and if they wish to buy the best that is there choice not mine and for me it’s not a problem.

I want to see how MatteeBOY is going to show me how he is going to “win that one” over fitness.

What you going to do send us a pic of your muscles or a video of you doing a bike climb.

I may be a muppet but I did grow up

Your name sums up your personality …BOYYYYYYY

stumpyjon

Matteeboy wrote:

Just sick of mags pushing products so much - I love the fitness/riding articles, just hate the fact that they don't seem to think you can ride on anything less than a £2k rig.

Having got back into mountain biking again properly in the last twelve months I've actually been surprised at the number of of entry level (£ 200 +) bikes the mags have been reviewing and the even handed way they've been reviewed.

One of the reasons I stopped reading the mags a few years ago was because I didn't feel any of the kit they reviewed was relevant to me. IMHO that's now completely changed, yes they still devote a lot of pages to the bling stuff (that most of us would like to own) but they definitely cover the entry level stuff and not in a patronising way, so I don't really agree with your comments.

It does seem that whilst most people understand your sentiment there is a certain level of backlash against the idea that spending money on your riding is somehow unecessary or wrong.

How many people of here have stuff because they have been brainwashed into getting it?

Maybe people don't like to be told what to think or buy after all.

schmako

I like having decent bikes, thats why i've payed 1000's over the years. HT for DH no thanks. Even xc, my FS has allowed me to go much faster than I ever was on my HT. Also at least when I case jumps I know the rear sus can soak it up a bit! I could go on forever.

Matteeboy

What I'm going on about the thousands of "all the gear but no idea" riders who have been brainwashed.

A classic example of this "must spend thousands" brainwahing I saw was in a well known mag - a bike was tested and one line was "at this budget level you cannot expect a lot"
The bike was £1500.

There are still those that I consider to be "the Jones" - must have the latest kit, must buy everything now so I don't look bad.

Well sorry but those with cash are sensible with money.

I feel sorry for young talented riders who feel they are nothing without a £4k bike - I have a mate who is unbelievably quick yet a real right ar5e so rides a £500 bike and is very very hard to beat.

Basicaly Omegas, you are a bit of a self styled bike guru, copying and pasting facts to try and look knowledgeable - a real "keyboard expert"

Wouldn't suprise me if your name is derived from an Omega watch - in which case you really are very keen to shout about money aren't you? Oh and you live in Cheshire - the Surrey of the North. You are SO keen to imply you are well off - very very vacuous little BOY.

Down here in Cornwall, we don't feel the need to shout about money - we are more sensible.

So carry on thinking "if you can afford the best then buy it" then you're welcome to waste thousands trying to "keep up" feeding a greedy industry - I'd say you were simply a mug.

I'm sure you can cycle miles - well done. But can you apply yourself to anything else? I doubt it very much.

Now everyone - my question was "what do we actually NEED" not "spending any money is wrong" or "FS bikes are pointless" (they are often very useful - just not essential as is often conveyed) Now read the question again and come back when you have a proper answer - not some ranting slag fest.

Sorry Dave Hill but surfers get all the chicks , not lycra clad skinny bikers

zero303

"what do we actually NEED"

Apart from a few tongue lashings, some of us responded with the sensible answer - depends on what you like to ride. My local and fave trail is Cwm Carn and it is a bit of a bike breaker and it is fun to try and ride it as fast as poss.

For that, a £1300+ full-suss is the ideal machine.

I actually sympathised with your point with an example of my own, that said, the tone of your original post was always going to spark this kind of response and was borderline trolling...

Splasher

Matteeboy, I'm not surprised you're fit, that chip you seem to be carrying around must be quite heavy.

I think you have got the inferiority thing back to front. I went to Chicksands on my nice new 2008 frame last weekend and whilst there got talking to a couple of 15 year old lads on their hardtails. They were asking about my bike and telling me that as well as freeride, they were in the top 30 in the NPS cross country. They then showed me how to ride off a 10ft drop. Having been shown how to do it, I still didn't have the balls or the talent. Who do you think felt inferior?

But far from feeling any bad feelings about the exchange I loved the diversity that MTBing brings and the fact that despite the 25 year difference in age, we could talk and laugh and ride (crash?) together.

So my advise would be to chill out and enjoy the parts of MTBing you like and let others enjoy the bits they like. Cos one thing is definately true, uptight guys DON'T get the girls.

tonyrees68

totally agree with splasher iam a crap rider but got a good bike i think (avalanche 1.0 ) but i enjoy it . and thats what its all about regardless of what other people ride or think
tony

omegas

If someone has a different opinion than ones self it does not excuse the name calling MateeBOY brings to the forum. If someone has a different view than yourself you have no place to call them.

When I can help, give advice or source information from elsewhere I do, I have 30 years of experience and knowledge that sometimes can benefit and help others.

MateeBOY you just keep showing your immaturity and insecurities with every word you types. What you going to call me now (a double muppet ….. lol)

“It is better to keep your mouth closed and let people think you are a fool than to open it and remove all doubt.”

Mark Twain (what a guy)

Oh and some links you might find more appropriate for your age group.

http://disney.go.com/gamekingdom/v1/mar ... index.html

http://www.bmx-forum.co.uk/forum/

benneally

Thats the most pointless thing i have ever hear (the start of this topic).
Why do people have mansions when they could get along in a flat? Why do people buy ferraris when a fiat panda would do the same job? Why do people but expensive jewelry when cheap stuff looks as nice and does the same job?

thewaddys

What we actually "NEED" is sweet FA, you don't even need a bike to survive but where does the "NEED" end? I "NEED" a 2k Dale to cut 30mph on my DH otherwise I only reach 15mph on my wifes Carrera Kracken. Its a proven point! Your 200 quid Halfords bike wouldnot last half an hour doing the things I enjoy so I do "NEED" my bike of choice. Now, recently I met a biker who was riding a 3K plus rig with all the bells and whistles and walked his bike down what I would only describe as a steepish gravel path complaining that he would have stacked it! Those are the brainwashed types you speak of. So cut us some 1K plus riders some slack as we whistle past in luxury! He He!!

thewaddys

Great forum by the way! You really have put the cat amongst the pigeons! Well done!

Splasher

Omegas, you're absolutely right about the name calling having no place here, so don't get sucked into doing it yourself in retaliation.

Oh and I have a TAG Heure so I guess I'm a big poopy pants show off :shock:

tonyrees68

put it this way my wife is the best thing in my world she aint a princess or royality but id spend the earth on her any day

benneally

thanks for that....

Matteeboy

Are some you actually mentally impaired?

You just repeat the same things again and again - "IF YOU ARE LOADED LIKE ME, THEN YOU BUY THE BEST KIT..." :roll:

What I am saying is that the MTB industry wants us to buy new kit every year.
The MTB media tries to convince us we need it.

An "elitist" attitude is then developed based in what kit you have, not how fit or able you are.
Leith Hill is a classic location for this sort of misplaced attitude.

It's yet another outlet for those who want to shout to everyone how well off they are, and for those with the right attitude and training yet not the funds to feel inadequate.

As my wife and I have become more successful with our business (in fact we couldn't ask for anything else materially), we have become less and less interested in flashing any cash. And the more this happens, the more we laugh at victims who feel the need to shout about their "wealth" - the shouters are the wannabee social climbers not the winners.

The most well off people I know (close relatives) are exactly the same.

Omegas - most people learn to ride aged about four. So anyone over 34 (I'm 32 - despite your name calling) has the "same" experience as you - I'll be as "experienced" as you in two years - whoopeee.

80 year olds have probably 63 years driving experience - but I'm not going to ask many of them for driving advise.

Have to agree with Tony though - not only is the wife the most important thing one earth, but she also rode 35 miles off road with her (female) mate today while I spend three hours surfing.

Now anyone going to throw toys out of the pram for someone "daring" to question the state of MTBing where it seems we now need at least four bikes where we used to make do with one?

Splasher

Matteeboy, are you so unsure of the strength of your argument that you have to resort to insult every time?

Of course the MTB industry want to sell you the latest and greatest, that's their job. Do you really think that's unusual? It's a commercial venture after all.

Have you actually experienced a transaction, be it verbal or otherwise, that convinces you of this superiority complex or is it all internal? I used to go to the trail centres on my £400 Kona and never felt anyone made me feel inferior because of my bike. Equally I don't look down on anyone regardless of bike or riding ability.

It's self richeous vitriol and intolerance of others that narks me!

Amos

If you want to go riding all you need is a bike, any bike will do. So in essence, you don't need a lot of kit, but, some extra/different kit can make your ride more enjoyable.

If you want to spend your hard earned on the latest bit of kit that magazines rave about then fair enough, the choice is yours.

Some people will be sucked in by the ad's telling them they need such and such to go one tenth of a second faster and will gladly pay for it. Not everyone is sucked in by marketing though.

As with any industry, making money is what its about, so of course the magazines/media will tell us we need a newer model, with more upto date features, look at TV's for example. A twenty year old black and white tv will still let you watch programmes, but a 32inch HD does the job so much better!

I love it when people laugh at others because they have "all the gear and no idea". At the end of the day they are probably enjoying thereselves, which is the reason that I ride, so fair play to them. If they have the disposable income to buy high priced equipement that they may not use to its full potential thats up to them.

So what kit do you need? A bike.