BREXIT - Is This Really Still Rumbling On? 😴
Comments
-
That would explain the zigzagging on the IMB. Now they are saying they will use the dispute resolution process in the WA and save the provisions in the IMB for emergencies.surrey_commuter said:
an alternative answer is that Brexit united a broad church of people behind what they did not want but have no unity in where they are going.rick_chasey said:
Some fairly influential people in government (Gove) refer to the GFA as a national humiliation for the UK, so go figure.briantrumpet said:rick_chasey said:
Trusting the UK that it would abide by agreements it's signed 9 months prior?TheBigBean said:
Good to see you can't resist the thread though. Any thoughts yet on the mistakes made by Ireland and the EU?
I think generally everyone sensible has underestimated the power and the revolutionary vigour of the eurosceptics in UK politics.
It does seem that there's a close link between Brexit and wanting to go back to the pre-GFA state of affairs in NI: is it just because of some fixation on borders and tribalism?
Some want to preserve the Union at all costs whereas others want a pure Brexit
Boris may well have figured out that like May he has no majority for either course of action.1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
I'm sure the MPs can trust him not to go back on his word, so they can safely pass the IMB now as it is, and he won't use it or threaten to use it unless it's a last resort.rjsterry said:
That would explain the zigzagging on the IMB. Now they are saying they will use the dispute resolution process in the WA and save the provisions in the IMB for emergencies.surrey_commuter said:
an alternative answer is that Brexit united a broad church of people behind what they did not want but have no unity in where they are going.rick_chasey said:
Some fairly influential people in government (Gove) refer to the GFA as a national humiliation for the UK, so go figure.briantrumpet said:rick_chasey said:
Trusting the UK that it would abide by agreements it's signed 9 months prior?TheBigBean said:
Good to see you can't resist the thread though. Any thoughts yet on the mistakes made by Ireland and the EU?
I think generally everyone sensible has underestimated the power and the revolutionary vigour of the eurosceptics in UK politics.
It does seem that there's a close link between Brexit and wanting to go back to the pre-GFA state of affairs in NI: is it just because of some fixation on borders and tribalism?
Some want to preserve the Union at all costs whereas others want a pure Brexit
Boris may well have figured out that like May he has no majority for either course of action.0 -
That's just consistent with the idea that it was purely to make a lot of noise. Much like proroguing parliament.rjsterry said:
That would explain the zigzagging on the IMB. Now they are saying they will use the dispute resolution process in the WA and save the provisions in the IMB for emergencies.surrey_commuter said:
an alternative answer is that Brexit united a broad church of people behind what they did not want but have no unity in where they are going.rick_chasey said:
Some fairly influential people in government (Gove) refer to the GFA as a national humiliation for the UK, so go figure.briantrumpet said:rick_chasey said:
Trusting the UK that it would abide by agreements it's signed 9 months prior?TheBigBean said:
Good to see you can't resist the thread though. Any thoughts yet on the mistakes made by Ireland and the EU?
I think generally everyone sensible has underestimated the power and the revolutionary vigour of the eurosceptics in UK politics.
It does seem that there's a close link between Brexit and wanting to go back to the pre-GFA state of affairs in NI: is it just because of some fixation on borders and tribalism?
Some want to preserve the Union at all costs whereas others want a pure Brexit
Boris may well have figured out that like May he has no majority for either course of action.
0 -
making a lot of noise to cover a massive u-turn or to blame the EU for no-dealTheBigBean said:
That's just consistent with the idea that it was purely to make a lot of noise. Much like proroguing parliament.rjsterry said:
That would explain the zigzagging on the IMB. Now they are saying they will use the dispute resolution process in the WA and save the provisions in the IMB for emergencies.surrey_commuter said:
an alternative answer is that Brexit united a broad church of people behind what they did not want but have no unity in where they are going.rick_chasey said:
Some fairly influential people in government (Gove) refer to the GFA as a national humiliation for the UK, so go figure.briantrumpet said:rick_chasey said:
Trusting the UK that it would abide by agreements it's signed 9 months prior?TheBigBean said:
Good to see you can't resist the thread though. Any thoughts yet on the mistakes made by Ireland and the EU?
I think generally everyone sensible has underestimated the power and the revolutionary vigour of the eurosceptics in UK politics.
It does seem that there's a close link between Brexit and wanting to go back to the pre-GFA state of affairs in NI: is it just because of some fixation on borders and tribalism?
Some want to preserve the Union at all costs whereas others want a pure Brexit
Boris may well have figured out that like May he has no majority for either course of action.0 -
To annoy the EU.surrey_commuter said:
making a lot of noise to cover a massive u-turn or to blame the EU for no-dealTheBigBean said:
That's just consistent with the idea that it was purely to make a lot of noise. Much like proroguing parliament.rjsterry said:
That would explain the zigzagging on the IMB. Now they are saying they will use the dispute resolution process in the WA and save the provisions in the IMB for emergencies.surrey_commuter said:
an alternative answer is that Brexit united a broad church of people behind what they did not want but have no unity in where they are going.rick_chasey said:
Some fairly influential people in government (Gove) refer to the GFA as a national humiliation for the UK, so go figure.briantrumpet said:rick_chasey said:
Trusting the UK that it would abide by agreements it's signed 9 months prior?TheBigBean said:
Good to see you can't resist the thread though. Any thoughts yet on the mistakes made by Ireland and the EU?
I think generally everyone sensible has underestimated the power and the revolutionary vigour of the eurosceptics in UK politics.
It does seem that there's a close link between Brexit and wanting to go back to the pre-GFA state of affairs in NI: is it just because of some fixation on borders and tribalism?
Some want to preserve the Union at all costs whereas others want a pure Brexit
Boris may well have figured out that like May he has no majority for either course of action.0 -
for what purpose?TheBigBean said:
To annoy the EU.surrey_commuter said:
making a lot of noise to cover a massive u-turn or to blame the EU for no-dealTheBigBean said:
That's just consistent with the idea that it was purely to make a lot of noise. Much like proroguing parliament.rjsterry said:
That would explain the zigzagging on the IMB. Now they are saying they will use the dispute resolution process in the WA and save the provisions in the IMB for emergencies.surrey_commuter said:
an alternative answer is that Brexit united a broad church of people behind what they did not want but have no unity in where they are going.rick_chasey said:
Some fairly influential people in government (Gove) refer to the GFA as a national humiliation for the UK, so go figure.briantrumpet said:rick_chasey said:
Trusting the UK that it would abide by agreements it's signed 9 months prior?TheBigBean said:
Good to see you can't resist the thread though. Any thoughts yet on the mistakes made by Ireland and the EU?
I think generally everyone sensible has underestimated the power and the revolutionary vigour of the eurosceptics in UK politics.
It does seem that there's a close link between Brexit and wanting to go back to the pre-GFA state of affairs in NI: is it just because of some fixation on borders and tribalism?
Some want to preserve the Union at all costs whereas others want a pure Brexit
Boris may well have figured out that like May he has no majority for either course of action.0 -
Reignite the talks, get the Joint Committee working etc. This is all guesswork, and many will say it has backfired, but if you look back at the proroguing of parliament it didn't really achieve anything other than annoying people.surrey_commuter said:
for what purpose?TheBigBean said:
To annoy the EU.surrey_commuter said:
making a lot of noise to cover a massive u-turn or to blame the EU for no-dealTheBigBean said:
That's just consistent with the idea that it was purely to make a lot of noise. Much like proroguing parliament.rjsterry said:
That would explain the zigzagging on the IMB. Now they are saying they will use the dispute resolution process in the WA and save the provisions in the IMB for emergencies.surrey_commuter said:
an alternative answer is that Brexit united a broad church of people behind what they did not want but have no unity in where they are going.rick_chasey said:
Some fairly influential people in government (Gove) refer to the GFA as a national humiliation for the UK, so go figure.briantrumpet said:rick_chasey said:
Trusting the UK that it would abide by agreements it's signed 9 months prior?TheBigBean said:
Good to see you can't resist the thread though. Any thoughts yet on the mistakes made by Ireland and the EU?
I think generally everyone sensible has underestimated the power and the revolutionary vigour of the eurosceptics in UK politics.
It does seem that there's a close link between Brexit and wanting to go back to the pre-GFA state of affairs in NI: is it just because of some fixation on borders and tribalism?
Some want to preserve the Union at all costs whereas others want a pure Brexit
Boris may well have figured out that like May he has no majority for either course of action.0 -
That's because it was found to be against the law.TheBigBean said:
Reignite the talks, get the Joint Committee working etc. This is all guesswork, and many will say it has backfired, but if you look back at the proroguing of parliament it didn't really achieve anything other than annoying people.0 -
I'd be interested to hear those as well.TheBigBean said:
Ireland definitely has the better PR team. I read an article on the extent they had gone to promote their point of view. Taking journalists on guided tours of the border etc.tailwindhome said:TheBigBean said:So should Biden if he wants to make an international point about it
It's a long term failure of British and NI Unionist politicians that they are unable to have their position (whether you agree with or not) heard in other countries.
Suggesting they haven't read it, or in the case of Pelosi mocking their misnaming of it, when they've already taken a position on it reminds me of the joke about Trump's latest incendiary tweet generating 100,000 grammatical corrections from Democrats
Good to see you can't resist the thread though. Any thoughts yet on the mistakes made by Ireland and the EU?"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Stevo_666 said:
I'd be interested to hear those as well.TheBigBean said:
Ireland definitely has the better PR team. I read an article on the extent they had gone to promote their point of view. Taking journalists on guided tours of the border etc.tailwindhome said:TheBigBean said:So should Biden if he wants to make an international point about it
It's a long term failure of British and NI Unionist politicians that they are unable to have their position (whether you agree with or not) heard in other countries.
Suggesting they haven't read it, or in the case of Pelosi mocking their misnaming of it, when they've already taken a position on it reminds me of the joke about Trump's latest incendiary tweet generating 100,000 grammatical corrections from Democrats
Good to see you can't resist the thread though. Any thoughts yet on the mistakes made by Ireland and the EU?tailwindhome said:
At this stage, nothing more than not giving May the same exit clause as Boris to get the original backstop through.TheBigBean said:
Ireland definitely has the better PR team. I read an article on the extent they had gone to promote their point of view. Taking journalists on guided tours of the border etc.tailwindhome said:TheBigBean said:So should Biden if he wants to make an international point about it
It's a long term failure of British and NI Unionist politicians that they are unable to have their position (whether you agree with or not) heard in other countries.
Suggesting they haven't read it, or in the case of Pelosi mocking their misnaming of it, when they've already taken a position on it reminds me of the joke about Trump's latest incendiary tweet generating 100,000 grammatical corrections from Democrats
Good to see you can't resist the thread though. Any thoughts yet on the mistakes made by Ireland and the EU?
I may change my mind at later stage when we learn more about what's happening with the Joint Committee. There seems to be fundamental things that could have been done earlier to minimise the impact of the NIP. For example some sort of exemption for major retailers such as ASDA and Tesco that their deliveries would be assumed to be not at risk of moving into the single market.“New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!0 -
And nothing happened.rick_chasey said:
That's because it was found to be against the law.TheBigBean said:
Reignite the talks, get the Joint Committee working etc. This is all guesswork, and many will say it has backfired, but if you look back at the proroguing of parliament it didn't really achieve anything other than annoying people.0 -
Pretty mild then; not unexpected though.tailwindhome said:Stevo_666 said:
I'd be interested to hear those as well.TheBigBean said:
Ireland definitely has the better PR team. I read an article on the extent they had gone to promote their point of view. Taking journalists on guided tours of the border etc.tailwindhome said:TheBigBean said:So should Biden if he wants to make an international point about it
It's a long term failure of British and NI Unionist politicians that they are unable to have their position (whether you agree with or not) heard in other countries.
Suggesting they haven't read it, or in the case of Pelosi mocking their misnaming of it, when they've already taken a position on it reminds me of the joke about Trump's latest incendiary tweet generating 100,000 grammatical corrections from Democrats
Good to see you can't resist the thread though. Any thoughts yet on the mistakes made by Ireland and the EU?tailwindhome said:
At this stage, nothing more than not giving May the same exit clause as Boris to get the original backstop through.TheBigBean said:
Ireland definitely has the better PR team. I read an article on the extent they had gone to promote their point of view. Taking journalists on guided tours of the border etc.tailwindhome said:TheBigBean said:So should Biden if he wants to make an international point about it
It's a long term failure of British and NI Unionist politicians that they are unable to have their position (whether you agree with or not) heard in other countries.
Suggesting they haven't read it, or in the case of Pelosi mocking their misnaming of it, when they've already taken a position on it reminds me of the joke about Trump's latest incendiary tweet generating 100,000 grammatical corrections from Democrats
Good to see you can't resist the thread though. Any thoughts yet on the mistakes made by Ireland and the EU?
I may change my mind at later stage when we learn more about what's happening with the Joint Committee. There seems to be fundamental things that could have been done earlier to minimise the impact of the NIP. For example some sort of exemption for major retailers such as ASDA and Tesco that their deliveries would be assumed to be not at risk of moving into the single market."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
I suspect it's more to keep the head bangers on side by appearing to annoy the EU. Don't forget Cummings thinks they're all idiots. Someone described it as the Conservative party negotiating with itself, which seems to be not far off.TheBigBean said:
To annoy the EU.surrey_commuter said:
making a lot of noise to cover a massive u-turn or to blame the EU for no-dealTheBigBean said:
That's just consistent with the idea that it was purely to make a lot of noise. Much like proroguing parliament.rjsterry said:
That would explain the zigzagging on the IMB. Now they are saying they will use the dispute resolution process in the WA and save the provisions in the IMB for emergencies.surrey_commuter said:
an alternative answer is that Brexit united a broad church of people behind what they did not want but have no unity in where they are going.rick_chasey said:
Some fairly influential people in government (Gove) refer to the GFA as a national humiliation for the UK, so go figure.briantrumpet said:rick_chasey said:
Trusting the UK that it would abide by agreements it's signed 9 months prior?TheBigBean said:
Good to see you can't resist the thread though. Any thoughts yet on the mistakes made by Ireland and the EU?
I think generally everyone sensible has underestimated the power and the revolutionary vigour of the eurosceptics in UK politics.
It does seem that there's a close link between Brexit and wanting to go back to the pre-GFA state of affairs in NI: is it just because of some fixation on borders and tribalism?
Some want to preserve the Union at all costs whereas others want a pure Brexit
Boris may well have figured out that like May he has no majority for either course of action.1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
What do you think they got wrong?Stevo_666 said:
Pretty mild then; not unexpected though.tailwindhome said:Stevo_666 said:
I'd be interested to hear those as well.TheBigBean said:
Ireland definitely has the better PR team. I read an article on the extent they had gone to promote their point of view. Taking journalists on guided tours of the border etc.tailwindhome said:TheBigBean said:So should Biden if he wants to make an international point about it
It's a long term failure of British and NI Unionist politicians that they are unable to have their position (whether you agree with or not) heard in other countries.
Suggesting they haven't read it, or in the case of Pelosi mocking their misnaming of it, when they've already taken a position on it reminds me of the joke about Trump's latest incendiary tweet generating 100,000 grammatical corrections from Democrats
Good to see you can't resist the thread though. Any thoughts yet on the mistakes made by Ireland and the EU?tailwindhome said:
At this stage, nothing more than not giving May the same exit clause as Boris to get the original backstop through.TheBigBean said:
Ireland definitely has the better PR team. I read an article on the extent they had gone to promote their point of view. Taking journalists on guided tours of the border etc.tailwindhome said:TheBigBean said:So should Biden if he wants to make an international point about it
It's a long term failure of British and NI Unionist politicians that they are unable to have their position (whether you agree with or not) heard in other countries.
Suggesting they haven't read it, or in the case of Pelosi mocking their misnaming of it, when they've already taken a position on it reminds me of the joke about Trump's latest incendiary tweet generating 100,000 grammatical corrections from Democrats
Good to see you can't resist the thread though. Any thoughts yet on the mistakes made by Ireland and the EU?
I may change my mind at later stage when we learn more about what's happening with the Joint Committee. There seems to be fundamental things that could have been done earlier to minimise the impact of the NIP. For example some sort of exemption for major retailers such as ASDA and Tesco that their deliveries would be assumed to be not at risk of moving into the single market.
Obviously I'm disregarding their insistence on there being no change at the Irish border. Its true to say
that that shaped the whole process, and a deal would have been much easier without it, but I don't know that their red line can be defined as a 'mistake'
“New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!0 -
-
if both sides cared about the issue then negotiating the WA in conjunction with the future relationship would have made far more sense.tailwindhome said:
What do you think they got wrong?Stevo_666 said:
Pretty mild then; not unexpected though.tailwindhome said:Stevo_666 said:
I'd be interested to hear those as well.TheBigBean said:
Ireland definitely has the better PR team. I read an article on the extent they had gone to promote their point of view. Taking journalists on guided tours of the border etc.tailwindhome said:TheBigBean said:So should Biden if he wants to make an international point about it
It's a long term failure of British and NI Unionist politicians that they are unable to have their position (whether you agree with or not) heard in other countries.
Suggesting they haven't read it, or in the case of Pelosi mocking their misnaming of it, when they've already taken a position on it reminds me of the joke about Trump's latest incendiary tweet generating 100,000 grammatical corrections from Democrats
Good to see you can't resist the thread though. Any thoughts yet on the mistakes made by Ireland and the EU?tailwindhome said:
At this stage, nothing more than not giving May the same exit clause as Boris to get the original backstop through.TheBigBean said:
Ireland definitely has the better PR team. I read an article on the extent they had gone to promote their point of view. Taking journalists on guided tours of the border etc.tailwindhome said:TheBigBean said:So should Biden if he wants to make an international point about it
It's a long term failure of British and NI Unionist politicians that they are unable to have their position (whether you agree with or not) heard in other countries.
Suggesting they haven't read it, or in the case of Pelosi mocking their misnaming of it, when they've already taken a position on it reminds me of the joke about Trump's latest incendiary tweet generating 100,000 grammatical corrections from Democrats
Good to see you can't resist the thread though. Any thoughts yet on the mistakes made by Ireland and the EU?
I may change my mind at later stage when we learn more about what's happening with the Joint Committee. There seems to be fundamental things that could have been done earlier to minimise the impact of the NIP. For example some sort of exemption for major retailers such as ASDA and Tesco that their deliveries would be assumed to be not at risk of moving into the single market.
Obviously I'm disregarding their insistence on there being no change at the Irish border. Its true to say
that that shaped the whole process, and a deal would have been much easier without it, but I don't know that their red line can be defined as a 'mistake'
difficult to say that was a mistake by the EU as their strategy may have been to use the Irish border as the anvil on which to break us0 -
EU must look after its own - that is surely the point of it, and arguably, one of the legitimate criticisms levelled against it is that it doesn't do that enough, so surely this is a good opportunity to show what solidarity to Ireland, a member, is versus UK, who isn't, looks like?surrey_commuter said:
if both sides cared about the issue then negotiating the WA in conjunction with the future relationship would have made far more sense.tailwindhome said:
What do you think they got wrong?Stevo_666 said:
Pretty mild then; not unexpected though.tailwindhome said:Stevo_666 said:
I'd be interested to hear those as well.TheBigBean said:
Ireland definitely has the better PR team. I read an article on the extent they had gone to promote their point of view. Taking journalists on guided tours of the border etc.tailwindhome said:TheBigBean said:So should Biden if he wants to make an international point about it
It's a long term failure of British and NI Unionist politicians that they are unable to have their position (whether you agree with or not) heard in other countries.
Suggesting they haven't read it, or in the case of Pelosi mocking their misnaming of it, when they've already taken a position on it reminds me of the joke about Trump's latest incendiary tweet generating 100,000 grammatical corrections from Democrats
Good to see you can't resist the thread though. Any thoughts yet on the mistakes made by Ireland and the EU?tailwindhome said:
At this stage, nothing more than not giving May the same exit clause as Boris to get the original backstop through.TheBigBean said:
Ireland definitely has the better PR team. I read an article on the extent they had gone to promote their point of view. Taking journalists on guided tours of the border etc.tailwindhome said:TheBigBean said:So should Biden if he wants to make an international point about it
It's a long term failure of British and NI Unionist politicians that they are unable to have their position (whether you agree with or not) heard in other countries.
Suggesting they haven't read it, or in the case of Pelosi mocking their misnaming of it, when they've already taken a position on it reminds me of the joke about Trump's latest incendiary tweet generating 100,000 grammatical corrections from Democrats
Good to see you can't resist the thread though. Any thoughts yet on the mistakes made by Ireland and the EU?
I may change my mind at later stage when we learn more about what's happening with the Joint Committee. There seems to be fundamental things that could have been done earlier to minimise the impact of the NIP. For example some sort of exemption for major retailers such as ASDA and Tesco that their deliveries would be assumed to be not at risk of moving into the single market.
Obviously I'm disregarding their insistence on there being no change at the Irish border. Its true to say
that that shaped the whole process, and a deal would have been much easier without it, but I don't know that their red line can be defined as a 'mistake'
difficult to say that was a mistake by the EU as their strategy may have been to use the Irish border as the anvil on which to break us0 -
Who would think it would be hard to find a solution to a=b, b=c, a≠c0
-
as the old saying goes, making decisions is easy the hard part is making a decision when all options are bad.kingstongraham said:Who would think it would be hard to find a solution to a=b, b=c, a≠c
0 -
Brino is a sensible options and will satisfy all but the most extreme people on either side - ie what a good compromise looks like.surrey_commuter said:
as the old saying goes, making decisions is easy the hard part is making a decision when all options are bad.kingstongraham said:Who would think it would be hard to find a solution to a=b, b=c, a≠c
As the U.K. has demonstrated it is “sovereign” so it can always chose to roll back various things when it sees fit, without such a damaclean negotiating environment0 -
The town of Ponta Porã is on the border between Brazil and Paraguay. The border runs pretty much down the high street. On one side they speak Portguese and use Reais and the other Spanish and use Guaranis. Immigration runs an office in the outskirts that you need to seek out.
My only point is that not all borders are alike.
The border between France and Brazil is similar too.0 -
This is the 3rd stage of loss - bargaining...rick_chasey said:
Brino is a sensible options and will satisfy all but the most extreme people on either side - ie what a good compromise looks like.surrey_commuter said:
as the old saying goes, making decisions is easy the hard part is making a decision when all options are bad.kingstongraham said:Who would think it would be hard to find a solution to a=b, b=c, a≠c
As the U.K. has demonstrated it is “sovereign” so it can always chose to roll back various things when it sees fit, without such a damaclean negotiating environment
1 -
Yes, that ship sailed some time ago. We're all stuck with brex$hit now. It's what we make of it now.coopster_the_1st said:
This is the 3rd stage of loss - bargaining...rick_chasey said:
Brino is a sensible options and will satisfy all but the most extreme people on either side - ie what a good compromise looks like.surrey_commuter said:
as the old saying goes, making decisions is easy the hard part is making a decision when all options are bad.kingstongraham said:Who would think it would be hard to find a solution to a=b, b=c, a≠c
As the U.K. has demonstrated it is “sovereign” so it can always chose to roll back various things when it sees fit, without such a damaclean negotiating environment0 -
Ok.surrey_commuter said:
if both sides cared about the issue then negotiating the WA in conjunction with the future relationship would have made far more sense.tailwindhome said:
What do you think they got wrong?Stevo_666 said:
Pretty mild then; not unexpected though.tailwindhome said:Stevo_666 said:
I'd be interested to hear those as well.TheBigBean said:
Ireland definitely has the better PR team. I read an article on the extent they had gone to promote their point of view. Taking journalists on guided tours of the border etc.tailwindhome said:TheBigBean said:So should Biden if he wants to make an international point about it
It's a long term failure of British and NI Unionist politicians that they are unable to have their position (whether you agree with or not) heard in other countries.
Suggesting they haven't read it, or in the case of Pelosi mocking their misnaming of it, when they've already taken a position on it reminds me of the joke about Trump's latest incendiary tweet generating 100,000 grammatical corrections from Democrats
Good to see you can't resist the thread though. Any thoughts yet on the mistakes made by Ireland and the EU?tailwindhome said:
At this stage, nothing more than not giving May the same exit clause as Boris to get the original backstop through.TheBigBean said:
Ireland definitely has the better PR team. I read an article on the extent they had gone to promote their point of view. Taking journalists on guided tours of the border etc.tailwindhome said:TheBigBean said:So should Biden if he wants to make an international point about it
It's a long term failure of British and NI Unionist politicians that they are unable to have their position (whether you agree with or not) heard in other countries.
Suggesting they haven't read it, or in the case of Pelosi mocking their misnaming of it, when they've already taken a position on it reminds me of the joke about Trump's latest incendiary tweet generating 100,000 grammatical corrections from Democrats
Good to see you can't resist the thread though. Any thoughts yet on the mistakes made by Ireland and the EU?
I may change my mind at later stage when we learn more about what's happening with the Joint Committee. There seems to be fundamental things that could have been done earlier to minimise the impact of the NIP. For example some sort of exemption for major retailers such as ASDA and Tesco that their deliveries would be assumed to be not at risk of moving into the single market.
Obviously I'm disregarding their insistence on there being no change at the Irish border. Its true to say
that that shaped the whole process, and a deal would have been much easier without it, but I don't know that their red line can be defined as a 'mistake'
difficult to say that was a mistake by the EU as their strategy may have been to use the Irish border as the anvil on which to break us
It's 2018
EU have left the border out of the Withdrawal Agreement.
What happens next?“New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!0 -
We’d still be struggling with how the border would work.tailwindhome said:
Ok.surrey_commuter said:
if both sides cared about the issue then negotiating the WA in conjunction with the future relationship would have made far more sense.tailwindhome said:
What do you think they got wrong?Stevo_666 said:
Pretty mild then; not unexpected though.tailwindhome said:Stevo_666 said:
I'd be interested to hear those as well.TheBigBean said:
Ireland definitely has the better PR team. I read an article on the extent they had gone to promote their point of view. Taking journalists on guided tours of the border etc.tailwindhome said:TheBigBean said:So should Biden if he wants to make an international point about it
It's a long term failure of British and NI Unionist politicians that they are unable to have their position (whether you agree with or not) heard in other countries.
Suggesting they haven't read it, or in the case of Pelosi mocking their misnaming of it, when they've already taken a position on it reminds me of the joke about Trump's latest incendiary tweet generating 100,000 grammatical corrections from Democrats
Good to see you can't resist the thread though. Any thoughts yet on the mistakes made by Ireland and the EU?tailwindhome said:
At this stage, nothing more than not giving May the same exit clause as Boris to get the original backstop through.TheBigBean said:
Ireland definitely has the better PR team. I read an article on the extent they had gone to promote their point of view. Taking journalists on guided tours of the border etc.tailwindhome said:TheBigBean said:So should Biden if he wants to make an international point about it
It's a long term failure of British and NI Unionist politicians that they are unable to have their position (whether you agree with or not) heard in other countries.
Suggesting they haven't read it, or in the case of Pelosi mocking their misnaming of it, when they've already taken a position on it reminds me of the joke about Trump's latest incendiary tweet generating 100,000 grammatical corrections from Democrats
Good to see you can't resist the thread though. Any thoughts yet on the mistakes made by Ireland and the EU?
I may change my mind at later stage when we learn more about what's happening with the Joint Committee. There seems to be fundamental things that could have been done earlier to minimise the impact of the NIP. For example some sort of exemption for major retailers such as ASDA and Tesco that their deliveries would be assumed to be not at risk of moving into the single market.
Obviously I'm disregarding their insistence on there being no change at the Irish border. Its true to say
that that shaped the whole process, and a deal would have been much easier without it, but I don't know that their red line can be defined as a 'mistake'
difficult to say that was a mistake by the EU as their strategy may have been to use the Irish border as the anvil on which to break us
It's 2018
EU have left the border out of the Withdrawal Agreement.
What happens next?
Without NI, Brexit would have been done and dusted for better or worse 2 years ago.
Whether it’s hard coded into the agreement explicitly or not, it is a de facto issue with different laws and standards on either side of an open border.
I don’t like Brexit but it is perfectly deliverable without NI.0 -
I get where you are coming from but my brain can’t cope with TM being PM as she would have won the vote.tailwindhome said:
Ok.surrey_commuter said:
if both sides cared about the issue then negotiating the WA in conjunction with the future relationship would have made far more sense.tailwindhome said:
What do you think they got wrong?Stevo_666 said:
Pretty mild then; not unexpected though.tailwindhome said:Stevo_666 said:
I'd be interested to hear those as well.TheBigBean said:
Ireland definitely has the better PR team. I read an article on the extent they had gone to promote their point of view. Taking journalists on guided tours of the border etc.tailwindhome said:TheBigBean said:So should Biden if he wants to make an international point about it
It's a long term failure of British and NI Unionist politicians that they are unable to have their position (whether you agree with or not) heard in other countries.
Suggesting they haven't read it, or in the case of Pelosi mocking their misnaming of it, when they've already taken a position on it reminds me of the joke about Trump's latest incendiary tweet generating 100,000 grammatical corrections from Democrats
Good to see you can't resist the thread though. Any thoughts yet on the mistakes made by Ireland and the EU?tailwindhome said:
At this stage, nothing more than not giving May the same exit clause as Boris to get the original backstop through.TheBigBean said:
Ireland definitely has the better PR team. I read an article on the extent they had gone to promote their point of view. Taking journalists on guided tours of the border etc.tailwindhome said:TheBigBean said:So should Biden if he wants to make an international point about it
It's a long term failure of British and NI Unionist politicians that they are unable to have their position (whether you agree with or not) heard in other countries.
Suggesting they haven't read it, or in the case of Pelosi mocking their misnaming of it, when they've already taken a position on it reminds me of the joke about Trump's latest incendiary tweet generating 100,000 grammatical corrections from Democrats
Good to see you can't resist the thread though. Any thoughts yet on the mistakes made by Ireland and the EU?
I may change my mind at later stage when we learn more about what's happening with the Joint Committee. There seems to be fundamental things that could have been done earlier to minimise the impact of the NIP. For example some sort of exemption for major retailers such as ASDA and Tesco that their deliveries would be assumed to be not at risk of moving into the single market.
Obviously I'm disregarding their insistence on there being no change at the Irish border. Its true to say
that that shaped the whole process, and a deal would have been much easier without it, but I don't know that their red line can be defined as a 'mistake'
difficult to say that was a mistake by the EU as their strategy may have been to use the Irish border as the anvil on which to break us
It's 2018
EU have left the border out of the Withdrawal Agreement.
What happens next?
Would the loons have calmed down after getting Brexit done and allowed a comprehensive free trade deal that would have solved the border problem?
To me we should have the same border as at Dover but I would get that through EEA membership.0 -
Fairly vanilla article in the ST about UK banks writing to ex-pat customers telling them that from 31st Dec they will no longer be licensed.
Over a thousand angry comments;
Unpatriotic ex-pats can FRO
EU can not tell a UK bank what to do and can FRO
An endless diatribe of angry denial and incomprehension of the issues,
It would indicate that Boris has given up on passporting and the banks will chose their markets0 -
@ immigrants. Deserve everything they get.surrey_commuter said:Fairly vanilla article in the ST about UK banks writing to ex-pat customers telling them that from 31st Dec they will no longer be licensed.
Over a thousand angry comments;
Unpatriotic ex-pats can FRO
EU can not tell a UK bank what to do and can FRO
An endless diatribe of angry denial and incomprehension of the issues,
It would indicate that Boris has given up on passporting and the banks will chose their markets0 -
They'll be a few bigger issues than angry expats.surrey_commuter said:Fairly vanilla article in the ST about UK banks writing to ex-pat customers telling them that from 31st Dec they will no longer be licensed.
Over a thousand angry comments;
Unpatriotic ex-pats can FRO
EU can not tell a UK bank what to do and can FRO
An endless diatribe of angry denial and incomprehension of the issues,
It would indicate that Boris has given up on passporting and the banks will chose their markets0 -
I naively thought that it made it easy to understand the issue of passporting, I was rather surprised at how angry and clueless Leave voting online Times subscribers are.TheBigBean said:
They'll be a few bigger issues than angry expats.surrey_commuter said:Fairly vanilla article in the ST about UK banks writing to ex-pat customers telling them that from 31st Dec they will no longer be licensed.
Over a thousand angry comments;
Unpatriotic ex-pats can FRO
EU can not tell a UK bank what to do and can FRO
An endless diatribe of angry denial and incomprehension of the issues,
It would indicate that Boris has given up on passporting and the banks will chose their markets
Boris really need not worry about lorry parks in Kent as the response will be that is everybody elses fault and the solution is to do it back to them0