Upgrading Hubs Help/Advice

donslow
donslow Posts: 69
in MTB workshop & tech
Hey all,

Looking for some advice on upgrading my hubs, Please excuse my ignorance as I’m fairly new to the ins and outs of parts

I currently have a set of spank oozy hubs and have a loud clunking noise whenever I pedal, from what I’ve read I should be getting some hubs with a high engagement number

I started looking at supadrives but it left me wondering if they are really what I need (would they be too much etc)

Can anyone recommend me a good set of hubs that will have a high engagement number and still roll quite quickly so as to stop the irritating clunk I am get currently

If it’s worth anything, I have an XD driver on my current set

Comments

  • reaperactual
    reaperactual Posts: 1,185
    edited December 2020
    Spank 345 Trail hubs have a 3 three pawl, 30t radial drive system giving 18° of engagement which is pretty poor.

    Quicker engagement is not the be all and end all of what makes a good hub. High engagement is good for general fast drive pick up and great in certain circumstances like half pedals to climb a rock garden for example.

    Usually with higher engagement there is a trade off between durability as in more teeth but smaller and finer contact points with Pawls and drive ring teeth.

    Hope Pro 4 hubs have a 4 Pawl, 44t drive ring giving 8.2° of engagement which will be noticable, not outstanding but still quite robust.

    You could look at DT Swiss 370 hubs with the Star Ratchets of which the 54t version will give you 6° of engagement using a different axial drive system.

    The DT Swiss are more expensive but have amongst the best engagement figures before the likes of Hydra i9's at 1° which get very expensive.

    Could the clunking when pedalling possibly be an issue rather than just poor engagement of your Spank hub?




  • donslow
    donslow Posts: 69
    Thankyou for your reply @reaperactual

    Some interesting points you’ve made so something for me to chew on certainly

    In regards to the clunking, I did ask about and the general feeling is that it is in fact just where the hub is slow to engage, I enquired about upgrading the free hub body with something with more points of engagement but was told for my hub, there were no options so new hubs it is.

    As I say, I’m not the most tech savvy when it comes to things like this so am relying on advice pretty much exclusively

    In terms of what I’m after, would the hope hubs or the dt Swiss be a better option? As far as I can tell, all I’m after really is more engagement points yet something that won’t slow me down because of it as my reading would suggest that this can be the case, unless I have missed something vital?!
  • reaperactual
    reaperactual Posts: 1,185
    edited December 2020
    😎👍 I upgraded my cheap standard wheels for a Hope Fortus Wheelset after a lot of research into various hubs. DT Swiss were second on my list of options.

    I chose Hope's for good engagement and their reputation for bulletproof durability, reasonable price (£340 for a full wheelset) and very happy with them and their improved engagement.

    DT's came a close second but suppose the extra cost for only a little better engagement figure made me decide against those in the end.

    I'd happily recommend either hub and personally consider these the best compared to the others that I read about.

    Now and again I get that clunk in certain situations but with a little smoother application of power I overcome it happening easily.

    Not quite sure what is meant about hubs slowing you down? Perhaps the fact some hubs aren't high end, almost instant engagement that won't instantly apply power on an accute amount of pedal stroke is what you read?🤔
  • JBA
    JBA Posts: 2,852
    It really depends one your budget.

    I have Hope Pro4 hubs on one of my bikes and DT Swiss 350 hubs on another. Both are very good.
    I like the Hope because of the noise and the DT Swiss because of the lack of noise!

    Both hubs are easy to maintain and I wouldn't hesitate to get another set of either. In fact a pair of Pro4 hubs in blue will be ordered in the next couple of weeks.

    Rather than just swap your hubs and then have to get the wheels rebuilt yo may be better off buying a new set of wheels and selling your current ones.
    I bought my DT Swiss wheels from fit wheels_eu on eBay. They were made to order and delivered in about a week.
    I'll probably order the new Hope wheels from bikewheelsdirect as they seem to be the cheapest outlet at the moment.
    “Life has been unfaithful
    And it all promised so so much”

    Giant Trance 2 27.5 2016 ¦ Sonder Broken Road 2021¦ Giant Revolt Advanced 2 2019 ¦ Giant Toughtroad SLR 1 2019 ¦ Giant Anthem 3 2015 ¦ Specialized Myka Comp FSR 2009
  • donslow
    donslow Posts: 69
    edited December 2020
    Cheers guys @JBA & @reaperactual , really appreciate the input, I have been doing a lot of reading today and was swaying towards the hope pro 4’s so what you have said has made me a bit more confident in my decision so thankyou again

    I had started looking at complete wheel sets as I figured that to be the easiest option, albeit expensive too, a bit more digging and I think I’ve formulated a plan ha ha

    I say hubs (plural) but just a back one would’ve done, with a bit of savvy shopping and discounts that I can get through my work, I can pick up a pair of new hope pro 4 hubs for about £160, plus £60 for putting them on my existing rims, and agreed (loosely) a sale of my spank hubs for £80 the pair

    I’m no mathematician but seems like a reasonable deal, enough of an upgrade to keep me (relatively) quiet and cheaper than a whole new wheel set
  • donslow
    donslow Posts: 69
    reaperactual said:


    Not quite sure what is meant about hubs slowing you down? Perhaps the fact some hubs aren't high end, almost instant engagement that won't instantly apply power on an accute amount of pedal stroke is what you read?🤔

    @reaperactual i kept seeing people mention “drag” a lot when talking about higher engagement hubs with others mentioning that it’s this “drag” that “slows the spinning of the wheel” or something along those lines anyway,

    probably me Mis-reading / Mis-understanding somewhere along the line but as someone who knows very little about this stuff I started (probably unnecessarily) concerning myself with “what if higher engagement makes me slower” seems stupid when I write it down and read it over ha ha
  • reaperactual
    reaperactual Posts: 1,185
    donslow said:

    Cheers guys @JBA & @reaperactual , really appreciate the input, I have been doing a lot of reading today and was swaying towards the hope pro 4’s so what you have said has made me a bit more confident in my decision so thankyou again

    I had started looking at complete wheel sets as I figured that to be the easiest option, albeit expensive too, a bit more digging and I think I’ve formulated a plan ha ha

    I say hubs (plural) but just a back one would’ve done, with a bit of savvy shopping and discounts that I can get through my work, I can pick up a pair of new hope pro 4 hubs for about £160, plus £60 for putting them on my existing rims, and agreed (loosely) a sale of my spank hubs for £80 the pair

    I’m no mathematician but seems like a reasonable deal, enough of an upgrade to keep me (relatively) quiet and cheaper than a whole new wheel set

    Sounds like a good plan and get you what you need at the best price.👍

    I almost used the word 'drag' too so must have read it somewhere the same as you.

    Reckon this was a factor I disregarded pretty quick as would have thought any kind of increased drag would be minuscule and not worth worrying about in real riding conditions.

    It shows you're doing thorough research to make the right, informed choice. 👏👏👍
  • donslow
    donslow Posts: 69
    edited December 2020
    reaperactual said:


    Reckon this was a factor I disregarded pretty quick as would have thought any kind of increased drag would be minuscule and not worth worrying about in real riding conditions.

    Was my kind of thinking too...

    reaperactual said:


    It shows you're doing thorough research to make the right, informed choice. 👏👏👍

    Thankyou, for too long now I have been a “buy it and ride it” kind of cyclist but the last couple of years I’m starting to learn more about what works, what doesn’t work, even to the point of carrying out repairs and maintenance myself so I figure if I want to KNOW rather than just know gotta do the learning first if that makes any sense?! Ha ha
  • donslow
    donslow Posts: 69
    reaperactual said:


    I almost used the word 'drag' too so must have read it somewhere the same as you.

    Reckon this was a factor I disregarded pretty quick as would have thought any kind of increased drag would be minuscule and not worth worrying about in real riding conditions.

    Was my kind of thinking too....

  • thecycleclinic
    thecycleclinic Posts: 395
    3 pawl freehub with 30t rathet ring is fine.

    While faster engaging hubs obviously exist they don't make you faster.

    More ratchet teeth mean smaller ratchet teeth and that means they are weaker ( a problem for e bikes mostly and a few exceptional humans) but wear will make itself felt on higher engagement hubs sooner too they way around that is a larger ratchet ring which mean increasing hub mass or more pawls which increases noise which some don't like. There's no free lunch.

    I know the market wants higher engagement hubs but from a wheel designers perspective its compromise i would not make.

    More ratchet teeth is of benefit only if you pedalling style is very on off. If you maintain a more consistent pedalling rate then faster engagement is not required. Stunt riding obviously does benefit from fast engagement as your sometime not moving then engaehub and jump. Thats not what most people are doing though when they want faster engaging hubs.

    Clunks can be caused by sudden freehub engagement as much as anything thats a fault.

    I use a 3 pawl/30t ratchet hub on one of my mtbs and i do notice any lag or clunks but then again i feed the power in avoiding the clunk and tend to keep pedalling when manoeuvring so there is little or no engagement lag.

    Another mtb with the 18t star dt swiss ratchets again does not have this problem. My daughter firat ride on her new new mtb with dt swiss 350 hub modified to be QR 141mm boost compatible had no clunking. Shes a natural.

    Drag is not worth considering whether its from the freehub or bearings seals. So long as the bearing are smooth and quiet what ever drag seen when the wheels are spinning down is dwarfed by tyre drag and air resistance. Even power loss in the chain is greater
    www.thecycleclinic.co.uk
  • mully79
    mully79 Posts: 904
    Some excellent posts. I would just add that quick engagement hubs can degrade rear suspension performance. The quicker the hub engages the quicker pedal kickback reaches your feet under suspension compression reducing effectiveness. Of course frame design is a big factor in this situation.
  • donslow
    donslow Posts: 69
    edited December 2020
    Some points definitely worth chewing over @thecycleclinic and definitely another viewpoint to consider, thankyou
    mully79 said:

    Some excellent posts. I would just add that quick engagement hubs can degrade rear suspension performance. The quicker the hub engages the quicker pedal kickback reaches your feet under suspension compression reducing effectiveness. Of course frame design is a big factor in this situation.

    Happy to be corrected but surely this would minimal (if at all really noticeable) wouldn’t it? Wouldn’t the setup of your bike take this into account?
  • mully79
    mully79 Posts: 904
    Minimal, maybe.
    I would choose quicker engagement if i did a lot of technical climbing.
  • donslow
    donslow Posts: 69
    mully79 said:

    I would choose quicker engagement if i did a lot of technical climbing.

    Partially why I’ve decided to upgrade a little

Categories