2024 UK politics - now with Labour in charge
Comments
-
Yep, because it is well documented that there are likely to be a lot of unexpected impacts from trying to get a lot of tax from the lesser revenue raisers. including not getting nearly as much as they expected.
"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Re "Send me £10k if you don't think it's a significant amount" hopefully it was clear that this was a tongue-in-cheek suggestion, even in the £33 per month for 25 years format, to demonstrate that the standard human reaction to being asked to hand over more money is to say "No". So a case will always have to be made by those wanting the money for that money to be handed over willingly. Obviously, if the government says "give me the money", one has no choice but to hand it over, but one can have revenge at the next General Election.
And this argument applies regardless as to whether the potential giver (taxpayer) could work round having less cash or even if they wouldn't really notice the impact.
I'm not averse to paying more tax to raise more tax revenue, but would prefer it to be via income tax, as it ticks most of the boxes re the definition of a good tax. (Simple, fair, not actively promoting adverse behaviour etc.)
Changing pensions legislation to promote the optimum retirement planning behaviour at a population level is a separate exercise, and shouldn't be confused by the desire / need to undertake a short term "cash grab".
0 -
Technology Secretary Peter Kyle on Monday waxed lyrical about Musk's SpaceX — and stressed that the U.K. remains open to his investment cash even after a row over the government's response to far-right riots that erupted over the summer.
"Let me just send my very best to him on the safe landing of the [Space X] booster rocket yesterday," Kyle told Times Radio. "It was a stunning achievement. And I did watch, slack-jawed, the staggering achievement that represented."
"He doesn't tend to do these sorts of events," Kyle said. "But I stand absolutely ready to engage with him to talk about any potential global investments he's making."
Not all of Labour have lost the plot.
0 -
Why would it be worse to lose an amount of money per month from earnings rather than savings (especially if you saved the income tax on those savings when you paid in)?
0 -
How about a policy to hobble the NHS so that you are forced to take out private health insurance? It would save you in tax, but you would be much worse off. How do you feel about that?
0 -
You say that changing pensions legislation to promote the optimum retirement planning is a separate exercise, yet you have said the tax free allowance should now have no set upper limit.
Using the same logic, that is the equivalent of having a whip round among other tax payers to give those with the largest pension funds a £100k retirement gift.
0 -
That's a 'rather' simplistic question which I don't think warrants an answer.
Anyway I've already got private health cover, which has the added benefit of taking a bit of pressure off the NHS. How about you?
"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Given private healthcare is largely just the same medics with a different email address, how is it taking pressure off the NHS? And presumably the private cover is only for non-urgent care.
Not having a go at private healthcare at all, but I've never been convinced by the idea that it is helping the NHS. Might be helping the salary and pensions of consultants who work in both, of course.
1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
Largely? Not sure but there are plenty of doctors and other medical staff who don't operate in the NHS. And it is also helping quite a few of the lesser paid staff such as nurses, physios etc.
For info, a lot of the stuff I have used private for is indeed non-urgent but not trivial (e.g. repair bust shoulder tendons, physio for a leg injury, blood tests and MRIs to check for cancer) plus an annual health check up. Some of that could be done by the NHS but I choose not to.
"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
My thoughts re the max size of the TFLS may be wrong. 25% of the pot built up via contributions that complied with applicable contribution limits feels the right approach to me, as that's what it was for decades prior to relatively recent tinkering, but I'd be open to a coherently argued strategy that a different regime is more appropriate. ("We need more tax" and/or "Those affected won't notice" don't cut much ice with me, but they may actually be valid reasons, taking everything else into consideration.) The gov's current approach of leaking ideas to the media to judge public (sector) opinion does not suggest there is any long term coherence involved.
0 -
Some medics work for the NHS at certain times and then use the same facilities to provide services privately at the times when the NHS isn't using them. If the facilities weren't used at such times, they'd just stand idle, with no more NHS work being done.
The NHS was set up to primarily satisfy the requirements of the doctors at the time, who wanted to maintain their private sector revenues. Patient requirements were a close second, but they were definitely second. Hence Bevan's comment about stuffing the mouths of doctors with gold.
0 -
Going off at a tangent, private hospitals are all fine and dandy when things go well, but whose A&E is used when operations in such facilities go wrong, as they sometimes do?
0 -
Was wondering as most of the consultants I've come across seem have private practice alongside NHS work. And clearly they can't be in two places at once.
1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
I don't have private health cover, I rely upon the NHS like the vast majority of the country. It's OK as long as you're alright though.
0 -
That doesn't take a holistic view as it ignores the substantial changes to contribution limits.
0 -
What an original response, never heard that before from a leftie 😀
"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
-
As the LTA was only abolished this year, there won't be much by way of pension funds in excess of this that have built up yet out of high annual contribution limits, so the obvious solution would seem to be to return to the tighter annual contribution limits that used to apply when the TFLS limit was simply 25% of the fund value. 15% of gross earnings p.a. rings a bell, though with greater life expectancy and lower interest rate expectations these days, 20% feels more like the right figure.
Reducing the TFLS regime would need a stronger argument to convince me than it's a ready source of cash and those most likely to be affected will be able to survive. (e.g. what would reducing the TFLS achieve re fairness etc. that increasing income tax rates wouldn't achieve, given that the income tax system is broadly progressive?) And we'll gloss over the fact that Starmer has some special arrangements whereby his pension from his days as DPP will be tax free, so stinging the "rich" for more tax via pensions is just a little bit hypocritical.
1 -
Seems pretty definite Employer NIC is going up. The attempts to claim this doesn't count as a tax on 'working people' are pretty embarrassing. Hope everyone enjoyed their 6 month election bribe.
1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition1 -
Taxes are going up. This is inevitable regardless of who was in power. The only question is which ones and how that will affect each person differently.
The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.0 -
Sure. Just that the claim that Employer NIC isn't a tax on working people is clearly bollox.
1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition1 -
Quite so. It annoys me that the electorate won't reward any party being honest about tax.
0 -
-
As someone who runs a business and employs a fair few people, I accept that under a Labour govt that I voted for, taxes will rise. What I take issue with is the ongoing ability of larger businesses to undertake all kinds of (admittedly legal) tactics to avoid paying their fair share of tax.
Such rises are also implemented by people who simply don't understand the economics of running a business. Even a small percentage increase in contributions or salary across all staff can add up to thousands of pounds a year on to your overheads. How do they think businesses pay for this? You can't just magic up an increase in sales or whack more on to your prices.
0 -
It is a tax on working people but it will not be paid by working people. Sure, it will impact on SME's and recruitment in large companies so ultimately have an impact but all tax rises will have an impact.
The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.0 -
As I have said many times, the way multi-nationals are taxed needs to change from profit declared in a country to a tax based on their turnover in the country. Currently they can grant loans from subsidiary in country A to subsidiary in country B that wipe out the profits in country B, and then pay tax in country A at a very low rate.
Governments need to wake up to this urgently and act on it. They are losing billions in tax revenue by taxing multinationals on the same basis as domestic companies.
0 -
Am I reading this right that you would propose reducing the upper limit on the amount that lower earners can get tax relief on, and increase the amount that higher earners can get tax relief on (with no upper limit), and also allow an a 25% tax free lump sum with no upper limit?
0 -
I assume that needs to be done at an international level though... not something countries will have any success with on their own.
0 -
Paging @Stevo_666 to the thread.
As another SME owner, I'd comment that 'fair' has nothing to do with it. The rules are what they are and where tax breaks exist they are usually there for a reason. Stevo can comment on the veracity of any significant reduction in effective tax rate for larger businesses.
1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
Yes, it would be nice to see this. I am hoping that this govt will have the courage to actually implement it.
0