What makes my bike heavy?

Aux1

OK, my bike is close to 30 lbs, that's probaly on the heavier side for XC bikes...
I wouldn't mind, because I can pedal it uphill quite well and it descends nicely too. But recenty I started racing out of fun, I'm doing okay but I'd like to understand the weight distribution better.

Is there a component that contributes most to it's weight, or is it the added sum of all mid-range components?

Here are the specs, if you could pinpoint the heavy components I could put something better when those wear out... thanks!

Frame: 7005 triple butted hydroformed
Fork: Marzocchi MX Pro '07 (air)
Mechs R/F: Deore LX/Deore
Shifters R/F: SRAM Attack/X-9
Brakes: Formula Oro K18 180mm
Drivetrain: Deore cassette, HG53 chain, M442 Octalink craknset, ES25 BB
Pedals: PD-M535 SPD
Hubs: M475 disc
Rims: Rigida ZAC 2000 disc
Spokes: DT Champion
Tyres: Schwalbe Albert 2.25
The rest: Ritchey OE stem, headset & seatpost, Amoeba Borla handlebars, Selle Royal Viper seat DaBomb lock-on grips...

supersonic

Uusally its just a combo of all the parts - this can make it hard to upgrade to lose weight as its little bit at a time. However some bikes have a mix. Your wheels dont look the lightest, and we have no info on the frame. MX pro a good pound heavier than a Reba too.

toasty

Yeah, as stated it's a bit of everything, if you did literally want a lightweight set up it ramps the cost up quite quick.

Your wheels are pretty low end, you could save a pound (or more) off them, decent wheels can be a decent long term investment and you can pass them between bikes.
Are the tires the "light" version? Either way, even the light version could be swapped for 200g lighter tires pretty easily
The forks are good but another easy pound could be saved (more than that if you got Rebas or something)

Aside from that it's just minor things, you could save 50g on grips easily with lighter ones, 50g on the cassette with a PG990 or XT one, a hollowtech chainset would probably knock 100g off. Assuming the seat is this one you could save another 100-200g with anything aimed at XC. If you have the stock seatpost you got with the bike you might want to weigh it, you can pick up cheap FSA/Ritchey etc seatposts on ebay for next to nothing and lop off another 100g.

Roughly 450g is 1lb by the way, it all adds up

Aux1

Ahh, but I was just happy with my wheels!
At first I remember checking them for true alignment all the time after bumpy rides, but then I figured out they simply stay true no matter what I throw at them. Ok, guess they aren't high end, but they sure are reliable.

Actually, I put on the new fork, brakes, shifters and bars on the bike, and now it stays pretty much as it is. The next big investment will be a whole new higher-end bike (something all-mountain style but not heavy). I'm gonna upgrade this bike mostly when the old parts fail.

But thanks for letting me know... So, when it's upgrade time, I'll check out some light parts one at a time!

toasty

I wouldn't worry too much, 30lbs isn't too heavy. Your forks, tires, brakes, gearing etc is all very highly rated stuff for the price. I'd probably keep it a while then catch a full new bike in a sale whenever you feel the need, on the plus side, if you ride a heavier bike for a while, switching to a lighter one makes uphill feel like a breeze

A few bits, like the brakes you might even end up switching across to a new bike.

Edit:

Oh and you can always test wheel weights easily, I cheekily use the kitchen scales when the missus isn't looking. Bare in mind your inner tube will weight about 200 grams, I think your tires are about 680g (assuming they're the light kevlar ones) and wheel should weight about 800g to 1100g or so, finally the rotor will be around 200g-250g I'd guess. There's also skewers which will add a small amount, about 50g-100g per wheel.

So all in I'd expect yours to be about:

700 + 1000 + 225 + 60 + 200 = 2185g (4.8lbs)

A lighter setup could be about:

450 + 750 + 150 + 50 + 200 = 1600g (3.5lbs) fairly easily, even less if you ran tubeless.

It doesn't have to be too expensive, just for reference my Mavic Crossride (£110 a pair) + Specialized Roll X (£25 for 2!) comes in at 1800g.

supersonic

Most quoted wheel weights on sites are without rimtapes, rotors tubes tyres or skewers unless stated. Crossride 6bolt disc wheels for example are 910g front, 1060g rear.

dav1

My bike is about 33lbs, being a £300 bike you would expect nothing less but I plan to chop off weight as I go.

Im going for a lighter seat (feels like sitting on a rock), ligher bars as I want to upgrade to some wider ones anyway, and ligher tyres when I get some winter ones.

The rest of the weight loss stuff just doesnt seem worth doing, after I have done it all I find that ill be out of pocket and might as well buy a new lighter bike so for now im just going to live with it.

stevieboy

AUX1 - I'm in the same position as you - roughly 30lb bike (Kona Hoss Deluxe with MX pro ETA's) but to be honest i just find the extra weight a fitness aid until i'm a good/fit enough rider to warrant a lighter/better specced bike.

Aux1

Dav1 wrote:

My bike is about 33lbs, being a £300 bike you would expect nothing less but I plan to chop off weight as I go.

Im going for a lighter seat (feels like sitting on a rock), ligher bars as I want to upgrade to some wider ones anyway, and ligher tyres when I get some winter ones.

The rest of the weight loss stuff just doesnt seem worth doing, after I have done it all I find that ill be out of pocket and might as well buy a new lighter bike so for now im just going to live with it.

Well, I think we'll just get stronger pushing those bikes uphill, if not faster...

I was on a budget and I bought a 500ish gbp bike, could have bought one for twice the money but I just couldn't sit and wait for the next pay, had to get a bike and ride!
Afterwards I bought the new fork (same travel but it feels stiffer, more stable) and brakes (essential, old ones just didn't cut it). My bike is a great companion now, sometimes I wish it had a 130mm fork or 5 lbs less but it does everything with a grade 4 out of 5.

Now, you can buy a mid range bike and then figure out it's not good enough for mad descents or light enough for racing... And then you can put new forks, higher end groupsets, lighter wheels and other stuff, and possibly spend more money than buying a whole new proper race or all mountain bike, while not getting exactly what you want.

I mean, it's fun but I think later upgrades are more expensive than a whole new better bike.

I like pushing it (within limits) on descents over rough terrain, but I like to race XC recreationally too and I'd want a bike that could do it both. So I guess it should be a 5-inch all-mountain bike. I saw full suspension bikes with pretty long travel, but still very light. But those are also pretty expensive. However, I think I could get me one that's really good and versatile, and then take care of it, put fancy carbon upgrades on it and use it for a long, long time because it's THE bike that meets all my needs, and so the cost would be justified.

P.s. does Cannondale Prophet fit that description? I heard only good things about it...

Aux1

stevieboy wrote:

AUX1 - I'm in the same position as you - roughly 30lb bike (Kona Hoss Deluxe with MX pro ETA's) but to be honest i just find the extra weight a fitness aid until i'm a good/fit enough rider to warrant a lighter/better specced bike.

Oh, I like the Hoss, saw guys who do crazy things with it and the bike can take it all. The frame looks so strong. One guy has a Drop-Off IV 130mm fork, and the other put on the Z1 FR 150mm one with 203mm rotor! I asked if it's a bit too much and he said maybe yes, but that he's confident the frame can take it. Anyway, that makes it into one hell of a hardcore hardtail on mad descents (hehe, I could still catch up with him though). And it still climbs with ETA. The only thing is that they're a bit heavy, more than my bike anyway and if I bought a new bike, it would have to be lighter than the current one.

Dave F.

Hi

Don't know about you, but for me the heaviest bit on my bike is... Me.

A few people have talked to me about shaving grams off their bike by buying titanium this & carbon fibre that & all but one was carrying a spare tyre. :roll:

I loose weight off my bike by going for a dump just before I go & ride.

Cheers
Dave F.

nicklouse

Aux.

just been re reading this post as i have built up a new bike (or red that as changed some parts on it)

and i would say the biggest change you could do is the wheels followed by the frame.

you did keep all the old parts?

yours is what 13.5 kg? mine is 12.1kg now i know where i could lose 500 grams or more.

mainly in the crankset. and the gears. and mine is a fully.

mike kluge

Blimey, to put things into perspective, my race bike weighed 28lbs..and that was 1990! And it was fairly mid-range.

Agree with the comments about wheels and frame, and particularly the spare tyre. I've had some time away from the sport of mtb and I am really surprised at the lack of attention that is paid to xc bike weights these days.

It seems the technology has developed (discs, suspension etc) but there's no substitute for fitness and skill. I once watched a couple of pro cyclo-crossers (who showed up to a National xc event riding shop spec bog standard mountain bikes) destroy a field of hardened mountain bikers on exotic equipment. Just get out there mate and get practicing!

stevieboy

Aux1 wrote:

stevieboy wrote:

AUX1 - I'm in the same position as you - roughly 30lb bike (Kona Hoss Deluxe with MX pro ETA's) but to be honest i just find the extra weight a fitness aid until i'm a good/fit enough rider to warrant a lighter/better specced bike.

Oh, I like the Hoss, saw guys who do crazy things with it and the bike can take it all. The frame looks so strong. One guy has a Drop-Off IV 130mm fork, and the other put on the Z1 FR 150mm one with 203mm rotor! I asked if it's a bit too much and he said maybe yes, but that he's confident the frame can take it. Anyway, that makes it into one hell of a hardcore hardtail on mad descents (hehe, I could still catch up with him though). And it still climbs with ETA. The only thing is that they're a bit heavy, more than my bike anyway and if I bought a new bike, it would have to be lighter than the current one.

Yeah it certainly takes a beating alright, but I like the idea that the frame will stand up to it incase I ever land heavy.

Going back to some further points made on this topic since i've got back into training i've lost the equivilant weight of shelling out about £2k on a light race xc bike or swapping for lighter components - money well saved and I feel a hell of a lot better for it.

The only thing I will be swapping as mentioned above is the wheel/tyre combo and maybe the ultra flexy chainset that came with the bike. Having weighed the wheels and tyres I know that the savings will be in lbs rather than g's.

John Stevenson

stevieboy wrote:

since i've got back into training i've lost the equivilant weight of shelling out about £2k on a light race xc bike or swapping for lighter components - money well saved and I feel a hell of a lot better for it.

Good sanity check that.

Most of us could easily lose a few pounds, which is far more beneficial than saving weight off the bike because the process of shedding it will almost certainly involve fitness gains too.

Magazines and websites have indoctrinated us to worry about weight (and I've contributed more than a little myself over the years) but, within reason[1], it's actually one of the least important things about a bike unless you're racing at high level.

Handling, tyre grip, reliability of brakes and gears and so on are all far more important. If you enjoy riding your current bike, then it's far cheaper in the long run to ride it as-is and buy a whole new bike if you want something substantially lighter.

[1] Nobody wants to lug around a 40lb bike, but I defy anyone to prove to me that they can tell a 28lb bike from a 29lb bike just by riding it.

nicklouse

true 1lb will be hard. but i had an interesting conversation with some riders last weekend.

situation 3 riders 3 bikes. one bike out of action. i offer one of mine for them to use.

the DH rider 200mm front and 225mm rear travel comes away learning a lot. the Yeti ASX rider wants to buy my bike. the XC rider on the Spesh enduro rides the DH rig and does some drops.

my loaned bike ? a 150mm front and 140mm rear FR lite bike (AM maybe), now these riders were using bikes from 20kg to 16kg yes they could tell the diference and were riding accordingly. now the difference between the enduro and mine was minimal but it helped in the security feeling. ok the lbs is a tad greater than your sugested but specs and weights.......if a bike inspires us to ride harder or longer it can only be a good thing.

Weight has a big issue but if it cant do the job then it is worthless.

Aux1

The wheel/tyre stuff sounds interesting. Lighter wheels would make braking and accelerating easier because they have less rotational energy, guess it would make the biggest difference on a twisty singletrack. Not that much on uphills, because then they don't spin fast and their energy is low. But maybe heavier fast spinning wheels make the bike more stable on downhills? Like a gyro, that counteracts the force that's trying to tilt it's axis of rotation? (I know that cause I read my powerball manual lol) Heh, maybe that's why it's easier to ride with no hands when you go fast! :idea:

Well, I'm not gonna upgrade my bike anymore unless something fails. Gonna get a new one when I improve my skills. If I wreck my rims, I'll buy a really good wheelset to pass between bikes as Toasty said. The brakes too, I just love them.


P.s. How did you figure out my frame was heavy? Maybe because the bike ain't that expensive and those don't get the ultra light frames?

Could be strong though...

nicklouse

the best way to work out whats heavy on a bike is look at all the parts and then a simlar speced bike and compare the weights.

EG my fully with X-,7 oros, rebas, firex cranks ....... is 12kg (about)

add to that most parts weights are available online....