Things you have recently learnt

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rjsterry
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby rjsterry » Fri Sep 20, 2019 11:39 am

HaydenM wrote:
Pross wrote:
HaydenM wrote:
rjsterry wrote:
bompington wrote:
rjsterry wrote:
darkhairedlord wrote:Whenever you go to a parents evening presentation at a school a message appears on the hoooge screen asking to install an update. Every flipping time.


Just been to a school open evening for the local secondary school, which included an impressive performance by the school choir. Slightly spoilt by a three foot high Windows logo hovering above their heads while someone cued up the slideshow to follow.

Few reasons for this:
1. School IT people are a combination of undertrained, underpaid, overworked and useless. Or all of the above.
2. School systems use fascist software like Deep Freeze to ensure that whatever glitches they were set up with keep coming back at you like zombies, every day, for ever.
3. Teachers are a combination of undertrained, underpaid, overworked and useless at IT. Or all of the above.

I am always astonished and dismayed at how many of my colleagues do not have the slightest idea how to design or present even the simplest powerpoint.


A pet peeve is people who claim to 'not know anything about computers', with something approaching pride, as if it wasn't a requirement of their employment to have at least a basic level of proficiency. Why is that still acceptable when computers been commonplace for the last 30 years or so?


This. I have a bit of sympathy for the older members of the team but there are younger guys here who use it as an excuse to refuse to learn how to use new and better mapping/database/analysis software. The software we use is fairly complicated but it is absolutely fundamental to the industry these days and you can't get away with using a glorified version of MS paint anymore. I suspect part of the reason one of the guys refuses is because he wants to be seen as more senior because he's arrogant.


I had an ex-colleague who was like that. Refused to learn to use Autocad when those around him did as drawing work wasn't part of his job. I wonder if he regretted it later when he got made redundant in the recession as his skills weren't as adaptable as those in the same role.

I'm starting to de-skill on some software now as my role no longer gives me the opportunity to use it regularly enough which frustrates me as there are times where my team are too busy and I could do with just getting stuck in myself.


It's exactly the same thing. He was against it because he "didn't want to learn a whole new mapping system" and his current one did exactly what he needs. What he doesn't realise is that using the new one isn't just about doing pretty maps, you can use it for all sorts of fund analysis tasks which would take you months to do otherwise which are done by people higher up in the organisation. Seeing as I started as his assistant and now I'm doing the fund level stuff I'd say it's paid off for me.


GIS?
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Wheelspinner
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby Wheelspinner » Fri Sep 20, 2019 11:54 am

keef66 wrote:That's one of the reasons I'm so happy to be leaving my present workplace. Historically I was always the quickest to learn how to use new software / systems, and people would always come to me to help them out. They still do TBH.
But at 62 I just don't have the interest, aptitude, or mental resilience to grapple with the 3 or 4 new, badly customised / implemented, counter-intuitive proprietary systems I've been lumbered with. F*ck em, I'm taking the money and I'm off!

This, basically.

I’m a very highly qualified and experienced functional expert in SAP supply chain software, been doing it for 25 years. They’ve fundamentally changed how it works in the last couple years, to the point my technical skillset is almost redundant.

I could go back to school and learn how to make it do what a client needs, but screw that. Degree qualified graduates are everywhere now, charging half what I ask or less.

I was recently hired in to help a client review the solution design they’d been given for integration with a third party warehouse, using the new version. My first thing was to go walk through the new warehouse, with the “Solution Functional Architect” who’d drafted the design. She had terrific technical skill in the new software, but when we arrived on the day and she turned up wearing open-toed high heel sandals, I was more than a little bemused. After borrowing a pair of boots to wear, she quietly admitted this was the *first ever* visit to an actual warehouse she’d done, and hadn’t been aware of the OH&S requirements. :roll: :roll:

The client had hired me for 6 weeks, and after 2 they asked me to stay for a further 8 months to “help”. I politely declined and wished them the best of luck with their chosen implementation partner. :)

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Pross
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby Pross » Fri Sep 20, 2019 12:22 pm

rjsterry wrote:
Pross wrote:I had an ex-colleague who was like that. Refused to learn to use Autocad when those around him did as drawing work wasn't part of his job. I wonder if he regretted it later when he got made redundant in the recession as his skills weren't as adaptable as those in the same role.

I'm starting to de-skill on some software now as my role no longer gives me the opportunity to use it regularly enough which frustrates me as there are times where my team are too busy and I could do with just getting stuck in myself.


Was the 'not part of my job description' attitude part of the reason why he's an ex-colleague? Everyone in our office needs to be able to pitch in if needed.


Pretty much, when it came to making cuts it was a no brainer to keep those at the same grade with a wider skill set even if you ignore the attitude. Where I work now all our grads are keen to soak up any new skills and experience they can get and my own team is small so I do a lot of stuff that even fairly junior people in other companies would turn their noses up at (I prefer to give the more interesting jobs to others in the team to avoid them getting bored).

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Mr Goo
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby Mr Goo » Fri Sep 20, 2019 12:39 pm

Many of the engines under bonnets of those cars from Munich and Stuttgart are made by Renault. So much for German engineering.
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Pross
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby Pross » Fri Sep 20, 2019 12:52 pm

That people are unable to understand the difference between production and engineering.

thistle (MBNW)
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby thistle (MBNW) » Fri Sep 20, 2019 13:05 pm

HaydenM wrote:I suspect part of the reason one of the guys refuses is because he wants to be seen as more senior because he's arrogant.

I refused to learn in my own free time to how to use some new software that was imposed on us and is widely regarded as crap and was seen as arrogant for asking for a training course to be put on or at least be able to do it in work time.

HR agreed with me, and so did the MD when he found out but it was still 18 months before anything came of it. I think one of the problems was the developers "didn't do" training or support :roll:

elbowloh
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby elbowloh » Fri Sep 20, 2019 13:17 pm

thistle (MBNW) wrote:
HaydenM wrote:I suspect part of the reason one of the guys refuses is because he wants to be seen as more senior because he's arrogant.

I refused to learn in my own free time to how to use some new software that was imposed on us and is widely regarded as crap and was seen as arrogant for asking for a training course to be put on or at least be able to do it in work time.

HR agreed with me, and so did the MD when he found out but it was still 18 months before anything came of it. I think one of the problems was the developers "didn't do" training or support :roll:

We recently rolled out some new software. Virtually everyone was assigned to do 3 online training modules for 3 specific parts of the system/process.
a) the training was terrible, it just didn't make sense and loads of people failed because the test did not relate to the training
b) so we learned about the 3 bits of the process, but not the bits that linked the 3 bits together. So you do one bit and don't know how to progress from that to the next part of the process.
c) when the system went live, only an handful of people have the required access to do one of the 3 bits of the process (and that's not changing). So why were we all required to do that training?
d) none of the terminology used in the new system is what we used previously and the training did not address this e.g. that x=y etc so everyone is just generally confused.
e) the system is shite.
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HaydenM
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby HaydenM » Fri Sep 20, 2019 13:44 pm

rjsterry wrote:GIS?


Yeah, we use Arc like everyone else and this guy is using a 2013 version of mapmaker as far as I can tell...

I don't learn this stuff at home which makes my work time a bit less productive for a while until you get it. Now it's essentially vital to what I do

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rjsterry
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby rjsterry » Fri Sep 20, 2019 13:56 pm

HaydenM wrote:
rjsterry wrote:GIS?


Yeah, we use Arc like everyone else and this guy is using a 2013 version of mapmaker as far as I can tell...

I don't learn this stuff at home which makes my work time a bit less productive for a while until you get it. Now it's essentially vital to what I do


Don't know much about it myself, but my brother - an archaeologist - has got pretty heavily involved with it through various projects looking at the Sahara.
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HaydenM
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby HaydenM » Fri Sep 20, 2019 14:02 pm

rjsterry wrote:
HaydenM wrote:
rjsterry wrote:GIS?


Yeah, we use Arc like everyone else and this guy is using a 2013 version of mapmaker as far as I can tell...

I don't learn this stuff at home which makes my work time a bit less productive for a while until you get it. Now it's essentially vital to what I do


Don't know much about it myself, but my brother - an archaeologist - has got pretty heavily involved with it through various projects looking at the Sahara.


For what the other guy is doing it was initially a bit like using full photoshop when he really wants to use some basic photo editor but now we use it for fund management it would really help if he could link into it, I think he realises that now. People who don't use Arcgis often don't realise that any maps you produce are essentially a byproduct of the information database you create, you can use that data to forward project and come up with all sorts of things which make you look very clever at the click of a button :wink:

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rjsterry
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby rjsterry » Fri Sep 20, 2019 14:06 pm

HaydenM wrote:
rjsterry wrote:
HaydenM wrote:
rjsterry wrote:GIS?


Yeah, we use Arc like everyone else and this guy is using a 2013 version of mapmaker as far as I can tell...

I don't learn this stuff at home which makes my work time a bit less productive for a while until you get it. Now it's essentially vital to what I do


Don't know much about it myself, but my brother - an archaeologist - has got pretty heavily involved with it through various projects looking at the Sahara.


For what the other guy is doing it was initially a bit like using full photoshop when he really wants to use some basic photo editor but now we use it for fund management it would really help if he could link into it, I think he realises that now. People who don't use Arcgis often don't realise that any maps you produce are essentially a byproduct of the information database you create, you can use that data to forward project and come up with all sorts of things which make you look very clever at the click of a button :wink:


Certainly I've always understood it as a database where records are attached to a geographical location, rather than a map with extras. My brother was using it to analyse patterns of settlement to take a macro view of all the individual bits and pieces they had surveyed and excavated.
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby PBlakeney » Fri Sep 20, 2019 14:09 pm

keef66 wrote:Spending time with digital photography and learning how to properly use Irfanview are on the list of things to fill my retirement when it finally arrives.

Wow! Irfanview is still around. I just learned that.
I used that for digitally scanning slides 25 years ago. Not one I'd consider today.
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HaydenM
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby HaydenM » Fri Sep 20, 2019 14:12 pm

Sounds interesting, there are people who are absolutely amazing with it but it becomes a full time job. The benefit of it from my point of view is that it uses formats which are the same for lots of open source or paid for data so I can get map layers for all sorts of climate and soil science stuff to do wider portfolio analysis and things. Or use my own data to calibrate models which we think aren't accurate. All very useful stuff

keef66
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby keef66 » Fri Sep 20, 2019 14:38 pm

PBlakeney wrote:
keef66 wrote:Spending time with digital photography and learning how to properly use Irfanview are on the list of things to fill my retirement when it finally arrives.

Wow! Irfanview is still around. I just learned that.
I used that for digitally scanning slides 25 years ago. Not one I'd consider today.


Shows how long ago I started listing the things I planned to do one day when I have time. A quick Google suggests GIMP might be a better bet now.

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darkhairedlord
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby darkhairedlord » Fri Sep 20, 2019 14:45 pm

keef66 wrote:
PBlakeney wrote:
keef66 wrote:Spending time with digital photography and learning how to properly use Irfanview are on the list of things to fill my retirement when it finally arrives.

Wow! Irfanview is still around. I just learned that.
I used that for digitally scanning slides 25 years ago. Not one I'd consider today.


Shows how long ago I started listing the things I planned to do one day when I have time. A quick Google suggests GIMP might be a better bet now.

If you take a decent photo you shouldn't need to edit it.

HaydenM
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby HaydenM » Fri Sep 20, 2019 14:48 pm

darkhairedlord wrote:
keef66 wrote:
PBlakeney wrote:
keef66 wrote:Spending time with digital photography and learning how to properly use Irfanview are on the list of things to fill my retirement when it finally arrives.

Wow! Irfanview is still around. I just learned that.
I used that for digitally scanning slides 25 years ago. Not one I'd consider today.


Shows how long ago I started listing the things I planned to do one day when I have time. A quick Google suggests GIMP might be a better bet now.

If you take a decent photo you shouldn't need to edit it.


Aside from almost all professional photographer's photos you mean...?

keef66
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby keef66 » Fri Sep 20, 2019 14:50 pm

I'd say about 1 in 200 of my photos are perfectly composed, lit, exposed etc. The rest need all the help I can give them :D

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Step83
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby Step83 » Fri Sep 20, 2019 14:56 pm

darkhairedlord wrote:
keef66 wrote:
PBlakeney wrote:
keef66 wrote:Spending time with digital photography and learning how to properly use Irfanview are on the list of things to fill my retirement when it finally arrives.

Wow! Irfanview is still around. I just learned that.
I used that for digitally scanning slides 25 years ago. Not one I'd consider today.


Shows how long ago I started listing the things I planned to do one day when I have time. A quick Google suggests GIMP might be a better bet now.

If you take a decent photo you shouldn't need to edit it.


I had this argument with someone, we both took photos on a day out, often of the same thing mainly to settle an argument, I was ******* between preset modes and usually had a CPL filter on, they were just shooting raw adamant they could fix the issues post pro.
They then spent the next few days whinging how long the post pro took, I had a few duffs that needed work but far less faffing with colours, levels etc.
Both sets looked decent enough when presented, main difference was colours on mine being more muted, as I didn't whack up the saturation to fake levels

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darkhairedlord
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby darkhairedlord » Fri Sep 20, 2019 15:01 pm

Step83 wrote:
darkhairedlord wrote:
keef66 wrote:
PBlakeney wrote:
keef66 wrote:Spending time with digital photography and learning how to properly use Irfanview are on the list of things to fill my retirement when it finally arrives.

Wow! Irfanview is still around. I just learned that.
I used that for digitally scanning slides 25 years ago. Not one I'd consider today.


Shows how long ago I started listing the things I planned to do one day when I have time. A quick Google suggests GIMP might be a better bet now.

If you take a decent photo you shouldn't need to edit it.


I had this argument with someone, we both took photos on a day out, often of the same thing mainly to settle an argument, I was ******* between preset modes and usually had a CPL filter on, they were just shooting raw adamant they could fix the issues post pro.
They then spent the next few days whinging how long the post pro took, I had a few duffs that needed work but far less faffing with colours, levels etc.
Both sets looked decent enough when presented, main difference was colours on mine being more muted, as I didn't whack up the saturation to fake levels

People usually spend more time editing a photo than they ever do looking at the finished image.

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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby briantrumpet » Fri Sep 20, 2019 15:24 pm

darkhairedlord wrote:
Step83 wrote:
darkhairedlord wrote:
keef66 wrote:
PBlakeney wrote:
keef66 wrote:Spending time with digital photography and learning how to properly use Irfanview are on the list of things to fill my retirement when it finally arrives.

Wow! Irfanview is still around. I just learned that.
I used that for digitally scanning slides 25 years ago. Not one I'd consider today.


Shows how long ago I started listing the things I planned to do one day when I have time. A quick Google suggests GIMP might be a better bet now.

If you take a decent photo you shouldn't need to edit it.


I had this argument with someone, we both took photos on a day out, often of the same thing mainly to settle an argument, I was ******* between preset modes and usually had a CPL filter on, they were just shooting raw adamant they could fix the issues post pro.
They then spent the next few days whinging how long the post pro took, I had a few duffs that needed work but far less faffing with colours, levels etc.
Both sets looked decent enough when presented, main difference was colours on mine being more muted, as I didn't whack up the saturation to fake levels

People usually spend more time editing a photo than they ever do looking at the finished image.

Takes me seconds: resample, check gamma and contrast, maybe a touch of sharpen, and colour balance. I only ended up using it as most of the other apps are either execrable (Windows Photos) and/or enormous and slow to load (GIMP). I'm also a lazy photographer, so only ever use auto settings, so sometimes have to adjust stuff to get back to what I think I saw.

But yes, you can soon see the photos/photographers where the saturation has been more than tweaked.


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