Dispiriting.

airwise · August 2022

Speaking personally I find the overall attitude to those ride electrically assisted road bikes here is the UK to be somewhat reflective of how our "society" has corroded over the past 4 decades or so. We have seen some true advances which have allowed more people to enjoy their sport - maybe as once they did or to socialise with fellow riders on a Sunday morning and have a bit of a laugh. What is it that makes the subject so passe? Why do so many not ask how, say, the Canyon corners with its centre of gravity. It is as if there is some desire to shame these individuals as opposed to encouraging them.

daniel_b · August 2022

We have a couple of people in our club who use them - I would suggest they are used in those instances, to allow them to ride faster up hills, and maybe to ride longer than they otherwise could do, and I know one of them uses it for their commute too.

I haven't come across any negative attitudes towards them personally, and despite having pre-conceived ideas about them, although still never having ridden one, I can see their place in the world.

I do firmly believe if they are to become a mode of transport to be taken seriously by the masses, then the 15mph limit either needs to be upped, or using the power of gps, adjusted automatically based on what the speed limit is on the road you are riding.

Three instances currently I personally would consider an e-bike in our household:
My partner has to cart a load of kit about for her job, sometimes she can take it in panniers, but sometimes she has to take the van - I can see a proper cargo bike with a motor in this instance would do the job nicely, and double up as a shopping vehicle as well.

My commute (With panniers) is a fairly hilly 19 miles each way, if an ebike could save me 15 minutes each way, and an hour over two commutes, I'd likely take that as an extra ~50 hours a year.

*Having said that, I literally collected my new commuter less than 12 hours ago, so not likely to happen soon

My partner does not cycle as much as she once did, so I could also see a shout there for her to have one, meaning we could ride together more effectively/cover greater distances etc.

I do wonder if with the rise of electric cars, and potentially kids being given e-bikes to be able to ride with their parents, whether in years to come, it will just be the norm to have an e-bike, and a purely pedal powered bike will be a rarity.
I sincerely hope that does not happen.

super_davo · August 2022

I'd say it depends entirely on which circles you mix in and the context.

Large swathes of people are dismissive of cyclists full stop, assisted or not.

If you're going on a "social" ride with people that are pushing close to their limits of pace or distance there will be a level of dismissiveness because you're getting help and they aren't.

If you're going on a pure cafe ride or anything that truly is social (rather than a loosely applied badge) then people are welcoming.

If using an ebike means you can do something on a bike that you couldn't do otherwise like go up bigger hills, ride for significantly longer or cart huge amounts of shopping then you'll get nothing but support.

seanoconn · August 2022

daniel_b said:
We have a couple of people in our club who use them - I would suggest they are used in those instances, to allow them to ride faster up hills, and maybe to ride longer than they otherwise could do, and I know one of them uses it for their commute too.

I haven't come across any negative attitudes towards them personally, and despite having pre-conceived ideas about them, although still never having ridden one, I can see their place in the world.

I do firmly believe if they are to become a mode of transport to be taken seriously by the masses, then the 15mph limit either needs to be upped, or using the power of gps, adjusted automatically based on what the speed limit is on the road you are riding.

Three instances currently I personally would consider an e-bike in our household:
My partner has to cart a load of kit about for her job, sometimes she can take it in panniers, but sometimes she has to take the van - I can see a proper cargo bike with a motor in this instance would do the job nicely, and double up as a shopping vehicle as well.

My commute (With panniers) is a fairly hilly 19 miles each way, if an ebike could save me 15 minutes each way, and an hour over two commutes, I'd likely take that as an extra ~50 hours a year.

*Having said that, I literally collected my new commuter less than 12 hours ago, so not likely to happen soon

My partner does not cycle as much as she once did, so I could also see a shout there for her to have one, meaning we could ride together more effectively/cover greater distances etc.

I do wonder if with the rise of electric cars, and potentially kids being given e-bikes to be able to ride with their parents, whether in years to come, it will just be the norm to have an e-bike, and a purely pedal powered bike will be a rarity.
I sincerely hope that does not happen.

What did you get daniel?

DeVlaeminck · August 2022

I haven't seen any real negativity towards e-bikes. That said similar to David's point I'd have reservations about them coming out on fast training rides - though that's not something I've seen yet and with a 15mph limit any assistance would only help on hills so possibly it'd not disrupt the group dynamic too much.

Dorset_Boy · August 2022

The only negativity I've seen is post ride when e-bike rides have been posted to Strava as a normal ride and cleaned up a load of KoMs.
Two aquaintances of mine who are early 50s and overweight have both bought ebikes so they can get back riding again, and hopefully avoid an early grave.
Another club member bought one for his 20 mile commute to save money over the cost of driving his van early last year.
Another member has an emountain bike (which I think may be derestricted) which he loves but he mixes it up with road and normal MTB. his wife has an ebike as she has a dodgy knee, so they can ride together sometimes.

There are tales of them ruining MTB group rides though if some are on normal bikes and others on ebikes.

MidlandsGrimpeur2 · August 2022

OP I am assuming this is coming from personal experience?

Like others, I have only really seen e bikes used to assist those who are older and need the extra power to enable them to ride longer and hillier terrain and/or people with mobility/physical issues which would prevent them from riding a regular pedal bike. In these instances, I think any type of assistance is a great thing if it keeps people cycling and enjoying their activities.

I get the impression the original post is more about turning up for group/club rides and it causing a few negative comments from other riders? I guess if it was a fast group ride and it slowed the group it would be an issue. For a more casual/social ride I can't really see why anyone would have a problem with it.

daniel_b · August 2022

@seanoconn - this one here: https://scott-sports.com/gb/en/product/scott-addict-gravel-30-bike

Deposit paid 11 months ago

I've had it fitted with the factory guards which are quite neat, and swapped the 45mm stock tyres for 40mm Marathon Supreme tyres, as wanted the speed on the road.
Also need to order an aluminium tailfin so I can use panniers.

Can't ride it yet, as have booked it in for a full clear wrap, as it's going to have a fairly hard life, and they can't fit me in until early September.

Back onto the ebike topic, I have ridden all the different speed rides our club offers, 5 in total ranging from 12-13mph, up to 20mph+, and I've only seen people with ebikes on the two slowest rides.
I suspect if anyone who didn't have some kind of health condition rocked up onto one of the two fastest rides with one, that may well cause some discord in the group.
Personally I see it as a bit of a entertaining challenge, as in can I keep up with the assisted bike, or even make it up the hill faster.

I can see how the strava side could cause issues, though I thought that honest people could now choose an e-bike category which has a separate leaderboard - is that correct?

seanoconn · August 2022

daniel_b said:
@seanoconn - this one here: https://scott-sports.com/gb/en/product/scott-addict-gravel-30-bike

Deposit paid 11 months ago

Ooh lovely. Heard good things about those. Love the colour. Enjoy 👍

gethinceri · August 2022

I've never heard any negativity about e-bikes.
Strava is what Strava is, if you care then it might be a big deal; I don't, so it's not.

webboo · August 2022

I posted something on another thread about something that one of my older cycling had said. On a group ride when it’s a blustery head cross wind on flat section, the guys on the e bikes engage the motor and don’t realise they are causing the weaker guys on normal bikes to go out the back.
Given this is a group where the youngest is about 70 and half of them are usually recovering from some sort of corrective surgery. It leads to some snipping at the cafe stop.

Dorset_Boy · August 2022

@daniel_b Yes there is a separate ebike activity category on Strava, but some ebikes pretend to be on a normal bike to get up the leaderboards. Others are just oblivious of the setting.

sw19carpenters · August 2022

It's all a bit hit and miss on strava as I've seen some silly speeds on some segments where they must of been on a motorbike or a car.
I did it once by accident when I cycled to my car then put bike in boot and drove home I didn't actually complete any segments and didn't drive fast as was only a few miles from home but it still registered the trip as being still on my bike.
How many people have done what I've done and broken records 🤔.
In regards to e bikes there's so many categories and people using them for different things you can't really judge.
I live in London and see fat bikes with huge tyres and even bigger batteries in there frames and I'm like it's still so unaerodynamic and must sap the battery.
There's deliveroo riders on bikes that are going around 25/30 mph and are not even pedalling flying through traffic and lights without batting an eyelid,most no helmets either.
Then obviously have the people using it as a genuine assist to there daily commute etc
It is a great form of transport but where it will go from here completely unregulated I don't know.
E scooters are banned on public roads and it seems recently that I haven't seen as many as I think the police have finally cracked down on them around here anyway.
I've always thought to myself that it's going to take a few deaths for people and the government to take action in terms of regulation and safety of these battery operated flying machines.

Dorset_Boy · August 2022

@sw19carpenters - people must realise they have forgotten to stop their GPS when they do eventually stop it. It is a 2 minutes task to crop your ride, but so many don't bother. Usually it is lardy downhill MTBers on their way home in their car.

sw19carpenters · August 2022

Can you crop your ride if you're non subscription on strava.

ugo.santalucia · August 2022

Yesterday I came across someone on Strava who posted a very hilly ride at 40km/h average... climbs were half the time of the previous KOM... obviously too fast even for the fastest Ebike out there... I flagged it... so I have to assume it was a motorbike or a car... but who does a 50 miles loop along lanes with a motor with a GPS recording device on?

davebradswmb · August 2022

Dorset_Boy said:
@sw19carpenters - people must realise they have forgotten to stop their GPS when they do eventually stop it. It is a 2 minutes task to crop your ride, but so many don't bother. Usually it is lardy downhill MTBers on their way home in their car.

I did a vicious climb out of Llangollen last year and on the way up was passed by 3 vehicles taking MTBs back up to the top of a downhill route. Sure enough when I loaded the ride into Strava there were about 10 riders who were ridiculously quick up the hill recently who had ridden down the MTB trail. I flagged them all and they were removed, and I guess this had been done before by someone because there were no suspect times from further back, how often that must happen on that one hill?

DeVlaeminck · August 2022

"sw19carpenters">Can you crop your ride if you're non subscription on strava.

Yes you can.

wobblebob · August 2022

ugo.santalucia said:
Yesterday I came across someone on Strava who posted a very hilly ride at 40km/h average... climbs were half the time of the previous KOM... obviously too fast even for the fastest Ebike out there... I flagged it... so I have to assume it was a motorbike or a car... but who does a 50 miles loop along lanes with a motor with a GPS recording device on?

A cycling buddy of mine often records his 100+ mile motorbike rides on Strava "so he can remember the route" I've tried to tell him that it's an exercise tracking app and not intended to be used for that, or that he should make his rides private but he won't listen. He does mark them as e-bike rides but still take loads of KOMs, never takes long for his rides to get flagged but must be frustrating for the legitimate holders

rick_chasey · August 2022

Obviously and rationally ebikes are a good thing and I suspect the future of modern short-travel.

It is naive however not to see how a sport where success hinges pretty much exclusively on how fit you are (as, compared to pretty much any other sport, there is remarkably little technique) would be a bit snooty about assistance.

I mean, come on. e bikes in bike races are literally cheating, right?

So come on. Understand the context of the sport.

No one is saying it’s a bad development. Pretty much everyone can see the uses for it and it’s super practical.

Dorset_Boy · August 2022

Here's the sort of segment that is ruined by fat MTBers:
https://www.strava.com/segments/5175274?filter=overall

All the top times are from lardy's getting a lift back up the mountain.
Regular 800+ watts for 20 minutes at about 80 bpms!

airwise · August 2022

But for my illness, I would be way faster on my normal bike than on any ebike. Indeed the speed limits make them something of a liability on a road.

E Bikes on downhills are often too heavy to have confidence in cornering. I cant get near my earlier downhill times.

Uphill it's simple power to weight obviously but I'd be surprised if it made a mockery of metrics held on Strava and the like.I bought an E Bike to see if I could get out again. I would never think of Strava - people doing that much live sad lives.

Dispiriting.

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