Things you have recently learnt

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bompington
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby bompington » Fri Sep 20, 2019 05:52 am

rjsterry wrote:
darkhairedlord wrote:Whenever you go to a parents evening presentation at a school a message appears on the hoooge screen asking to install an update. Every flipping time.


Just been to a school open evening for the local secondary school, which included an impressive performance by the school choir. Slightly spoilt by a three foot high Windows logo hovering above their heads while someone cued up the slideshow to follow.

Few reasons for this:
1. School IT people are a combination of undertrained, underpaid, overworked and useless. Or all of the above.
2. School systems use fascist software like Deep Freeze to ensure that whatever glitches they were set up with keep coming back at you like zombies, every day, for ever.
3. Teachers are a combination of undertrained, underpaid, overworked and useless at IT. Or all of the above.

I am always astonished and dismayed at how many of my colleagues do not have the slightest idea how to design or present even the simplest powerpoint.

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Stevo 666
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby Stevo 666 » Fri Sep 20, 2019 06:47 am

Pinno wrote:
Stevo 666 wrote:
Rolf F wrote:Brexiteers probably think they get to their destination sooner with priority boarding.

Of course, if you are on a flight where there is restricted over-head luggage storage there can be some benefit but I tend to take the reverse approach to priority boarding - ie go through to the gate at the last minute and ideally join the queue to board when the plane is already boarding and the last few people are going through. Might as well spend as much time hanging round the main shopping area as possible than in a dreary departure gate; the second kind of hell is a fair bit worse than the first.

I've recently learnt that whatever the thread topic, if it's in Cake Stop then someone will mention Brexit on the thread.


Brexit will be the neuveau Monty Python: "Whatever you do, don't mention Brexit".

{Now back to page 5...]

They could still have a sketch involving Germans.
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darkhairedlord
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby darkhairedlord » Fri Sep 20, 2019 07:05 am

Stevo 666 wrote:
Pinno wrote:
Stevo 666 wrote:
Rolf F wrote:Brexiteers probably think they get to their destination sooner with priority boarding.

Of course, if you are on a flight where there is restricted over-head luggage storage there can be some benefit but I tend to take the reverse approach to priority boarding - ie go through to the gate at the last minute and ideally join the queue to board when the plane is already boarding and the last few people are going through. Might as well spend as much time hanging round the main shopping area as possible than in a dreary departure gate; the second kind of hell is a fair bit worse than the first.

I've recently learnt that whatever the thread topic, if it's in Cake Stop then someone will mention Brexit on the thread.


Brexit will be the neuveau Monty Python: "Whatever you do, don't mention Brexit".

{Now back to page 5...]

They could still have a sketch involving Germans.

Or the DUP, with their orange hors d'oeuvres.

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rjsterry
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby rjsterry » Fri Sep 20, 2019 08:14 am

bompington wrote:
rjsterry wrote:
darkhairedlord wrote:Whenever you go to a parents evening presentation at a school a message appears on the hoooge screen asking to install an update. Every flipping time.


Just been to a school open evening for the local secondary school, which included an impressive performance by the school choir. Slightly spoilt by a three foot high Windows logo hovering above their heads while someone cued up the slideshow to follow.

Few reasons for this:
1. School IT people are a combination of undertrained, underpaid, overworked and useless. Or all of the above.
2. School systems use fascist software like Deep Freeze to ensure that whatever glitches they were set up with keep coming back at you like zombies, every day, for ever.
3. Teachers are a combination of undertrained, underpaid, overworked and useless at IT. Or all of the above.

I am always astonished and dismayed at how many of my colleagues do not have the slightest idea how to design or present even the simplest powerpoint.


A pet peeve is people who claim to 'not know anything about computers', with something approaching pride, as if it wasn't a requirement of their employment to have at least a basic level of proficiency. Why is that still acceptable when computers been commonplace for the last 30 years or so?
1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
1980s BSA 10sp

Liberal metropolitan, remoaner, traitor, "sympathiser", etc.

HaydenM
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby HaydenM » Fri Sep 20, 2019 08:21 am

rjsterry wrote:
bompington wrote:
rjsterry wrote:
darkhairedlord wrote:Whenever you go to a parents evening presentation at a school a message appears on the hoooge screen asking to install an update. Every flipping time.


Just been to a school open evening for the local secondary school, which included an impressive performance by the school choir. Slightly spoilt by a three foot high Windows logo hovering above their heads while someone cued up the slideshow to follow.

Few reasons for this:
1. School IT people are a combination of undertrained, underpaid, overworked and useless. Or all of the above.
2. School systems use fascist software like Deep Freeze to ensure that whatever glitches they were set up with keep coming back at you like zombies, every day, for ever.
3. Teachers are a combination of undertrained, underpaid, overworked and useless at IT. Or all of the above.

I am always astonished and dismayed at how many of my colleagues do not have the slightest idea how to design or present even the simplest powerpoint.


A pet peeve is people who claim to 'not know anything about computers', with something approaching pride, as if it wasn't a requirement of their employment to have at least a basic level of proficiency. Why is that still acceptable when computers been commonplace for the last 30 years or so?


This. I have a bit of sympathy for the older members of the team but there are younger guys here who use it as an excuse to refuse to learn how to use new and better mapping/database/analysis software. The software we use is fairly complicated but it is absolutely fundamental to the industry these days and you can't get away with using a glorified version of MS paint anymore. I suspect part of the reason one of the guys refuses is because he wants to be seen as more senior because he's arrogant.

Tangled Metal
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby Tangled Metal » Fri Sep 20, 2019 08:29 am

Worse than that is the parents if primary school kids in reception and yr1 proudly stating that they don't read to, read with or encourage their kids to read because they don't read well and most of their family can't read at all! I'm not kidding.

It's kind of the same thing bit worse because they're affecting the future of their kids.

PBlakeney
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby PBlakeney » Fri Sep 20, 2019 08:35 am

HaydenM wrote:
rjsterry wrote:
bompington wrote:
rjsterry wrote:
darkhairedlord wrote:Whenever you go to a parents evening presentation at a school a message appears on the hoooge screen asking to install an update. Every flipping time.


Just been to a school open evening for the local secondary school, which included an impressive performance by the school choir. Slightly spoilt by a three foot high Windows logo hovering above their heads while someone cued up the slideshow to follow.

Few reasons for this:
1. School IT people are a combination of undertrained, underpaid, overworked and useless. Or all of the above.
2. School systems use fascist software like Deep Freeze to ensure that whatever glitches they were set up with keep coming back at you like zombies, every day, for ever.
3. Teachers are a combination of undertrained, underpaid, overworked and useless at IT. Or all of the above.

I am always astonished and dismayed at how many of my colleagues do not have the slightest idea how to design or present even the simplest powerpoint.


A pet peeve is people who claim to 'not know anything about computers', with something approaching pride, as if it wasn't a requirement of their employment to have at least a basic level of proficiency. Why is that still acceptable when computers been commonplace for the last 30 years or so?


This. I have a bit of sympathy for the older members of the team but there are younger guys here who use it as an excuse to refuse to learn how to use new and better mapping/database/analysis software. The software we use is fairly complicated but it is absolutely fundamental to the industry these days and you can't get away with using a glorified version of MS paint anymore. I suspect part of the reason one of the guys refuses is because he wants to be seen as more senior because he's arrogant.

Basically people learn what they have to and become proficient at the expense of all else. Present them with something new and it becomes a challenge.
Nothing new, just different tools.
The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.

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rjsterry
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby rjsterry » Fri Sep 20, 2019 08:41 am

PBlakeney wrote:
HaydenM wrote:
rjsterry wrote:
bompington wrote:
rjsterry wrote:
darkhairedlord wrote:Whenever you go to a parents evening presentation at a school a message appears on the hoooge screen asking to install an update. Every flipping time.


Just been to a school open evening for the local secondary school, which included an impressive performance by the school choir. Slightly spoilt by a three foot high Windows logo hovering above their heads while someone cued up the slideshow to follow.

Few reasons for this:
1. School IT people are a combination of undertrained, underpaid, overworked and useless. Or all of the above.
2. School systems use fascist software like Deep Freeze to ensure that whatever glitches they were set up with keep coming back at you like zombies, every day, for ever.
3. Teachers are a combination of undertrained, underpaid, overworked and useless at IT. Or all of the above.

I am always astonished and dismayed at how many of my colleagues do not have the slightest idea how to design or present even the simplest powerpoint.


A pet peeve is people who claim to 'not know anything about computers', with something approaching pride, as if it wasn't a requirement of their employment to have at least a basic level of proficiency. Why is that still acceptable when computers been commonplace for the last 30 years or so?


This. I have a bit of sympathy for the older members of the team but there are younger guys here who use it as an excuse to refuse to learn how to use new and better mapping/database/analysis software. The software we use is fairly complicated but it is absolutely fundamental to the industry these days and you can't get away with using a glorified version of MS paint anymore. I suspect part of the reason one of the guys refuses is because he wants to be seen as more senior because he's arrogant.

Basically people learn what they have to and become proficient at the expense of all else. Present them with something new and it becomes a challenge.
Nothing new, just different tools.


Except the computer has been a standard tool in my industry for at least the last 20 years. Computers are not new.
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1980s BSA 10sp

Liberal metropolitan, remoaner, traitor, "sympathiser", etc.

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bompington
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby bompington » Fri Sep 20, 2019 08:46 am

PBlakeney wrote: Basically people learn one clumsy and inefficient way to do the bare minimum they have to and stick to it for ever more with something like desperation

FTFY

keef66
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby keef66 » Fri Sep 20, 2019 09:28 am

That's one of the reasons I'm so happy to be leaving my present workplace. Historically I was always the quickest to learn how to use new software / systems, and people would always come to me to help them out. They still do TBH.
But at 62 I just don't have the interest, aptitude, or mental resilience to grapple with the 3 or 4 new, badly customised / implemented, counter-intuitive proprietary systems I've been lumbered with. F*ck em, I'm taking the money and I'm off!

PBlakeney
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby PBlakeney » Fri Sep 20, 2019 09:30 am

rjsterry wrote:
PBlakeney wrote:
HaydenM wrote:
rjsterry wrote:
bompington wrote:
rjsterry wrote:
darkhairedlord wrote:Whenever you go to a parents evening presentation at a school a message appears on the hoooge screen asking to install an update. Every flipping time.


Just been to a school open evening for the local secondary school, which included an impressive performance by the school choir. Slightly spoilt by a three foot high Windows logo hovering above their heads while someone cued up the slideshow to follow.

Few reasons for this:
1. School IT people are a combination of undertrained, underpaid, overworked and useless. Or all of the above.
2. School systems use fascist software like Deep Freeze to ensure that whatever glitches they were set up with keep coming back at you like zombies, every day, for ever.
3. Teachers are a combination of undertrained, underpaid, overworked and useless at IT. Or all of the above.

I am always astonished and dismayed at how many of my colleagues do not have the slightest idea how to design or present even the simplest powerpoint.


A pet peeve is people who claim to 'not know anything about computers', with something approaching pride, as if it wasn't a requirement of their employment to have at least a basic level of proficiency. Why is that still acceptable when computers been commonplace for the last 30 years or so?


This. I have a bit of sympathy for the older members of the team but there are younger guys here who use it as an excuse to refuse to learn how to use new and better mapping/database/analysis software. The software we use is fairly complicated but it is absolutely fundamental to the industry these days and you can't get away with using a glorified version of MS paint anymore. I suspect part of the reason one of the guys refuses is because he wants to be seen as more senior because he's arrogant.

Basically people learn what they have to and become proficient at the expense of all else. Present them with something new and it becomes a challenge.
Nothing new, just different tools.


Except the computer has been a standard tool in my industry for at least the last 20 years. Computers are not new.

Computers are not new but software and versions are.
The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.

Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.

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briantrumpet
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby briantrumpet » Fri Sep 20, 2019 09:52 am

keef66 wrote:That's one of the reasons I'm so happy to be leaving my present workplace. Historically I was always the quickest to learn how to use new software / systems, and people would always come to me to help them out. They still do TBH.
But at 62 I just don't have the interest, aptitude, or mental resilience to grapple with the 3 or 4 new, badly customised / implemented, counter-intuitive proprietary systems I've been lumbered with. F*ck em, I'm taking the money and I'm off!

Indeed - one of my bugbears is software that is anything but intuitive: if it's something you only use infrequently, even when you've managed to use it one time, you end up staring at it the next time, wondering how on earth you did the task the previous time, and feeling stupid. It's like keyboard shortcuts: great, if you use them frequently (for instance, one I've started using a lot is Irfanview, a great little photo editing app, with virtually every operation having a two-stroke shortcut), but easily forgotten if only used once in a blue moon.

HaydenM
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby HaydenM » Fri Sep 20, 2019 10:00 am

I had sort of assumed that more people under a certain age have an inherent propensity to learn new software as they were doing it from a very young age, some people over that age can learn specific tasks but struggle to apply that to new ones. Obviously that's a huge generalisation, but the guy I'm talking about is 35 and thinks he's too important to learn...

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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby NitrousOxide » Fri Sep 20, 2019 10:04 am

Jessica Jaymes has been found dead.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/newsbeat-49757600
================
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keef66
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby keef66 » Fri Sep 20, 2019 10:07 am

briantrumpet wrote:
keef66 wrote:That's one of the reasons I'm so happy to be leaving my present workplace. Historically I was always the quickest to learn how to use new software / systems, and people would always come to me to help them out. They still do TBH.
But at 62 I just don't have the interest, aptitude, or mental resilience to grapple with the 3 or 4 new, badly customised / implemented, counter-intuitive proprietary systems I've been lumbered with. F*ck em, I'm taking the money and I'm off!

Indeed - one of my bugbears is software that is anything but intuitive: if it's something you only use infrequently, even when you've managed to use it one time, you end up staring at it the next time, wondering how on earth you did the task the previous time, and feeling stupid. It's like keyboard shortcuts: great, if you use them frequently (for instance, one I've started using a lot is Irfanview, a great little photo editing app, with virtually every operation having a two-stroke shortcut), but easily forgotten if only used once in a blue moon.


'staring at it the next time, wondering how on earth you did the task the previous time, and feeling stupid' - that's my default setting these days. Not good for the old self esteem

The slight irony of this being that I'm now considering a support role in a local school... :D Fortunately not in I.T.

Spending time with digital photography and learning how to properly use Irfanview are on the list of things to fill my retirement when it finally arrives.

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bompington
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby bompington » Fri Sep 20, 2019 10:19 am

HaydenM wrote:I had sort of assumed that more people under a certain age have an inherent propensity to learn new software as they were doing it from a very young age

Oh, if only....

More suited to the annoyances thread, but if I had a quid for every parent who has told me something like "oh he really enjoys computers, he's on his all the time" which translates as "gamer who has no clue how to make their computer do anything useful, nor any desire to learn"

HaydenM
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby HaydenM » Fri Sep 20, 2019 10:27 am

bompington wrote:
HaydenM wrote:I had sort of assumed that more people under a certain age have an inherent propensity to learn new software as they were doing it from a very young age

Oh, if only....

More suited to the annoyances thread, but if I had a quid for every parent who has told me something like "oh he really enjoys computers, he's on his all the time" which translates as "gamer who has no clue how to make their computer do anything useful, nor any desire to learn"


I understand that but I still think a Grad today could have a head start over a grad of 15 years ago having grown up using computers for everything. I never really spent much time gaming though

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Pross
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby Pross » Fri Sep 20, 2019 10:41 am

HaydenM wrote:
rjsterry wrote:
bompington wrote:
rjsterry wrote:
darkhairedlord wrote:Whenever you go to a parents evening presentation at a school a message appears on the hoooge screen asking to install an update. Every flipping time.


Just been to a school open evening for the local secondary school, which included an impressive performance by the school choir. Slightly spoilt by a three foot high Windows logo hovering above their heads while someone cued up the slideshow to follow.

Few reasons for this:
1. School IT people are a combination of undertrained, underpaid, overworked and useless. Or all of the above.
2. School systems use fascist software like Deep Freeze to ensure that whatever glitches they were set up with keep coming back at you like zombies, every day, for ever.
3. Teachers are a combination of undertrained, underpaid, overworked and useless at IT. Or all of the above.

I am always astonished and dismayed at how many of my colleagues do not have the slightest idea how to design or present even the simplest powerpoint.


A pet peeve is people who claim to 'not know anything about computers', with something approaching pride, as if it wasn't a requirement of their employment to have at least a basic level of proficiency. Why is that still acceptable when computers been commonplace for the last 30 years or so?


This. I have a bit of sympathy for the older members of the team but there are younger guys here who use it as an excuse to refuse to learn how to use new and better mapping/database/analysis software. The software we use is fairly complicated but it is absolutely fundamental to the industry these days and you can't get away with using a glorified version of MS paint anymore. I suspect part of the reason one of the guys refuses is because he wants to be seen as more senior because he's arrogant.


I had an ex-colleague who was like that. Refused to learn to use Autocad when those around him did as drawing work wasn't part of his job. I wonder if he regretted it later when he got made redundant in the recession as his skills weren't as adaptable as those in the same role.

I'm starting to de-skill on some software now as my role no longer gives me the opportunity to use it regularly enough which frustrates me as there are times where my team are too busy and I could do with just getting stuck in myself.

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rjsterry
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby rjsterry » Fri Sep 20, 2019 11:09 am

Pross wrote:I had an ex-colleague who was like that. Refused to learn to use Autocad when those around him did as drawing work wasn't part of his job. I wonder if he regretted it later when he got made redundant in the recession as his skills weren't as adaptable as those in the same role.

I'm starting to de-skill on some software now as my role no longer gives me the opportunity to use it regularly enough which frustrates me as there are times where my team are too busy and I could do with just getting stuck in myself.


Was the 'not part of my job description' attitude part of the reason why he's an ex-colleague? Everyone in our office needs to be able to pitch in if needed.
1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
1980s BSA 10sp

Liberal metropolitan, remoaner, traitor, "sympathiser", etc.

HaydenM
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Re: Things you have recently learnt

Postby HaydenM » Fri Sep 20, 2019 11:15 am

Pross wrote:
HaydenM wrote:
rjsterry wrote:
bompington wrote:
rjsterry wrote:
darkhairedlord wrote:Whenever you go to a parents evening presentation at a school a message appears on the hoooge screen asking to install an update. Every flipping time.


Just been to a school open evening for the local secondary school, which included an impressive performance by the school choir. Slightly spoilt by a three foot high Windows logo hovering above their heads while someone cued up the slideshow to follow.

Few reasons for this:
1. School IT people are a combination of undertrained, underpaid, overworked and useless. Or all of the above.
2. School systems use fascist software like Deep Freeze to ensure that whatever glitches they were set up with keep coming back at you like zombies, every day, for ever.
3. Teachers are a combination of undertrained, underpaid, overworked and useless at IT. Or all of the above.

I am always astonished and dismayed at how many of my colleagues do not have the slightest idea how to design or present even the simplest powerpoint.


A pet peeve is people who claim to 'not know anything about computers', with something approaching pride, as if it wasn't a requirement of their employment to have at least a basic level of proficiency. Why is that still acceptable when computers been commonplace for the last 30 years or so?


This. I have a bit of sympathy for the older members of the team but there are younger guys here who use it as an excuse to refuse to learn how to use new and better mapping/database/analysis software. The software we use is fairly complicated but it is absolutely fundamental to the industry these days and you can't get away with using a glorified version of MS paint anymore. I suspect part of the reason one of the guys refuses is because he wants to be seen as more senior because he's arrogant.


I had an ex-colleague who was like that. Refused to learn to use Autocad when those around him did as drawing work wasn't part of his job. I wonder if he regretted it later when he got made redundant in the recession as his skills weren't as adaptable as those in the same role.

I'm starting to de-skill on some software now as my role no longer gives me the opportunity to use it regularly enough which frustrates me as there are times where my team are too busy and I could do with just getting stuck in myself.


It's exactly the same thing. He was against it because he "didn't want to learn a whole new mapping system" and his current one did exactly what he needs. What he doesn't realise is that using the new one isn't just about doing pretty maps, you can use it for all sorts of fund analysis tasks which would take you months to do otherwise which are done by people higher up in the organisation. Seeing as I started as his assistant and now I'm doing the fund level stuff I'd say it's paid off for me.


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