Was this cyclist in the right or wrong

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pkripper
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Re: Was this cyclist in the right or wrong

Postby pkripper » Mon Jul 15, 2013 13:55 pm

ChrisAOnABike wrote:You don't have to accelerate like a pro to not hold up drivers when the lights change, providing you're alert and move immediately. If he dawdled then yes, inconsiderate, but if he had got on with it as the lights changed, and pulled over to the left immediately once he was moving, I don't see the problem in principle.

Even the existence of a bike box at a traffic lights doesn't mean it's perfectly Ok to hang about and hold everyone up behind. And you still have to get through to the bike box somehow. If there really isn't space to get through without risking scraping the bars then yes, wait in line, but if there's room, what are you going to do, wait in a traffic jam from twenty cars back through several cycles of red-green-red-green?


This.

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savethemamil
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Re: Was this cyclist in the right or wrong

Postby savethemamil » Mon Jul 15, 2013 14:00 pm

Cleat Eastwood wrote:I vote no - he sounds a bellend.


+1

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Rigged
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Re: Was this cyclist in the right or wrong

Postby Rigged » Mon Jul 15, 2013 14:18 pm

ChrisAOnABike wrote:You don't have to accelerate like a pro to not hold up drivers when the lights change, providing you're alert and move immediately. If he dawdled then yes, inconsiderate, but if he had got on with it as the lights changed, and pulled over to the left immediately once he was moving, I don't see the problem in principle.

Even the existence of a bike box at a traffic lights doesn't mean it's perfectly Ok to hang about and hold everyone up behind. And you still have to get through to the bike box somehow. If there really isn't space to get through without risking scraping the bars then yes, wait in line, but if there's room, what are you going to do, wait in a traffic jam from twenty cars back through several cycles of red-green-red-green?



This.

If he returned to the left immediately then fine, he's probably caused no delay. He still probably didn't endear himself to the driver by coming up the inside and cutting back in right in front of him though, and understandably so.

Me? I only move down the left side if there's no cars indicating to turn that way. If there are cars looking to turn left and potentially cut up a cyclist looking to skip down the left then I occupy the lane I need as if I were a car and move to the left edge of the lane once appropriate to let faster flowing traffic by.

It's basically balancing keeping yourself safe on the road and not inconveniencing other road users. If my intention was to wait in the middle of the lane I wouldn't filter down either side before cutting in because I understand how frustrating that becomes for other people watching and I'd just wait my turn like any other car.

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Re: Was this cyclist in the right or wrong

Postby AchillesLeftKnee » Mon Jul 15, 2013 18:42 pm

It's the motorcyclist in me I guess, but as far as I'm concerned, if by filtering you're going to put yourself in a position where
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Cleat Eastwood
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Re: Was this cyclist in the right or wrong

Postby Cleat Eastwood » Mon Jul 15, 2013 19:19 pm

^^^

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Pross
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Re: Was this cyclist in the right or wrong

Postby Pross » Mon Jul 15, 2013 21:20 pm

If he crossed the stop line while the lights were red then he broke the law, simple really. I only get in front of the front vehicle if there's heavy traffic and they are going nowhere once the lights change. Even as a cyclist I find it annoying when driving and I eventually pass a slow moving bike when it's safe only for them to force their way through at a light, sometimes mounting the footway to pass. You then get stuck behind them, unable to pass safely for another long distance. However, if the driver could easily pass once the lights change it isn't an issue.

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Druidor
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Re: Was this cyclist in the right or wrong

Postby Druidor » Mon Jul 15, 2013 22:15 pm

Personally think he was being a tit.

I will always be to the side of the traffic if I have filtered up the line allowing the cars to go if I am not quick enough off the mark.

If I am not filtering I will be part of the queue.
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PhilClubman
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Re: Was this cyclist in the right or wrong

Postby PhilClubman » Tue Jul 16, 2013 06:00 am

ChrisAOnABike wrote:You don't have to accelerate like a pro to not hold up drivers when the lights change, providing you're alert and move immediately. If he dawdled then yes, inconsiderate, but if he had got on with it as the lights changed, and pulled over to the left immediately once he was moving, I don't see the problem in principle.


+1

No considerate driver should have a problem with this (I'm surprised so many cyclists seem to).

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goonz
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Re: Was this cyclist in the right or wrong

Postby goonz » Tue Jul 16, 2013 08:32 am

SloppySchleckonds wrote:
fatsmoker wrote:bit of a dick then.


Need to know what bike he was riding first


Was he kitted out fully in lycra?
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Tom Dean
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Re: Was this cyclist in the right or wrong

Postby Tom Dean » Tue Jul 16, 2013 09:33 am

The rider's positioning in the lane after the lights went green is the only issue here.

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diy
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Re: Was this cyclist in the right or wrong

Postby diy » Tue Jul 16, 2013 09:50 am

Generally you are substantially safer going one back from the leader. You never quite know when the lights will change and you don't want to be moving in front of a car as the lights change. Interestingly I will do this on the motorbike too unless I am pretty sure the lights wont suddenly change. The other consideration is zig zag lines (which while they don't apply to cycles) make it an offence to overtake the lead vehicle which has stopped or is stopping due to someone crossing at the lights/zebra.

Being one back makes absolutely no difference to your progress when the lights change, but gives you a better chance of being seen and lowers the chance of you stopping just as they move off.

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the playing mantis
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Re: Was this cyclist in the right or wrong

Postby the playing mantis » Tue Jul 16, 2013 12:25 pm

goonz wrote:
SloppySchleckonds wrote:
fatsmoker wrote:bit of a dick then.


Need to know what bike he was riding first


Was he kitted out fully in lycra?


no as mentioned above had shorts on over his bibshorts or lycra shorts or whatever they were, think he had lycra top on. it wasnt u was it?!

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the playing mantis
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Re: Was this cyclist in the right or wrong

Postby the playing mantis » Tue Jul 16, 2013 12:30 pm

PhilClubman wrote:
ChrisAOnABike wrote:You don't have to accelerate like a pro to not hold up drivers when the lights change, providing you're alert and move immediately. If he dawdled then yes, inconsiderate, but if he had got on with it as the lights changed, and pulled over to the left immediately once he was moving, I don't see the problem in principle.


+1

No considerate driver should have a problem with this (I'm surprised so many cyclists seem to).


in light traffic, with 3-4 cars in the queue, what need was there for the cyclist to filter up the left then weeble in front of the lead car right in the middle of the road, for the apparent benefit of simply not having to unclip, then holding the 3 cars up as the lights changed as he continued to weeble off from the lights.

whats the point? he got no benefit from it. and knowing how a lot of drivers see cyclists why do things that can potentially antagonise them for no personal gain, bar not having to unclip, and give non ccycling drivers further ammunition against cyclists?

imo people who do such thngs, whether being technically right int he eyes of the law or what others would do, give cyclist in general a bad name and just make life worse for the rest of us by being completely inconsiderate for no reason.

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Re: Was this cyclist in the right or wrong

Postby GiantMike » Tue Jul 16, 2013 12:38 pm

He should have casually ridden up and stopped, putting his right hand on the bonnet or roof of the leading car, completely ignoring the driver. He wouldn't have needed to unclip and all the drivers in the queue would have thought he was 'well cool' and felt priveleged to be near such greatness.
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Tom Dean
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Re: Was this cyclist in the right or wrong

Postby Tom Dean » Tue Jul 16, 2013 14:48 pm

the playing mantis wrote:
PhilClubman wrote:
ChrisAOnABike wrote:You don't have to accelerate like a pro to not hold up drivers when the lights change, providing you're alert and move immediately. If he dawdled then yes, inconsiderate, but if he had got on with it as the lights changed, and pulled over to the left immediately once he was moving, I don't see the problem in principle.


+1

No considerate driver should have a problem with this (I'm surprised so many cyclists seem to).


in light traffic, with 3-4 cars in the queue, what need was there for the cyclist to filter up the left then weeble in front of the lead car right in the middle of the road, for the apparent benefit of simply not having to unclip, then holding the 3 cars up as the lights changed as he continued to weeble off from the lights.

whats the point? he got no benefit from it. and knowing how a lot of drivers see cyclists why do things that can potentially antagonise them for no personal gain, bar not having to unclip, and give non ccycling drivers further ammunition against cyclists?

imo people who do such thngs, whether being technically right int he eyes of the law or what others would do, give cyclist in general a bad name and just make life worse for the rest of us by being completely inconsiderate for no reason.
I repeat: the rider's positioning in the lane is the only issue.

He is entitled to filter through stationary traffic. The benefit of doing so is that you get further forward on the road. That is obvious, but irrelevant. I'm not sure why you keep mentioning it, the fact that he was wobbling, or that he didn't unclip.

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Re: Was this cyclist in the right or wrong

Postby djm501 » Tue Jul 16, 2013 16:22 pm

PhilClubman wrote:
ChrisAOnABike wrote:You don't have to accelerate like a pro to not hold up drivers when the lights change, providing you're alert and move immediately. If he dawdled then yes, inconsiderate, but if he had got on with it as the lights changed, and pulled over to the left immediately once he was moving, I don't see the problem in principle.


+1

No considerate driver should have a problem with this (I'm surprised so many cyclists seem to).


+2 What if the car had been turning left and was an inconsiderate dick and wasn't signaling? Good way of avoiding the classic left hook. The car will be held up for how long?

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the playing mantis
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Re: Was this cyclist in the right or wrong

Postby the playing mantis » Tue Jul 16, 2013 21:31 pm

and with 3-4 cars on an empty road the cyclist would be held up for how long, by just waiitng in turn in the middle of the road in order? and wouldnt mke drivers think what w*nker.

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the playing mantis
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Re: Was this cyclist in the right or wrong

Postby the playing mantis » Tue Jul 16, 2013 21:34 pm

@ tom dean. i mention it cos that was the only reason he did it. it gained him no advantge filtering and pulling into the middle of the road, bar not having to unclip.

the attitude of some cyclist is just bollox, technically they are entitled, but its just inconsiderate a holes that help foster crap relationships with car drivers and make considerate cyclists labelled with the same brush.

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Re: Was this cyclist in the right or wrong

Postby ChrisAOnABike » Tue Jul 16, 2013 22:00 pm

the playing mantis wrote:The attitude of some cyclist is just bollox, technically they are entitled, but its just inconsiderate a holes that help foster crap relationships with car drivers and make considerate cyclists labelled with the same brush.

So all bike boxes at traffic lights should be removed then?

If cyclists shouldn't filter their way to the front through the stationary traffic, bike boxes have no purpose. If you wait in line, whether at the kerb or behind the car in front, there's no need for them, since you'll either reach the front in a moving queue, or you'll be at the front anyway waiting for the lights to change.

Clearly this is a nonsense. Whether waiting at the kerb or waiting in line, there is the risk of holding someone up behind. If at the kerb, there's the risk of being too close to the car next to you to accelerate away under perfect control; if in line, then you're holding up the cars behind in the same way as if you're at the front of the queue.

Either way, you shouldn't hold cars up, you should move off promptly and pull over to the left. Bike boxes facilitate this, so using them is good. They should be present at more junctions.

Wobbling as you filter through to the front, consequently looking like a plank, and making the drivers worry that you're going to scrape them, is obviously a Bad Thing.

However, I still think that if there's space, moving confidently and accurately through to the front without fuss, pulling away promptly the instant the lights change, and then moving over, is the least hassle to anyone.

Oh, and as a driver, I don't want a bike at the kerb side next to me. I don't want to have to worry about hitting them, or them me. If there's a bike box, I want them in it, and for them to get cracking outa my way when the lights change.
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awavey
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Re: Was this cyclist in the right or wrong

Postby awavey » Tue Jul 16, 2013 22:37 pm

but wasnt he just taking up primary position though :? a 'b' road doesnt sound all that wide and I can kinda understand around a traffic light junction not wanting to concede space that allows people to think theres enough room to squeeze past you when there actually isnt, or could suddenly not be (everyone always forgets traffic coming towards you turning right goes and sits and takes about a bikes width out of your lane), it is better if your visible and upfront to people as then everyone knows your there, and hopefully wont try any crazy nonsense trying to pass you or pretend they didnt really see you, A-pillars are great at hiding cyclists stuck on the inside on busy junctions.

fair enough you dont stay there for too long and deliberately hold traffic up more than necessary, which in most cases Ive ever encountered is the length of the junction itself, its not like pretending to be tractor on a country road for mile after mile, but it depends on the road layout space available, so I dont think setting off in the middle from the front is bad behaviour necessarily.


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