Handbuilt wheels... the big thread

What bike and bike bits should you buy?
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ugo.santalucia
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Re: Handbuilt wheels... the big thread

Postby ugo.santalucia » Thu Sep 19, 2019 06:40 am

MrB123 wrote:https://www.cyclingweekly.com/news/product-news/handbuilt-wheels-still-worth-buying-437159


They are...
just last week I was in Italy and a friend on factory wheels managed to bust not one, but two spokes on a steep climb. I just about managed to tweak his spokes so that the wheel could run through the chain stays, so that he could limp home... needless to say, the wheels were just out of warranty and now in the bin (one of the spokes pulled through the hub, so terminal damage).
It's the usual buy cheap, buy twice and in some cases not even that cheap... :wink:

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Step83
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Re: Handbuilt wheels... the big thread

Postby Step83 » Fri Sep 27, 2019 11:01 am

Any thoughts on 650b disc rims? looking to re use my old Hope Pro4 32h hubs. Looking at around 50c tyre wise, lots of spokes as it'll be used for winter and likely bike packing. Tubeless would be nice but not a deal breaker.

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ugo.santalucia
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Re: Handbuilt wheels... the big thread

Postby ugo.santalucia » Fri Sep 27, 2019 11:05 am

Step83 wrote:Any thoughts on 650b disc rims? looking to re use my old Hope Pro4 32h hubs. Looking at around 50c tyre wise, lots of spokes as it'll be used for winter and likely bike packing. Tubeless would be nice but not a deal breaker.


Why do you feel the need for 50 mm tyres?

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Step83
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Re: Handbuilt wheels... the big thread

Postby Step83 » Fri Sep 27, 2019 13:20 pm

ugo.santalucia wrote:
Step83 wrote:Any thoughts on 650b disc rims? looking to re use my old Hope Pro4 32h hubs. Looking at around 50c tyre wise, lots of spokes as it'll be used for winter and likely bike packing. Tubeless would be nice but not a deal breaker.


Why do you feel the need for 50 mm tyres?


Well, nice to have the option, will usually be 35c-40c. A lot of the woods round me the fire roads are basically sand so the added volume helps.

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ugo.santalucia
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Re: Handbuilt wheels... the big thread

Postby ugo.santalucia » Fri Sep 27, 2019 13:33 pm

Make sure you have the clearances... if so, then 650b wheels are inherently more robust than 700c wheels

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Step83
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Re: Handbuilt wheels... the big thread

Postby Step83 » Fri Sep 27, 2019 14:36 pm

More than fine clearance wise, wheel wise it'll take 700c x 45mm or 650B x 52mm as a max. Just not sure rim wise, I'm happy building but last time I did it was a set of 26" mavics with these hubs when they originally came out. Not really clued up on these more modern rims!

anjasola
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Re: Handbuilt wheels... the big thread

Postby anjasola » Fri Sep 27, 2019 14:43 pm

A big shout for wheelsmith.co.uk, first class service.

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ugo.santalucia
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Re: Handbuilt wheels... the big thread

Postby ugo.santalucia » Fri Sep 27, 2019 16:03 pm

Step83 wrote:More than fine clearance wise, wheel wise it'll take 700c x 45mm or 650B x 52mm as a max. Just not sure rim wise, I'm happy building but last time I did it was a set of 26" mavics with these hubs when they originally came out. Not really clued up on these more modern rims!


Same thing

thecycleclinic
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Re: Handbuilt wheels... the big thread

Postby thecycleclinic » Fri Sep 27, 2019 22:10 pm

You can use rims up 23mm or so internal width. Kinlin Tl23 is nice and cheap 40mm is the min useable tyre width for these though. It's an mtb rim so 50mm tyres are best or wider.

Kinlin do the TL21 which 21mm internal width. There are more expensive rims some are lighter Stans and mtb for example) but you have to decide if you cheap and good or more expensive and lighter.
http://www.thecycleclinic.co.uk -wheel building and other stuff.

sopworth
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Re: Handbuilt wheels... the big thread

Postby sopworth » Wed Oct 02, 2019 11:11 am

Hi,
Just a bit of advice before I start. I'm going to commence my first wheel build later. I've got a hub (DT Swiss 350), Velocity major tom rim and DT competition spokes. I'm confident I have the procedure in my mind and on paper, but before I start I wanted to know if folk use motor oil, grease or lube etc on their spoke nipples and on the rim around the holes?
I was intending to use motor oil.
Also - do I need a spoke tension gauge?
Thank you.

edward.s
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Re: Handbuilt wheels... the big thread

Postby edward.s » Wed Oct 02, 2019 11:43 am

I used wet lube on threads and holes. Seems to work OK. Some use Linseed oil.

In all honesty, while it probably does help the spokes not to bind in the holes etc, Its probably not 100% necessary. Lots of tension relieving during the build is what will keep the wheel true.

I regard a tension meter as necessary. Some don't, but I don't have the experience and feel to do it by sound only. The park one works well enough for me.

For reference, I've only built a total of 8 wheels from scratch, and trued a fair few more. So far, some of those 8 wheels have 2000 miles on them and all have remained true.

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ugo.santalucia
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Re: Handbuilt wheels... the big thread

Postby ugo.santalucia » Wed Oct 02, 2019 11:57 am

Any oil... use a cotton swab to lubricate the inside part of the hole, rather than the nipple itself. Also, lightly lubricate the threads of the spokes with some oil soaked cotton

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Re: Handbuilt wheels... the big thread

Postby steveatbath » Fri Oct 04, 2019 20:11 pm

Would a £1200 50mm uk handbuilt on Chris king hubs be better than the equivalent £1200 50mm bora ones?

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ugo.santalucia
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Re: Handbuilt wheels... the big thread

Postby ugo.santalucia » Sat Oct 05, 2019 18:18 pm

steveatbath wrote:Would a £1200 50mm uk handbuilt on Chris king hubs be better than the equivalent £1200 50mm bora ones?


Better in which way?

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Re: Handbuilt wheels... the big thread

Postby steveatbath » Sat Oct 05, 2019 18:39 pm

ugo.santalucia wrote:
steveatbath wrote:Would a £1200 50mm uk handbuilt on Chris king hubs be better than the equivalent £1200 50mm bora ones?


Better in which way?


Ok I’ll re-phrase that as what would the main differences be between the branded wheels and the non branded ones.. similar weight, similar price, same profile

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ugo.santalucia
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Re: Handbuilt wheels... the big thread

Postby ugo.santalucia » Sat Oct 05, 2019 20:41 pm

steveatbath wrote:
ugo.santalucia wrote:
steveatbath wrote:Would a £1200 50mm uk handbuilt on Chris king hubs be better than the equivalent £1200 50mm bora ones?


Better in which way?


Ok I’ll re-phrase that as what would the main differences be between the branded wheels and the non branded ones.. similar weight, similar price, same profile


The hand built ones will be easier to fix should anything happen...

sopworth
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Re: Handbuilt wheels... the big thread

Postby sopworth » Sat Oct 12, 2019 15:58 pm

Advice please…..
I've been building my first wheel recently. I've used a DT swiss 350 front disc hub with DT competition d/b 2-1.8 spokes on a Velocity major tom rim - with the purpose of building a pair for CX.
I've used Roger Musson's pdf book as my guide, but I'm at a point that I can/don't want to move beyond.
Using a x-tools spoken tension meter (I didn't want to use one but bought one due to having tension fear) I've measures the tension on each spoke:
On the disc side (left hand side of front hub), the readings are 50 - 53 which equates to 119 - 145kg. Whilst on the right hand side of the hub the readings are 48-50 which equates to 89 - 110 kg.
Am I right in thinking there disc side of the hub will attract the most tension in the spokes? If so, is my split looking ok? Velocity suggest the rim should be tensioned to 110 - 130 kg - does this mean i'm under tensioned on the right side? Are those 4 spokes on the disc side that are above 130kg going to cause damage?
The wheel is almost true. Radially, there are points where it's out but I'm struggling to adjust (minor, minor adjustments) and laterally it's almost there.
Any help is much appreciated. Don't want to glue a tub on a rim that may give way.
Thanks.

TimothyW
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Re: Handbuilt wheels... the big thread

Postby TimothyW » Sat Oct 12, 2019 17:51 pm

On a front wheel the disc side will be higher tension, on a rear the drive side will still be higher.

To be on the safe side, and assuming your meter is accurate, no spoke tensions should exceed 130kg.

Certainly on the basis that you haven't calibrated your meter or cross checked against another known good wheel, I'd suggest reducing the tension a bit to be on the safe side.

It might be fine as is, or it might be that your rim will start cracking at the nipple holes.

sopworth
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Re: Handbuilt wheels... the big thread

Postby sopworth » Sun Oct 13, 2019 07:04 am

Ok, but if I take tension of all spokes in order to get the disc side within limits, the other side will be well below what Velocity suggest for the rim. Would that not be an issues?
Could I have made this wheel incorrectly?

TimothyW
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Re: Handbuilt wheels... the big thread

Postby TimothyW » Sun Oct 13, 2019 08:49 am

Yeah, it'll be fine. The recommendations apply to the higher tension side.


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