08 Centaur Hub Question

JWSurrey

Centaur 2008 hub sets are noticably heavier than Mirage 08 hub sets.
Centaur also use cartridge bearings.
So why are they heavier, and why are they better?

Keen to find out the answer, as I have just ordered a new Centaur hubbed wheelset, having destroyed my winter wheels!

Anyone replaced Record bearings/shells and know how much this costs?

Rob Sallnow

I was all set to say it's probably because of the skewer (the Centaur skewer being designed to be better fitting rather than lighter) but Centaur hubs are listed as being the same weight as Veloce and they have the same skewer as Mirage.

What is clear is that the Mirage front hub has a much more stylish exposed axle arrangement than Veloce and Centaur...it almost looks like Record.

I guess it's just one of those things that happen occassionally....the cheaper components are lighter than more expensive ranges....look at the brakes Mirage are lighter thann Veloce Skeleton by 9 grams!

redddraggon

The weight difference is not that great, does it matter?

JWSurrey

Thanks Rob.
Yes, perhaps it's a quality/longevity issue.
I haven't spun a Mirage freehub, however the Centaur is silky smooth - perhaps it's all down to the pawl/ratchet mechanism quality (not that I've ever worn one of these out).

redddraggon wrote:

The weight difference is not that great, does it matter?

Well, given that one normally pays an exponentially increasing amount of money for a linear decrease in weight - Yes! Why do I want to pay more for less!

Reading between the lines, it's poss. that the freehub body is a 2 piece design on the Mirage, however I have no proof of this.
Still not sure I'm making the right choice paying more for Centaur though.

Ken Night

Hi JWS

I can't shed any light on your question I'm afraid....but would appreciate being able piggyback your decision to go Centaur

Veloce hubs used to have the reputation of being the clubman's winter wheel choice-they were so well sealed

Why did you choose Centaur? The difference between them for a handbuilt wheelset with Open Pro Mirage (443g. £121), Centaur 471g, £156 ) and Record (347g, £211) -hubweight only -would appear that Record are the best value in terms of weight reduction

And hardly on an exponential scale, as you quite rightly point out, everything else is

Mind you, 90 notes between Mirage and Record to save 90 odd grammes is about par for the course

Rob Sallnow

JWSurrey wrote:

Thanks Rob.
Yes, perhaps it's a quality/longevity issue.
I haven't spun a Mirage freehub, however the Centaur is silky smooth - perhaps it's all down to the pawl/ratchet mechanism quality (not that I've ever worn one of these out).

redddraggon wrote:

The weight difference is not that great, does it matter?

Well, given that one normally pays an exponentially increasing amount of money for a linear decrease in weight - Yes! Why do I want to pay more for less!

Reading between the lines, it's poss. that the freehub body is a 2 piece design on the Mirage, however I have no proof of this.
Still not sure I'm making the right choice paying more for Centaur though.

The freehub body is the same for Centaur, Veloce and Mirage....the bearings are the same....the axles of the rear hub are the same the only difference between the rear of Mirage and Centaur/Veloce (besides the colour ) is the different shaped cap on the nondrive side end of the hub body for Mirage.

I went for the Veloce hubs for my newest wheels....I would've gone for Mirage if they weren't black.

JWSurrey

Oh My God! So I've just shelled out an extra 35 notes for a cap that weighs so much more it's probably made of lead, and to have the black anodising removed :shock:

I decided to go with Centaur 2008 (Veloce hubs are Centaur now, and Chorus hubs are Record i.e. Veloce and Chorus hubs have been deleted) after a chat with the wheel builder. Ken, I think therefore you may have inadvertently answered the question!
Perhaps Centaur are better weather sealed than Mirage.

To be fair, as you point out, it's very little more in price, and I wanted a pair of natural finish hubs/spokes.

He wasn't keen on me going for Record, as he rightly pointed out that it wasn't worth it for a set of winter wheels - Given the high cost of replacing cones, bearings, shells, plus the fiddle-factor of doing the job.

I suspect the Centaur cartridge bearings/hubs are better sealed than Record's servicable bearings, since Record have to be designed to be servicable.

Centaur 2008 hubs are sealed cartridges, which they said are a doddle to replace, and much cheaper.

Besides, I struggle to put in any serious winter mileage, so there's little point in having a featherweight training bike.

Compared to Tune and DT, Campag. hubs are a bargain!

Rob Sallnow

JWSurrey wrote:

Oh My God! So I've just shelled out an extra 35 notes for a cap that weighs so much more it's probably made of lead, and to have the black anodising removed :shock:

I decided to go with Centaur 2008 (Veloce hubs are Centaur now, and Chorus hubs are Record i.e. Veloce and Chorus hubs have been deleted) after a chat with the wheel builder. Ken, I think therefore you may have inadvertently answered the question!
Perhaps Centaur are better weather sealed than Mirage.!

Veloce hubs have not been deleted they have been given the same kind of identity crisis that the cranks have got....the cranks are the same except for the quality of the rings..the hubs are the same except for the skewers.

The only difference between Centaur/Veloce and Mirage rear hubs is these parts..



The part on the left is the nondrive side end cap for Mirage...the part on the right is the part that appears in the same place on Centaur/Veloce.



The two side by side look like ^ and you can see the difference in the rear hub by the above mentioned part makes the Mirage axle look slightly thicker....and the difference in the front hubs exposed axle sections are obviuos too.

When it comes to sealing I would say the differences are non existant for the rear and bizarrely the front looks like it could be better on Mirage :?

When you look at the pricing which differs wildly between the shops it's incredibly difficult to justify the extra money for Centaur....nobody seems to list all three hubs so comparisons are hard to do. The Sigma Sport prices seem the best for Veloce but they are so cheap I can't help thinking they are selling older versions even though the picture shows the current version....£11 for a front and £33 for a rear whereas at Wiggle it's £27 and £45.

JWSurrey

Aww Heck - Maybe I should just throw in the towel and go for the significantly cheaper and lighter Ambrosio Zenith hubs!