Max 23mm tires on Giant Propel?

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Markwb79
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Re: Max 23mm tires on Giant Propel?

Postby Markwb79 » Thu Feb 05, 2015 11:12 am

Borgie wrote:
Markwb79 wrote:Well I hope they fit 25mm tyres. I just bought my propel and I only run 25mm tyres.

As said above, the Giant team run 25mm tyres, so dont see it being an issue.


But they use the Fourier brakes, which are different from the SpeedControl SL brakes.



And those brakes are wider?
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stepdavi
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Re: Max 23mm tires on Giant Propel?

Postby stepdavi » Thu Feb 05, 2015 11:39 am

Is it width that's the issue? I have a propel and am going to change wheels, possible mavic, zuus or planet x. The rear brake cable is pretty close to tyre. Has anyone got a propel with non giant wheels/tyres they can advise me on this?
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Borgie
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Re: Max 23mm tires on Giant Propel?

Postby Borgie » Thu Feb 05, 2015 12:28 pm

Markwb79 wrote:
Borgie wrote:
Markwb79 wrote:Well I hope they fit 25mm tyres. I just bought my propel and I only run 25mm tyres.

As said above, the Giant team run 25mm tyres, so dont see it being an issue.


But they use the Fourier brakes, which are different from the SpeedControl SL brakes.



And those brakes are wider?


I'm not sure. But if the Giant Shimano Team uses 25mm tires (Fourier brakes) and Tour International says it's impossible to fit anything wider than 23mm on a Propel Advanced or Propel SL (both SpeedControl brakes as far as I know), then there's gotta be a difference in some way? Maybe the width is no problem, and it's the distance between the brake cable and tire causing the problem.

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Pippi Langsamer
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Re: Max 23mm tires on Giant Propel?

Postby Pippi Langsamer » Thu Feb 05, 2015 13:16 pm

I'd agree it would depend which 25mm tyre you try.

My 25mm Conti tubulars fit fine in both my Foil and Parlee Z5

However...I recently tried to fit 25mm Michelin Pro4 Endurance clinchers into the Z5 and theres not really enough clearance between the stays to run them. They've been demoted to my training wheels for the Foil, and I've reverted back to 23mm for the Z5.

The Conti 25mm tubs incidentally fit fine in the Z5 :D A 25mm tub is generally just that as its a sewn-up, closed structure. The clinchers of course can vary from what they're sold as.

Markwb79
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Re: Max 23mm tires on Giant Propel?

Postby Markwb79 » Thu Feb 05, 2015 15:49 pm

Pippi Langsamer wrote:I'd agree it would depend which 25mm tyre you try.

My 25mm Conti tubulars fit fine in both my Foil and Parlee Z5

However...I recently tried to fit 25mm Michelin Pro4 Endurance clinchers into the Z5 and theres not really enough clearance between the stays to run them. They've been demoted to my training wheels for the Foil, and I've reverted back to 23mm for the Z5.

The Conti 25mm tubs incidentally fit fine in the Z5 :D A 25mm tub is generally just that as its a sewn-up, closed structure. The clinchers of course can vary from what they're sold as.


My friends dugast's compared to my Vittoria Pave (both Tubs) was massive, although they are both 25mm.

I will check what brakes I have and if my 25mm's fit. I would be completely shocked if it didnt fit.
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Markwb79
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Re: Max 23mm tires on Giant Propel?

Postby Markwb79 » Fri Feb 06, 2015 22:00 pm

Markwb79 wrote:
Pippi Langsamer wrote:I'd agree it would depend which 25mm tyre you try.

My 25mm Conti tubulars fit fine in both my Foil and Parlee Z5

However...I recently tried to fit 25mm Michelin Pro4 Endurance clinchers into the Z5 and theres not really enough clearance between the stays to run them. They've been demoted to my training wheels for the Foil, and I've reverted back to 23mm for the Z5.

The Conti 25mm tubs incidentally fit fine in the Z5 :D A 25mm tub is generally just that as its a sewn-up, closed structure. The clinchers of course can vary from what they're sold as.


My friends dugast's compared to my Vittoria Pave (both Tubs) was massive, although they are both 25mm.

I will check what brakes I have and if my 25mm's fit. I would be completely shocked if it didnt fit.



Sorry, I am lucky and have the Fourier brakes. But the way they work I find it hard to imagine that there is a difference in the wheels that fit between the Fourier and Giant Brakes.

Just noticed that it changes the side that the cable goes to the front brakes. Most pictures have it running to the left of the brakes. But there is the odd version (mine included) where it runs to the right hand side.

Any ideas why the change?
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Carbonator

Re: Max 23mm tires on Giant Propel?

Postby Carbonator » Sat Feb 07, 2015 15:15 pm

DKay wrote:
Maglia Rosa wrote:If its for extra comfort then the Propel is not the bike for you.


So are you saying that if your bike rides a bit stiff, then you're not allowed to fit larger tyres for a bit more comfort and have to just put up with it? Sounds a bit daft to me. :?


Thats fine if you already have the bike, but to me, buying a bike that rides a bit stiff with the intension of fitting bigger tyres to make it more comfortable sounds even dafter.
Theres nothing to 'put up with', just don't buy the bike :roll:

I don't buy the 25mm tyre thing though and only 'run' 23mm or less on my road bikes.
Would be surprised if Giant made that many bikes that could not take a 25mm tyre 8)

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Re: Max 23mm tires on Giant Propel?

Postby DKay » Sat Feb 07, 2015 17:42 pm

Carbonator wrote:
DKay wrote:
Maglia Rosa wrote:If its for extra comfort then the Propel is not the bike for you.


So are you saying that if your bike rides a bit stiff, then you're not allowed to fit larger tyres for a bit more comfort and have to just put up with it? Sounds a bit daft to me. :?


Thats fine if you already have the bike, but to me, buying a bike that rides a bit stiff with the intension of fitting bigger tyres to make it more comfortable sounds even dafter.
Theres nothing to 'put up with', just don't buy the bike :roll:


Completely and utterly disagree. Having a bike which is torsionally stiff under power, but has a compliant ride is the most desirable combination of traits for a road bike. Fitting larger tyres doesn't affect how the bike reacts under power, but makes it ride more comfortably. Why is that so hard for some of you to accept that somebody might want a stiff bike, but make it ride a bit more compliantly? I just don't understand the thinking of some of you people, I really don't. Putting up with a stiff, harsh ride when you can just fit larger tyres for more comfort doesn't single you out as being more if a man, or more hardcore than somebody else. It just makes you look illogical.

I do find the increasing backlash against larger tyres pretty funny though.

stepdavi
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Re: Max 23mm tires on Giant Propel?

Postby stepdavi » Sat Feb 07, 2015 18:25 pm

I've got a 2015 propel advanced 1 and all I'm bothered about is when I get some' best'wheels they will fit. I'm not bothered about 23 tyres, I know the propel isn't the softest of bikes and I like that.
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Maglia Rosa

Re: Max 23mm tires on Giant Propel?

Postby Maglia Rosa » Sat Feb 07, 2015 19:18 pm

DKay wrote:
Carbonator wrote:
DKay wrote:
Maglia Rosa wrote:If its for extra comfort then the Propel is not the bike for you.


So are you saying that if your bike rides a bit stiff, then you're not allowed to fit larger tyres for a bit more comfort and have to just put up with it? Sounds a bit daft to me. :?


Thats fine if you already have the bike, but to me, buying a bike that rides a bit stiff with the intension of fitting bigger tyres to make it more comfortable sounds even dafter.
Theres nothing to 'put up with', just don't buy the bike :roll:


Completely and utterly disagree. Having a bike which is torsionally stiff under power, but has a compliant ride is the most desirable combination of traits for a road bike. Fitting larger tyres doesn't affect how the bike reacts under power, but makes it ride more comfortably. Why is that so hard for some of you to accept that somebody might want a stiff bike, but make it ride a bit more compliantly? I just don't understand the thinking of some of you people, I really don't. Putting up with a stiff, harsh ride when you can just fit larger tyres for more comfort doesn't single you out as being more if a man, or more hardcore than somebody else. It just makes you look illogical.


Since when did 23mm tyres become harsh in themselves? Problem is, it has become apparent the Propel may have problems fitting 25mm tyres. So what? Don't buy the bloody thing then. There are plenty of other brands and bikes out there to choose from which are more compliant to 25mm tyres. I use 25mm tyres but even on my bike I have a task getting the rear wheel on and off. Giant built the bike this way, and if it cant take the tyre that the op wants then he has a choice. stick with 23mm or dont buy it. Its as simple as that. No one is saying you cant have a torsionally stiff bike with comfort but it has to be within the spec of the bike in the first place. if its not then tough.

Carbonator

Re: Max 23mm tires on Giant Propel?

Postby Carbonator » Sat Feb 07, 2015 20:32 pm

^ Yeah, yeah. What he said.

Carbonator

Re: Max 23mm tires on Giant Propel?

Postby Carbonator » Sat Feb 07, 2015 20:39 pm

DKay wrote:
I do find the increasing backlash against larger tyres pretty funny though.


I found the near universal acceptance of the faster and comfier 25mm wonder tyres pretty funny in the first place, so will thoroughly enjoy any backlash.

Of course people who so eagerly bought into 25mm tyres are not going to like any dispute of the theory.
Last edited by Carbonator on Sat Feb 07, 2015 20:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Carbonator

Re: Max 23mm tires on Giant Propel?

Postby Carbonator » Sat Feb 07, 2015 20:48 pm

DKay wrote:
Completely and utterly disagree. Having a bike which is torsionally stiff under power, but has a compliant ride is the most desirable combination of traits for a road bike.


Why do Giant not fit 25mm tyres then if thats the Nirvana of road cycling?

Would 28mm tyres affect how a bike reacts under power and in corners etc? 32mm? 35mm?.............
Lowering pressures as the tyres get bigger of course.

neeb
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Re: Max 23mm tires on Giant Propel?

Postby neeb » Sun Feb 08, 2015 00:38 am

I've come to the ironic conclusion recently that the best use for 25mm tyres is on narrow rims on bad British roads, as a poor substitute for wider rims and 23mm tyres...

I moved from abroad recently and there's no doubt that a British roads are crap, you do need to run tyres at slightly lower pressures than you would on smoother European roads. Problem is that you risk pinch flats below 100 PSI with traditional narrow rims and 23mm tyres (especially on potholed roads..). With slightly wider rims you can run those same 23mm tyres at 90 PSI with no problems and they roll much better. No need for 25mm. But with narrow rims the only way to be able to lower the pressure without risking pinch flats is slight wider tyres. In both cases you are increasing the volume of air in the tyre, but wider tyres on narrow rims is a kludge.

DKay
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Re: Max 23mm tires on Giant Propel?

Postby DKay » Sun Feb 08, 2015 07:52 am

Maglia Rosa wrote:Since when did 23mm tyres become harsh in themselves? Problem is, it has become apparent the Propel may have problems fitting 25mm tyres. So what? Don't buy the bloody thing then. There are plenty of other brands and bikes out there to choose from which are more compliant to 25mm tyres. I use 25mm tyres but even on my bike I have a task getting the rear wheel on and off. Giant built the bike this way, and if it cant take the tyre that the op wants then he has a choice. stick with 23mm or dont buy it. Its as simple as that. No one is saying you cant have a torsionally stiff bike with comfort but it has to be within the spec of the bike in the first place. if its not then tough.


Where have I said that 23mm tyres 'become harsh in themselves'? As far as I can tell, I haven't. But fitting 25mm tyres and lowering pressures does ride better in my experience and also in the mojority of others. As for you saying that 'No one is saying you cant have a torsionally stiff bike with comfort', this is exactly what you and Carbonator have said with such gems as;

Maglia Rosa wrote:What do you want to fit 25mm tyres for anyway? If its for extra comfort then the Propel is not the bike for you.


Carbonator wrote: buying a bike that rides a bit stiff with the intension of fitting bigger tyres to make it more comfortable sounds even dafter.
Theres nothing to 'put up with', just don't buy the bike

DKay
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Re: Max 23mm tires on Giant Propel?

Postby DKay » Sun Feb 08, 2015 07:58 am

Carbonator wrote:
DKay wrote:
Completely and utterly disagree. Having a bike which is torsionally stiff under power, but has a compliant ride is the most desirable combination of traits for a road bike.


Why do Giant not fit 25mm tyres then if thats the Nirvana of road cycling?

Would 28mm tyres affect how a bike reacts under power and in corners etc? 32mm? 35mm?.............
Lowering pressures as the tyres get bigger of course.


Why do some bike manufacturers fit a smaller or larger cassette compared to others? Why do they fit a certain make of finishing components? A large part of it depends on what they can buy at the best price and has the best availability.

I find your question about larger and larger tyres pretty obvious and I think you know it is too. Of course, if you fit huge tyres, then you're going to run into deminishing returns. But 25mm is a great compromise between extra comfort without reducing your speed.

Carbonator

Re: Max 23mm tires on Giant Propel?

Postby Carbonator » Sun Feb 08, 2015 09:39 am

DKay wrote:
Why do some bike manufacturers fit a smaller or larger cassette compared to others? Why do they fit a certain make of finishing components? A large part of it depends on what they can buy at the best price and has the best availability.


I am not sure that would apply to tyre size. Brand/quality perhaps, but on a (I'm guessing) racy bike I feel the manufacturer would put the tyre size on they feel goes best with the bike.


DKay wrote:I find your question about larger and larger tyres pretty obvious and I think you know it is too. Of course, if you fit huge tyres, then you're going to run into deminishing returns. But 25mm is a great compromise between extra comfort without reducing your speed.


'Compromise' is the key word there. The Propel sounds like a bit of a no compromise frame/bike for which 25mm tyres will be a bit of a compromise.

To me 25mm are not a magic wonder size. They may well offer a great mix of speed and comfort for a lot of people on a lot of bikes, but there comes a point where its just a bit silly IMO.

I will never believe that the same tyre in 25mm at say 90psi is as fast as a 23mm/100psi one.
Nothing wrong with wanting it for comfort but don't pretend that there is no performance difference between 23-25 with different pressures, but weirdly is between 25-28.

I do not care how minimal the difference is either.

If you wanted to run 23mm most of the time but wanted the option of 25mm for certain rides then fair enough, but if its to have full time 25mm then just get a different bike if its not designed for the bigger tyre.

DKay
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Re: Max 23mm tires on Giant Propel?

Postby DKay » Sun Feb 08, 2015 13:21 pm

Hey, agree to disagree. I feel we'll just go around in circles otherwise (25mm ones in my case). :wink:

*edit* This just in:

http://youtu.be/EAq979WV1c4?list=PLUdAM ... T7vS0Fu9ux

The secret rider
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Re: Max 23mm tires on Giant Propel?

Postby The secret rider » Tue Jun 28, 2016 20:12 pm

Dragging this thread back up.

My 2016 advance pro 0 needs new tyres thanks to british 'chipping' road resurfacing.

Hoping i can upgrade from the standard GP1 giant tyres although they do get good reviews.

Currently looking at the Vittoria Corsa G+ Road Tyre

http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/vitt ... graphene16

Seems like the best package / all rounder out there just now with some mighty impressive claims ! claims . . .

having a read of this thread and others seems the verdict is still out on 23 or 25 but does 25 fit the new propel ? I know it comes with 23 and the rim width of the SLR1 carbon rims fitted is 23mm according to the giant website

i'm unsure what to go for, i dont find the propel uncomfy sometimes its harsh but i kinda like it :)

Did anyone ever prove that 25mm was faster anyway ? will post a seperate thread on feedback on the corsa + soon

parulverman
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Re: Max 23mm tires on Giant Propel?

Postby parulverman » Wed Jun 29, 2016 09:16 am

it will get you better speed and less comfort


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