Pub crawl!

Alcdrewcp · June 2007

After reading a recent topic about speeding on your bike, where it was pretty much decided that there is no real law stopping you from going above the speed limit (if you capable of doing that, pretty sure I'm not)

It has got me thinking about drinking and biking, where does the law stand on that? OK I'm not really talking about a pub crawl, but if you had 2-3 pints, which would push you over the drink drive limit could you legaly bike?

______________________________________________________________
This is where my witty Elephant prase would be. But Zebra's are so much better.

ChrisLS · June 2007

...not sure on the law, but you would be stupid and dangerous, to yourself and other road users, drunk on a bike...

DavidTQ · June 2007

bit of googling turns up this "Section 30 Road Traffic Act 1988 says: "It is an offence for a person to ride a cycle on a road or other public place when unfit to ride through drink or drugs."

I also recall a case locally that I found outrageous where a guy lost his driving license for being drunk on a bicycle. Quite how the magistrates managed that one I dont know, but it would in no way prevent the guy from going out and doing the same thing the next day as he didnt need a driving license to be on a bike in the first place...

steve_deslandes · June 2007

I think there is an offence of being drunk in charge of a bicycle http://www.advicenow.org.uk/go/feature/feature_104.html and you can lose your driving licence if you are caught I seem to recall.

I once fell off while pulling away from a junction (more embarassing than anything else) while coming back from a pub having drunk about 5 pints of Guiness (lightweight that I was even as a young student) and wouldn't ride after more than 2 pints these days (which probably still puts me above the drink drive limit).

As the above poster said, it's about respect for your fellow man at the end of the day. You could cause an accident while drunk on a bike (so could pedestrians mind), or run someone over.

I have heard that police here in Edinburgh are very loathe to pull people over on bikes unless they are obviously plastered as one more over the limit cyclist is one less drunk driver and they see that as a positive. I wouldn't like to take my chances with that though.

steve_deslandes · June 2007

Sorry DavidTQ wasn't as quick off the mark with my answer.

jonnywilkinson · June 2007

i only ride as much as i do so i can enjoy a drink without turning into a fat ba**ard.

i would never drive after a drink though. the two are not comparable in my view

Jonny
FGG #2545 & #2983

Alcdrewcp · June 2007

Chris, Yeah I agree, it's not a wise thing to be doing. Due to the risk manly to yourself. If you were that drunk that you were wobbling all over the road.

So it is offence to ride a bicycle whilst unfit through drink, but as far as I can find out (although, not looked that hard) wher doesn't seem to be a legal limit like with cars where it's so many mg per breath or something.

With that in mind, what would be unfit? I guess not been able to bike in a straight line. But if I had a couple of drinks on my way home I'd probably be alright, on a bike but not in a car.

______________________________________________________________
This is where my witty Elephant prase would be. But Zebra's are so much better.

dondare · June 2007

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by steve_deslandes

I think there is an offence of being drunk in charge of a bicycle http://www.advicenow.org.uk/go/feature/feature_104.html and you can lose your driving licence if you are caught I seem to recall.

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

To be drunk in charge of a bicycle you don't even have to be riding it.

This sig is under construction.

Regulator · June 2007

Get a recumbent trike. You can drink and not fall off... [:D]

___________________________
Bugger elephants - capabari are cuter!

el_presidente · June 2007

Back in the day I would have happily had 2 pints before driving, now I stay off it completely.

I cycled home the other day after 2 pints, I felt OK but I wouldn't want to make a habit of it.

thedoctor · June 2007

Sorry - I'd like some legal opinion on this.
I don't believe you can be banned from driving for a non-driving offense, which is what drunken cycling is.

OK - I'll just have one more baby elephant...

DavidTQ · June 2007

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by TheDoctor

Sorry - I'd like some legal opinion on this.
I don't believe you can be banned from driving for a non-driving offense, which is what drunken cycling is.

OK - I'll just have one more baby elephant...
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Whether or not it was a legal system travesty that would have been overturned with good solicitors I do not know but it DID happen down here a few years back!

Greenbank · June 2007

It's because you've proven that you can't be trusted when it comes to the country's roads and, since the ability to drive is quite important for many people in this country, it's designed to knock some sense into them in a way they'll, hopefully, understand.

Think about the things you can get points for which, strictly, aren't anything to do with your driving (but are secondary to driving). Tyres with less than 5mm of tread? 3pts each. That's got nothing to do with your driving has it? No insurance. 8pts. Still nothing to do with your driving per se.

Obviously, for the people who don't have driving licenses it's a bit meaningless, but often the ban/disqualification is made to start from the day they eventually obtain their license.

--
If I had a baby elephant signature, I'd use that.

graham_g · June 2007

No more than three pints - basically I might feel a little merry but can still ride in a straight line and look behind me easily without a wobble.

RufusA · June 2007

As others have answered the Section 30 of the RTA covers this and uses the test of "whilst unfit".

So provided you can balance, cycle in a straight line, and have an awareness of the traffic / road around you, you would probably pass the fit test. BUT DON'T drink and cycle!

For reference for the whole of 2004 the following statisics are available on Hansard covering just England and Wales:

http://www.publications.parliament.uk/p ... 116w65.htm

Reckless and dangerous driving by pedal cyclist (Section 28):
37 prosecutions, 32 found guilty.

Careless driving by pedal cyclist (Section 29)
94 prosecutions, 73 found guilty.

Pedal cyclist driving under the influence of drink or drugs (Section 30)
45 prosections, 40 found guilty.

So the risk of prosecution is minor, and almost negligible if you are female, or can at least do a passable impression!

There have been cases of people losing their driving license for riding GoPeds on the pavement whilst above the legal limit ("Motor Vehicle"). Cases in the US where people have lost driving licenses for being drunk in charge of a bicycle. However AFAIK a cycling offence in the UK cannot impact your driving license.

Be safe - don't drink and cycle!

HTH - Rufus.

Nigeyy · June 2007

I would hazard a guess most cyclists have their stories of drinking and cycling.

Mine was back in the 1980's when I was a student, and when back at home, I went out with friends (all on bikes so everyone could have a drink if they wanted to) on various Xmas Eve and New Years Eves. Of course usually it was cold to start off with, but perhaps not unsurprizingly, felt much warmer as the evening wore on. Our record stood at well over 20 miles cycled in one evening -and I'd say all of us thought we might have done 2 miles at the most.

I agree that it isn't a wise thing to do, though I'd be untruthful if I said I didn't enjoy it -I look back it at now as one of my fondest memories. Not that there's an excuse for this, but we were out in the middle of the countryside, and we'd dismount and get out of the way when we heard or saw a car coming (which was rarely anyway), which was easy to do.

Still, you are a potential road hazard and even though you're probably more likely just to injure yourself rather than others, I wouldn't want to place a vehicle driver in the situation of causing injury even through no fault of their own or making emergency services turn out. I wouldn't do it again -I think it was more of a result of my reckless youth and not thinking. I do wonder about what the police think though; from a practical point of view, it is probably less worse to ride a bicycle after drinking than driving a car. So long as someone doesn't appear out of control, I'd be inclined to let them go, but I'd understand why others wouldn't.

Fight Cystic Fibrosis: do something. http://www.cycleforhaylee.org http://www.cff.org

Bloke on a bikecp · June 2007

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Alcdrew

So it is offence to ride a bicycle whilst unfit through drink, but as far as I can find out (although, not looked that hard) wher doesn't seem to be a legal limit like with cars where it's so many mg per breath or something.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

There isn't a legal limit. The law simply says "Unfit", which can be pretty subjective. The breathaliser law only relates to motor vehicles. You cannot be breathalised on a bicycle.
This makes it rather difficult for a cop to prove (we've all seen those American videos of traffic cops making people walk along white lines, recite the alphabet backwards etc)
Consequently you're not likely to get pulled unless you are very obviously drunk.

--
Basil W Brush

BentMikey · June 2007

I find it hard to believe that someone got points on his driving license for cycling drunk. Can you quote references?

Same goes for "speeding" on a bicycle, you can't get done for speeding in most places, but you could for something else, and you definitely can't get points on your D/L for it. Careless/Dangerous cycling or pedalling furiously I think.

My bikes
My skates

If I had a baby elephant, I'd teach it to skate.

DavidTQ · June 2007

The case I'm remembering the guy didnt get points he was banned from driving, it was some time between 97-99 in Newton Abbot. From what I remember the guy was seriously drunk on a bike went into the back of a car or something and the magistrates ended up taking away his driving licence, which nobody at the time could understand how or why they did that when he was on a bicycle and taking away his licence in no way stopped him doing the same thing the next day... unfortunately local papers online archives go back about 3 months [:(].

FrankM · June 2007

Schedule 2 to the Road Traffic Offenders Act 1988 sets out the various punishments which can be handed out for cycling offences under the Road Traffic Act 1988. None of the offences appear to allow disqualification, endorsement or penalty points, so either the magistrates got it wrong or the man was also charged with something else. Struggling to think what.

DavidTQ · June 2007

I remember at the time it made no sense whatsoever, no one I spoke to at the time could understand how or why it happened either. I would guess its not impossible that a magistrate who doesnt deal with cycles offences often could decide to interpret a cycle as a vehicle and decide to apply punishments as per car related stuff or possibly I guess applied leaving the scene of an accident? Magistrates CAN do some bizarre stuff at times. Not everyone can afford or has the wits to appeal a decision [:(]

Hairy Jock · June 2007

Under the Licensing Act 1872 it is an offence to be drunk in a highway or other public place. So technically it is an offence to dunk in a public house (with or without a bike), so a law more honoured in the breach that the observance...

A hirsute Scotsman.

**************

Best advice I ever got was "better get a bike then"
Cycle commuting since 1994. Blog with cycle bits.

keepontriking · June 2007

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Bloke on a bike

The breathaliser law only relates to motor vehicles. You cannot be breathalised on a bicycle

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I was breathalised when knocked off at a roundabout.

The Bosscp · June 2007

It's interesting to note the bit about being "unfit" without a specific numerical definition, posted by Bloke on a bike, and that you can't actually be breathalysed while on a bike.

Some people are better at drink-cycling than others.

<hr noshade size="1">
CyclingIsPermittedAlongThisFootpath GenericPath

graham_g · June 2007

Smoking and cycling is where it's at [:D]

steve_deslandes · June 2007

So we've got someone saying they were breathalysed and someone else saying you can't be breathalysed. Can someone with finer legal skills than me come up with the definitive answer for what one can and can't fall foul of while on a bike, and if so can one get one's driving licence taken from them if they are found guilty.

Re the driving licence thing, I'd heard apocryphal stories about people prosecuted for having no lights receiving penalty points too. Like other people, I'd like corroborated evidence on this.

FatBlokeFromFelixstowe · June 2007

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by steve_deslandes

So we've got someone saying they were breathalysed and someone else saying you can't be breathalysed. Can someone with finer legal skills than me come up with the definitive answer for what one can and can't fall foul of while on a bike, and if so can one get one's driving licence taken from them if they are found guilty.

Re the driving licence thing, I'd heard apocryphal stories about people prosecuted for having no lights receiving penalty points too. Like other people, I'd like corroborated evidence on this.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

There is no way you can get points on your driving licence for a cycle offence as of course you do not need one to ride your cycle.

I too used to regually ride home from the local pub back in my teen days and stopped the moment a brick wall jumped out in front of me one night, lesson learnt.

My e bay bargain œ 31.05
http://tinyurl.com/366awv

DavidTQ · June 2007

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by FatBlokeFromFelixstowe

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by steve_deslandes

So we've got someone saying they were breathalysed and someone else saying you can't be breathalysed. Can someone with finer legal skills than me come up with the definitive answer for what one can and can't fall foul of while on a bike, and if so can one get one's driving licence taken from them if they are found guilty.

Re the driving licence thing, I'd heard apocryphal stories about people prosecuted for having no lights receiving penalty points too. Like other people, I'd like corroborated evidence on this.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

There is no way you can get points on your driving licence for a cycle offence as of course you do not need one to ride your cycle.

I too used to regually ride home from the local pub back in my teen days and stopped the moment a brick wall jumped out in front of me one night, lesson learnt.

My e bay bargain œ 31.05
http://tinyurl.com/366awv
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Logic sometimes fails completely in the magistrates courts, young toerags who get caught in stolen cars or driving underage etc can be disqualified from driving even through they would be under the age to get a licence for the entire duration of the disqualification. They had no licence to do what they did they could get no licence anyway during the disqualification period but they get disqualified anyway...

Ale · June 2007

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by keepontriking

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Bloke on a bike

The breathaliser law only relates to motor vehicles. You cannot be breathalised on a bicycle

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I was breathalised when knocked off at a roundabout.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I was knocked off on shoreditch high st on Friday Morning last week (Broken collar bone [:(!] ). The driver was breathalised and I was not.

M3ta7h3ad · June 2007

Surely its plausible for someone to be deemed unsafe to be on public roads, thus can be banned from driving from a non-driving offence.

If someone plowed into a group of school children on a crossing (not necessarily causing death, but may cause injury) whilst cycling under the influence I'd imagine they'd take his licence for a motor vehicle as logic would dicate that he would be "more" dangerous behind the wheel of one.

Cyclecraft - Get it!

jel · June 2007

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Hairy Jock

Under the Licensing Act 1872 it is an offence to be drunk in a highway or other public place. So technically it is an offence to dunk in a public house (with or without a bike), so a law more honoured in the breach that the observance...
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

It is also an offence to supply alchohol to someone who is inebriated.

I am therefore a lawbreaker.

Pub crawl!

Comments

Categories