Evicted on Big Brother for Racism?

Melvil · June 2007

An interesting subject this. I'm not incredibly fond of Big Brother but I read this on a news site. So, one of the contestants was immediately evicted because she called another contestant a n***er.

Wrong, perhaps. Certainly very foolish. But is this not immediately showing up the lie of the 'reality' in reality TV. It seems they allow sex, like drunken debauchery but do not allow some nasty words that may be used in real life, by real people.

Is it just me or is it all a bit 'PC gone too far'? Why not let the public vote her out if her behaviour is bad?

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Flying_Monkey · June 2007

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Melvil
do not allow some nasty words that may be used in real life, by real people.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

It doesn't matter how many people use them, that doesn't produce any right to use them on national TV. She can say it all she likes elsewhere but there's no reason why Channel 4 should give her a platform for racism, as the Ofcom ruling on Celebrity Big Brother clearly stated. No sympathy whatsoever.

Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety

linfordlunchbox · June 2007

The argument for the word 'Nigger' to be removed from all entertainment media in the UK is getting stronger.

It pees me off that the Black rappers and film stars are using it in 'music' and films to increase their 'street cred', but it is villified elsewhere.

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">A spokesman for the Commission For Racial Equality said: "Whichever way you look at it, the 'n' word is clearly offensive.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

"I'd clean my car with a baby elephant - if I had a baby elephant !"

Flying_Monkey · June 2007

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by linfordlunchbox
It pees me off that the Black rappers and film stars are using it in 'music' and films to increase their 'street cred', but it is villified elsewhere.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

That's a more tricky discussion, but I don't think non-black people have really got much to contribute to how black people talk about themselves, amongst themselves...

There are clear and obvious differences between the word 'nigger' used by a non-black person as an insult, and the use of that word by black people themselves, namely intent, context and culture. This doesn't mean all black people agree with these uses, but that is a matter for black people, not for those of us who are not.

Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety

Gary Askwith · June 2007

Are the viewers bigger idiots than the participants? [xx(]

[url][/url]http://www.cartoonstock.com/newscartoons/cartoonists/sbu/lowres/sbun1l.jpg[url][/url]

Economic Growth; as dead as a Yangtze River dolphin....

alecstilleyedye · June 2007

channel 4 has denied us all the chance to show what we think of her behaviour. she was up for eviction and could have been voted off by a massive margin and got booed to high heaven as she came out.

of course it could have raised some uncomfortable questions had the other (incidentally ethnically asian) girl got evicted in spite of it all.

if i had a better signature, i'd use that instead

Unknown · June 2007

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Flying_Monkey

there's no reason why Channel 4 should give her a platform for racism, <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I blame the TV companies that put this drivel on. They scour the sewers of our society for misfits, loonies, bigots and brainless women with big chests, make it clear to them that their only hope of getting off the dole queue is by behaving badly, ply them with drink and get the cameras rolling.

alecstilleyedye · June 2007

ironic as i thought this year to have the most "normal" cast in years. no high campery gay blokes, no slaves to the plastic surgery industry and no transexuals, just fairly normal women and a fairly normal bloke.

if i had a better signature, i'd use that instead

linfordlunchbox · June 2007

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Flying_Monkey

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by linfordlunchbox
It pees me off that the Black rappers and film stars are using it in 'music' and films to increase their 'street cred', but it is villified elsewhere.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

That's a more tricky discussion, but I don't think non-black people have really got much to contribute to how black people talk about themselves, amongst themselves...

There are clear and obvious differences between the word 'nigger' used by a non-black person as an insult, and the use of that word by black people themselves, namely intent, context and culture. This doesn't mean all black people agree with these uses, but that is a matter for black people, not for those of us who are not.

Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

My father was born in India, and although primarily the families settled there from Ireland and England, there were a few inter-racial marriages in the ancestry over the last 200 years. I've been on the end of the term 'paki' because although I mostly look white, people who knew my ancestry have used it in the derogatory way to be offensive when I was younger.

I'd find it just as offensive if it came from an white person or an asian, as in both instances, it is used to demean and belittle !

"I'd clean my car with a baby elephant - if I had a baby elephant !"

gillan1969 · June 2007

racism is state of mind

saying nigger does not make you racist but the intent behind it

this is a 'nice' middle class uni girl

I very much doubt she is racist at all, or only in as much as she propbably doesn't know that many people from outwith her social and economic group....she is merely guilty of stupidity and being rather 'fragrant'..I for one forgive her her lapse[:)]

and to be fair she is but young

Am i racist if i ask for an album by Nigggas with attitude....bloody hell am I racist for typing it???????

when is it right to say it??

www.squadraporcini.com

spire · June 2007

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by gillan1969

racism is state of mind

saying nigger does not make you racist but the intent behind it

this is a 'nice' middle class uni girl

I very much doubt she is racist at all, or only in as much as she propbably doesn't know that many people from outwith her social and economic group....she is merely guilty of stupidity and being rather 'fragrant'..I for one forgive her her lapse[:)]

and to be fair she is but young

Am i racist if i ask for an album by Nigggas with attitude....bloody hell am I racist for typing it???????

when is it right to say it??

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

A surprising (and honest) post from you gillan.

If the word is used with malicious intent, clearly it is unacceptable.

But how do the gangstas justify its use? Aren't they legitimising it?

And following on from FM's point, what if a white person used the word in a friendly way?

Canrider · June 2007

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">But how do the gangstas justify its use? Aren't they legitimising it?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
More they're removing it's power to demean by appropriating it for their own use. This has happened with other minority groups, notably homosexuals appropriating words like 'fag' and 'dyke' to deny them to those that would use them pejoratively.

"We will never win until the oil runs out or they invent hover cars - but then they may land on us." -- lardarse rider

Eat My Dust · June 2007

Because of the great British institutes of The Sun, The Star, The Mirror etc and all the coverage they gave of someone being called "popadom" then CH4 have no other option but to kick anybody even thinking about bad words off of the show. I already see that the news is reporting it as another "race scandal" FFS.

BTW a few years ago there was an Italian guy on BB that was repeatedly called "lasagne", nobody said anything then.

Is it 'cause I'm white?

SNAPS

linfordlunchbox · June 2007

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Canrider

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">But how do the gangstas justify its use? Aren't they legitimising it?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
More they're removing it's power to demean by appropriating it for their own use. This has happened with other minority groups, notably homosexuals appropriating words like 'fag' and 'dyke' to deny them to those that would use them pejoratively.

"We will never win until the oil runs out or they invent hover cars - but then they may land on us." -- lardarse rider
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

This doesn't work, I've heard Ugandan born Asians (Muslims) referring in the derogatory sense about Bangladeshi workers I used to work with as 'Pakis'

All the same skin type, even the same religion, but the intent was no better or worse than if a white man had said it.

"I'd clean my car with a baby elephant - if I had a baby elephant !"

Canrider · June 2007

Give it a bit more of a think, linf. We're all pulling for ya. You'll figure it out in time.

"We will never win until the oil runs out or they invent hover cars - but then they may land on us." -- lardarse rider

Unknown · June 2007

My sister has a Pakistani friend from school, from the age of about 12/13 up to the present day (they're both 30+) they still refer to each other a 'White Trash' and 'Paki', neither mean any offence, and neither take any offence, all in good humour really.

Isn't it all about context?

flattythehurdler · June 2007

I quite like being called paddy, and my nickname is pikey. I don't find it at all offensive. In fact, the only number plate i would ever contemplate owning is P1KEY. As above, i think it the intent rather than the content which is important. Why are you all watching it anyway? I heve never seen even 5 minutes of any of them.

Dan

Unknown · June 2007

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Canrider

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">But how do the gangstas justify its use? Aren't they legitimising it?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
More they're removing it's power to demean by appropriating it for their own use. This has happened with other minority groups, notably homosexuals appropriating words like 'fag' and 'dyke' to deny them to those that would use them pejoratively.

"We will never win until the oil runs out or they invent hover cars - but then they may land on us." -- lardarse rider
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I'm not convinced of the logic of that. Certainly if an insulting term is used so commonly that no one takes any notice of it, it cease to be an insult. However, those who wish to use it pejoratively will not be denied the use of it - they are merely using it with less effect.

linfordlunchbox · June 2007

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Canrider

Give it a bit more of a think, linf. We're all pulling for ya. You'll figure it out in time.

"We will never win until the oil runs out or they invent hover cars - but then they may land on us." -- lardarse rider
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I understand what you are saying, but fag (faggot) and dyke are already slang and not the official term. I don't think that the Gay community own these terms, and they are still being used in the derogatory sense. There are more offensive terms in the vocabulary now which have taken their place for Gays.

Negro, and its derivative 'Nigger' harks back to the slave days and as such will always be seen as a term of oppression.

"I'd clean my car with a baby elephant - if I had a baby elephant !"

Canrider · June 2007

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">I'm not convinced of the logic of that. Certainly if an insulting term is used so commonly that no one takes any notice of it, it cease to be an insult. However, those who wish to use it pejoratively will not be denied the use of it - they are merely using it with less effect.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
I never said anything about logic, remember we're dealing with humans here!
The key word, which I omitted, was 'removes some of its power'.

"We will never win until the oil runs out or they invent hover cars - but then they may land on us." -- lardarse rider

Crooky · June 2007

It's a shame as Emily had a beautiful arse.

gillan1969 · June 2007

indeed crooky

enough to excuse a girl a myriad of sins[:)][:)]

www.squadraporcini.com

Cunobelin · June 2007

Please think about this one before responding - it is not meant to defend the use of the word per se.

I do think that some words can be used if it provokes powerful imagery.

Patti Smith has a track called "Rock'n'Roll Nigger

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Baby was a black sheep. Baby was a whore.
Baby got big and baby get bigger.
Baby get something. Baby get more.
Baby, baby, baby was a rock-and-roll nigger.
Oh, look around you, all around you,
riding on a copper wave.
Do you like the world around you?
Are you ready to behave?

Outside of society, they're waitin' for me.
Outside of society, that's where I want to be.

(Lenny!)

Baby was a black sheep. Baby was a whore.
You know she got big. Well, she's gonna get bigger.
Baby got a hand; got a finger on the trigger.
Baby, baby, baby is a rock-and-roll nigger.

Outside of society, that's where I want to be.
Outside of society, they're waitin' for me.

(those who have suffered, understand suffering,
and thereby extend their hand
the storm that brings harm
also makes fertile
blessed is the grass
and herb and the true thorn and light)

I was lost in a valley of pleasure.
I was lost in the infinite sea.
I was lost, and measure for measure,
love spewed from the heart of me.
I was lost, and the cost,
and the cost didn't matter to me.
I was lost, and the cost
was to be outside society.

Jimi Hendrix was a nigger.
Jesus Christ and Grandma, too.
Jackson Pollock was a nigger.
Nigger, nigger, nigger, nigger,
nigger, nigger, nigger.

Outside of society, they're waitin' for me.
Outside of society, if you're looking,
that's where you'll find me.
Outside of society, they're waitin' for me.
Outside of society. (Repeat)
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

The use makes a point about outcasts that another word could not.

He that buys land buys many stones.
He that buys flesh buys many bones.
He that buys eggs buys many shells,
But he that buys good beer buys nothing else.
(Unattributed Trad.)

babyjebus · June 2007

Yeah, but Patti Smith was and is an intelligent woman, not a Peaches Gelldorff lookalike competing on a game show. Imagine being publicly acknowledged as the stupidest person in the Big Brother house. That's got to hurt.

billsters · June 2007

Apart from artistic intent as in Patti Smith, John & Yoko (Woman is the Nigger of the World) I would steer well clear of using the word, as a white person.

If some black people want to use it, (and many rappers use it with the same artistic/ironic intent as Patti & John'n'Yoko, not because they think it's a great word), it's their deal.

I am very suspicious of any white person who insists on their right to use terms like "nigger". Why on earth would you need to? Quentin Tarantino maybe has a case in his films, but most of us are not Quentin Tarantino making a film.

dangerousjules · June 2007

just saw the bb footage...she said the 'n' word alittle too easily, she had to go!

dangerous jules.
god bless those pagans!

ankev1 · June 2007

On another thread I and two or three others were described as being "able to look after themselves" when subject to insult. True enough. I wonder why we don't react in the same way here. If the person to whom the word was directed was offended than there was perhaps a case for removing the girl from the programme. If he or she wasn't, that perhaps should be the end of the matter. FWIW, does anybody know if offence was taken?

spire · June 2007

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by ankev1

On another thread I and two or three others were described as being "able to look after themselves" when subject to insult. True enough. I wonder why we don't react in the same way here. If the person to whom the word was directed was offended than there was perhaps a case for removing the girl from the programme. If he or she wasn't, that perhaps should be the end of the matter. FWIW, does anybody know if offence was taken?
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Indeed, ankev.

But as we know, the main objective of the PC Brigade is to take offence on behalf of others.

That being said, i would never condone the use of the N word, which I do consider deeply offensive.

mmoo · June 2007

Surely the reaction of the other inmates is the whole point of reality TV, did any of them say owt?

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rgisme · June 2007

Personally I think, coming from Emily, this just reinforces the 'dumb blonde' stereotype. How she could imagine, in the wake of the previous BB, and in a situation where all contestants had had to sign anti-racism clauses, that it would be ok to use the 'n' word is beyond me. Even if it is used as a term of endearment in Bristol, which I doubt, if she could hardly have been unaware of the historical perjorative use unless she's been living in a cocoon since she was born. Should she qualify as one of the stupidest contestants ever?

currieinahurry · June 2007

http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/bigbrother8 ... -slur.html
tikka

hi my name is adam... and i have a problem with posting on cycling forums.

Evicted on Big Brother for Racism?

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