Help Me Choose A Bike !

kevr6384

Hi All,

Second post here now in my epic struggle to find a hardtail to suit my needs and budget.

Im down to a few options now and am looking for opinions on my shortlist

1: Carrera Fury
http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_storeId_10001_catalogId_10151_productId_240419_langId_-1_CarSelectorCatalogId__CarSelectorGroupId__varient__categoryId_82394_crumb_33980-33957-82393-82395_parentcategoryrn_82394

2: Voodo Bantu
http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_storeId_10001_catalogId_10151_productId_258459_langId_-1_CarSelectorCatalogId__CarSelectorGroupId__varient__categoryId_82394_crumb_33980-33957-82393-82395_parentcategoryrn_82394

3: Mongoose Tyax Super
http://www.wiggle.co.uk/ProductDetail.aspx?Cat=cycle&ProdID=5360026562

4: Boardman Comp

5: Decathlon Rockrider - Seems awfully cheap but i cant find a bad review
http://www.decathlon.co.uk/EN/Product_arborescence/cycle-and-rolle/bikes/mountain-bikes/mtb-sporting/product_6171375/index.html

So guys & girls, give me your opinions on the above so i can shorten my list and try and find dealers to test them.

Thanks

Anonymous

well, we don't know what your needs are?!?

kevr6384

Sorry,

Main focus on riding is:

1: Local XC routes on mild terrain - quite a lot of coastal paths etc

2: Man made singletrack, such as Kielder, Glentress etc, riding all routes including the tamer black runs. Max drop offs say 3ft!

kevr6384

Right,

Have just been to test ride the boardman carrera and the voodoo.

Have to say i am taking a fancy to the Boardman at the minute.

BUT

Ive also noticed the Specialized Rockhopper Disc with £100 at evans down to £549

Comparing the two what would peoples prefernce be on specification basis.

My basic knowledge says the Boardman as i think it has a better fork ?

Help Please !

Anonymous

erm, I wouldn't go for any of the above, personally.
ESPECIALLY the decathlon. Spec is so vague I don't trust it, looks like a cheapo catalogue bike.
But, if I was forced to choose, I'd suggest the carrera fury.

I'm guessing that your budget is up to £500 MAX, so I'd suggest one of the following... (in order of preference)
Marin Bobcat Trail £449
Kona Cinder Cone Mountain Bike 2007]Kona cinder cone £490
GT Avalanche 1.0 £379.99

Big n Daft

Rockhopper at that price is a steal.

Fury is a top machine, I have one and it will do what your planning well.

Boardman is a heck of a spec for the money.

At your price point, hardtail is without doubt the way to go, full suss will be compromised in some way.

Minimum spec imho is Tora fork, hydro discs, Sram X7 or Shimano LX/XT drivetrain at £500, its going to come down to which one feels the best.

I would try those three and see which frame geometry suits you best.

kevr6384

Thanks,

Marin has a basic fork though with the Dral1 ? No Lockout & mechanical brakes ?
Cindercone looks ok but i think i would get a better fork on the boardman ?

Yeehaamcgee - Out of interest what puts you off personally ?

Think i will test ride the rockhopper the boardman and fury again !

So many choices and they all feel good !

supersonic

The Marin and Kona are pretty poorly specced compared to the opposition, but worth a test. And thats the key, go and try out before you buy. The Decathlon is a dual susser, excellent spec and award winning bike in both MBUk and WMB. However this may not mean its the best choice for you. Fury and Tyax also test winners and well regarded with excellent specs, the Fury being unbeatable at its price point.

Anonymous

kevr6384 wrote:

Yeehaamcgee - Out of interest what puts you off personally ?

Well, my philosophy is
"get a bike with a decent frame, and it'll do you forever. Parts will wear out and need to be replaced anyway, so I don't see much point in getting top-drawer componentry on a cheap (first?) MTB. Replace and upgrade components as they wear out."
Grumbling about niggly things at this kind of price point is like pissing in the ocean.
"Fork's crap on that one" - Well, yeah, that's 'cause it's a cheap mountain bike.

Carrera, Parts aren't too bad, but I've never been impressed by the attention to detail on the frames.They tend to be heavy, and the geometry is often WAY out from what I prefer.
Frames appear to be mass-produced clones, or inspection cast-offs. Alignment can be well dodgy.

Boardman bikes. Yeah, decent spec for the money, but don't you kinda prefer that money to go on a solid frame? In all seriousness, the spec of these bikes suggests serious, possibbly dangerous skimping on the quality of the frame. Especially seeing as they're meant to be triple butted.
I'm speculating wildly here, but the MTBs may well be constructed from super-uber-silly-light road bike tubing.

If memory serves me correctly, Marin do a 10 year guarantee on 7000-series frames.
I've seen Konas older than their riders and still going strong.
The GT has a 6061 frame. That's just incredulous at that price range.

Although, if you can stretch to the rockhopper disc - Go for it. Excellent bike.

Also, go round your local bike shops, and ask if they've got any older (not neccessarily second hand) models going cheap. MTBs have been pretty sorted for the past several years now, you won't regret buying even a 2004 model if you can get hold of one.
It might also be worth considering that the 2008 bikes are about to be released, which will drive the prices down on 2007 models and earlier, in a very short while.

kevr6384

Thanks for your opinions.

The way i was looking at it was that if it lasted me three years for £500 ish its a decent enough buy.

Going to go and have another look at the spec rockhopper maybes tomorrow

Thanks

Rykard

WHat about the rockrider 8.1? That got a good review last year in WMB iirc

Big n Daft

yeehaamcgee wrote:

I'm speculating wildly here

Sorry but yes, you certainly are.

Do you have any evidence or facts whatsoever to back up your assertions?

I do believe with the exception of a few hand-finished frames, the most widely available (as in mass produced) aluminium frames are made by 3 or 4 companies. Meridia being one of them.

Of course i may very well be incorrect, but to say that Carrera frames are sub-standard 'inspection cast offs' or the Boardman frame is potentially dangerous with no back up evidence or reported problems is ridiculous in the extreme.

To be honest if the frames were that bad, i do think someone somewhere would of noticed, there would either be reports of frame failures all over the internet, or in all probability the professional bike journo's who awarded the Carrera a best buy in a group of 5 cycles test would have picked it up.

I would not recommend any bike with an undamped fork for XC, what is the point? Yeah i will agree Kona and Marin make nice frames, but if you have to spend £450 on the bike then another £250 to bring it to the same spec as an existing £500 bike.....why not just spend £700 in the first place?

I agree that geometry will always be king, but find the trade-off between good fit/reasonable components/price.

Imho the absolute minimum spec for a reasonable £500 +/- £50 XC cycle should be a solid rebound damped/lockout equipped fork, hydro brakes and a higher quality drivetrain. Anything less is just false economy.

Anonymous

Hey, I said I was speculating wildly.
I don't see that hydro brakes are that much of a necessity on an XC bike, really.

And it it just my opinion, as I said, I was speculating. Personally, I wouldn't buy a bike for as little as 500 quid.

supersonic

6061 alloy is the cheapest and easiest to form, so often seen on budget hardtails. 7005 is used too, but harder to work with, but a little stronger - the frames often have less forming and simpler designs. Both work well if built properly. The Fury frame is/was made by merida, is very light and used 7 double butted tubes giving a lovely ride feel. No other bike at this price has 7 double butted tubes.

However getting a good frame is a good point, but many people want a package that works well allround straight away and that inludes a fork that works. The fury fork for example is 170 quid to get new and performs faultlessly.

V brakes and discs are preference really. I use Vs on my XC bike, discs on my hardcore hardtail. Beginners may fare better with budget hydros as the modulation in the wet is better, and are more predictable.

Big n Daft

Well given the choice I don't think any of us would.

That's the point.....Obviously the more you pay on the whole the more your going to get for your money. Unfortunately life doesn't work like that.

The guy has a budget, surely the best advice is to find the best trade off bike in that price range. Not something that will give him sub-standard parts for what he wants to do.

I said hydros because

a) In the British weather any braking surface that's away from the mud and moisture found on trails is far more efficient.

b) Mechanical disc brakes do tend to take more work to keep in tip top condition, not always the best thing for someone who may be unsure of the way they work. Hydro's again give the best trade off between functionality, ease of use and maintenance.

supersonic

Even sub 300 quid bikes are getting 8spd, damped adjustable forks and discs, incredible! Cable discs can be a good option if you cant a afford a bike with hydros, as you at least know it has disc wheels. They do of course, as above, take more fettling. Mine work powerfully (Hayes MX2). Personally I think all bikes 350 quid and above should have damped forks, especially if designed for trails or harder off road riding. Best frame in the world makes no difference if the front end bounces about!

kevr6384

Hi,

Thanks for your opinions and your interesting debate:

Your right I have a budget that i need to stick to - life just aint fair.

You may not buy a bike for £500 but i either buy one at that price or do without - simple really.

If i had £1000 to spend i would be looking at a bike with the best spec at the price range.

I think that components wise i will be looking at the boardman and the rockhopper disc as i feel i will get best value for money compenents wise with these two.

I will ignore your comments on dodgy frames for the minute and if i buy the boardman i will let you all know if i snap it.

The reason im looking for the best spec is the bike if i am replacing was going to cost in the region of £500 to update with decent forks and hydro brakes so hence that it my budget.

Thanks Again

Kev

Anonymous

I still maintain that compromising on the frame is a big mistake.

kevr6384

Ok,

So for us mere mortals how would i define a good or a bad frame ?

Big n Daft

Well I still maintain that calling frames into question without any supporting evidence whatsoever is utterly ludicrous.

You simply cannot compare frames in a real world situation, there are too many variables,

Frame material, riders weight, type of terrain ridden, how many jumps/hard landings, what type of fork is used, how many time said forks bottoms out and so on and so on.

All of the above variables put stress through a frame. For example if I take a lightweight Marin frame over a 6 foot jump and it snaps a chainstay, but then i take a cheap welded steel frame over the same jump and it doesn't does that make the steel frame better?

Of course it doesn't, its all about suitability and the type of abuse they are likely to take.

Oh and just for the record, my 7 tube, fully double butted cheap 'inspection cast off Carrera frame' has I believe (although i will check for definite) a ten year frame warranty as well.

Big n Daft

kevr6384 wrote:

Ok,

So for us mere mortals how would i define a good or a bad frame ?

Imho?

90% of frames within a given price range are not that much different, as i said I believe they are all made by 3 or 4 different companies in the far east.

Unless you are going to be paying fortunes for a bike as in well over a grand for a hardtail, you are going to get frames that are shared between different bikes in that manufacturers range, for example Specialised Rockhopper frames are i believe the same M4 frames throughout the range, from the £549 to the £900+ bike, just fitted with different components.

They will differ in geometry from manufacturer to manufacturer, but in all but a few at say £400 to £1000, materials and method of manufacture will be the same. Generally 7005 aluminium and double butted. Most of the difference you will see in names and the like is just different names for the same process.

Best way to pick a frame is to buy the bike that fits you best, you are more likely to get a bike you can push that bit harder without putting undue stress on, simply due to not being in an unnatural position with stress going through parts of the frame not used or built for it

Anonymous

I've had 3 Carreras bought for me, by my parents, in my younger days.
They were never perfectly aligned, and only ever had a 1 or 2 year warranty. The geometry was just plain odd. Whelbase was too short, and the bb height was too high on one, and way too low on the other two.
One of them snapped in half on a three foot drop. That was the most extreme thing that frame had ever done.
The welds weren't bad, but weren't exemplary either.

They were fine if you just wanted to cycle to your mate's house, or to work and back, just a general duty bicycle.
They couldn't cope with proper mountain biking though.
For the three bikes I had, that isn't speculation, that is fact.

but this was a long time ago. I haven't ridden or thoroughly inspected one since.

Anonymous

kevr6384 wrote:

{snipped}
You may not buy a bike for £500 but i either buy one at that price or do without - simple really.

I think that components wise i will be looking at the boardman and the rockhopper disc as i feel i will get best value for money compenents wise with these two.

The reason im looking for the best spec is the bike if i am replacing was going to cost in the region of £500 to update with decent forks and hydro brakes so hence that it my budget.
Kev

Hey, I'm not knocking you personally for buying a 500 quid bike, we've all been there.
What I'm saying is that I ended up giving those bikes the kind of hammering they couldn't cope with, so personally I wouldn't do it again.

I honsetly don't think that hydro disc brakes are that neccessary if you're just getting into the sport.

Also, I would actually prefer to buy a rigid mountain bike for 500 quid (nobody seems to make them any more) rather than bother with cheap suspension forks.
You will learn how to ride, faster, on a rigid. Rigid forks also tend to be just that, rigid. Low end suspension forks can flex wildly, buggering up the handling, and in some situations being quite dangerous.

kevr6384

Hi,

Ive ridden my existing hardtail for a few years now, firstly with mech discs which were binned in favour of Avid Single Digit 7 V's which i was very happy with, hence the reason i want to try hydro's.

Its not a first bike im after its just the budget limitations that i have to work to which limit my choice, as i've previousley said im looking for the best specced bike around the £500 mark.

My existing Claud Butler has served me well and the frame technology when it was built is likely to be nowhere near what it is today. Its handled plenty of 3.5ft drops in its time.

Big n Daft

Then the original choices still stand.

Fury,

Boardman Comp,

Spesh Rockhopper,

Giant XTC 3.5 is worth a look at this price also. http://www.cpcycles.com/products.php?plid=m1b3s2p949

These are without doubt the four best price vs decent spec bikes you are going to find. As has been said many times.....try before you buy.

Good luck.

kevr6384

Thanks Big N Daft

We are getting back on track here !

benjdr

Does the Cape Wrath not deserve a mention in this price range?
http://www.bikeradar.com/mtb/gear/categ ... 7-07-14054

supersonic

The thing is, many sus forks on 500 quid bikes are just fine. Toras, darts, sr xcr a lot better than 10 years ago when it was Indys and RST 281s!

CB Cape Wrath did very well in the Bike of the Year im WMB, definitely worth testing.

dart

I've had my Boardman Comp a couple of weeks now and it's been great, admittedly I haven't hammered it, but it's been good on the trails.
I narrowed my search down to similar bikes to you, Spesh RockhopperDisc, Fury, XTC 4.5 but when I went to look at the Fury (at B&D's recomendation I hasten to add) I was introduced to the Boardman. The Fury was pretty good but I liked the feel of the Boardman and was attracted to the spec level, I'm a gangly 6'3" and the Boardman was a better fit.
I think there's alot in having a good frame as a foundation, the Spesh has a great reputation, but so far no prob's with Boardman and rather than continually upgrading components I wanted something reasonably well spec'd out of the box. If i do upgrade in the future it's likely to be to a full sus anyway.

Panhandling Prince

I had a similar problems, but thanks to the guys on here and some research I went with the Scott Scale 50 2007 and I havent looked back.

Best £700 I have ever spent.