Diet- protein, carb and fat %

slowmartslowmart Posts: 3,695
So I’m rebuilding my fitness after a lay off and I’m working towards starting a 28 week programme from 7th September with Trainer road which means I’ll finish on the first day of Spring. My current thinking is (mid volume 5 to 7.2 hrs per week) two blocks of sweet spot/base, 6 weeks each block, one block of build for 8 weeks ending with an 8 weeks specialty phase.

So I want to get my diet correct in terms of calorie intake and % of carbs, protein and fat based on 6-7 hours of trading per week.

I need to lose about half a pound a week for the duration.

Informed comments and insights as to the breakdown of protein, carbs and into my strategy would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance.
And God created the bicycle, so that man could use it as a means for work and to help him negotiate life's complicated journey.

Posts

  • ugo.santaluciaugo.santalucia Posts: 24,148
    There is no such thing as the "correct amount". There are guidelines and then there are all sorts of diets. It's entirely up to you.

    Half a pound a week sounds rather unambitious if you are overweight, twice that is eminently doable
  • StillGoingStillGoing Posts: 5,003
    There is no such thing as the "correct amount". There are guidelines and then there are all sorts of diets. It's entirely up to you.

    Half a pound a week sounds rather unambitious if you are overweight, twice that is eminently doable

    And not sustainable and will no doubt lead to weight gain.

    OP, your best bet is to go and see a dietician to assess your tolerance to certain food types. There are some that can eat virtually anything and still remain lean and others that walk past a cream cake and put weight on. For quick results do weights instead of cycling a few times a week.
    TACX iFlow - basic, Bushido smart -Rubbish, Elite Kura - not smart, Direto - awful, Tacx Neo1 - perfect.
  • hdowhdow Posts: 137
    Agree with philthy3. Half a pound a week is sustainable over more than a couple of weeks. More is too much of a calories deficit and often leads to metabolic shutdown which aint good

    Just getting back into regular training will most likely shift the weight

    For some informed comment on how to balance your diet simply google 'NHS balanced diet' and have a read
  • craigus89craigus89 Posts: 863
    hdow wrote:
    For some informed comment on how to balance your diet simply google 'NHS balanced diet' and have a read

    This. The whole 'diet' industry makes it seem complicated, it really isn't. Don't eat 20p for the swearbox (fast food, refined sugar, trans-fats) and keep the portion sizes down. Simple.
  • ugo.santaluciaugo.santalucia Posts: 24,148
    A pound a week is really not extreme... of that pound only about half is fat, so that's a deficit of about 2,000 KCal per week, or 300 a day... so if you need 2,500 to keep weight stable, then you just have to cut to 2,200
  • joey54321joey54321 Posts: 1,297
    A pound a week is really not extreme... of that pound only about half is fat, so that's a deficit of about 2,000 KCal per week, or 300 a day... so if you need 2,500 to keep weight stable, then you just have to cut to 2,200

    What if you just want to lose the fat part without losing the lean muscle? Maybe aim for half a pound per week?
  • imposter2.0imposter2.0 Posts: 10,641
    A pound a week is really not extreme... of that pound only about half is fat, so that's a deficit of about 2,000 KCal per week, or 300 a day... so if you need 2,500 to keep weight stable, then you just have to cut to 2,200

    And because it's not 'extreme' - it means it's sustainable...which is the point everyone is making..
  • webboowebboo Posts: 2,072
    joey54321 wrote:
    A pound a week is really not extreme... of that pound only about half is fat, so that's a deficit of about 2,000 KCal per week, or 300 a day... so if you need 2,500 to keep weight stable, then you just have to cut to 2,200

    What if you just want to lose the fat part without losing the lean muscle? Maybe aim for half a pound per week?
    I’m sure I read somewhere that if you keep exercising the muscles you don’t lose them even if you are on a reduced calorie intake.
  • ugo.santaluciaugo.santalucia Posts: 24,148
    It's not about losing the lean muscle or not. Whenever you lose weight, part of it comes from losing water... there are no calories associated to water
  • imposter2.0imposter2.0 Posts: 10,641
    It's not about losing the lean muscle or not. Whenever you lose weight, part of it comes from losing water... there are no calories associated to water

    Fluid loss through weight loss and the calorie content of water is a total conflation. The two are separate issues and have no relevance to each other.
  • ugo.santaluciaugo.santalucia Posts: 24,148
    Imposter wrote:
    It's not about losing the lean muscle or not. Whenever you lose weight, part of it comes from losing water... there are no calories associated to water

    Fluid loss through weight loss and the calorie content of water is a total conflation. The two are separate issues and have no relevance to each other.


    What I mean is that losing 450 grams, roughly means 220 g of fat, most of the rest is water, the fat more or less is worth 2,000 KCal. To burn it off in a week, you need a calories deficit of about 300 a day
  • simon_e-2simon_e-2 Posts: 1,667
    Avoid or reduce processed junk food, sugary and fatty foods. Eat more raw veg and fruit. You don't need a specific 'diet' or for training just 7 hours/week.

    You may benefit from tweaking calorie intake depending on how much exercise you do. Fuel your training adequately but consume less on the days you are doing less or no exercise. Nothing extreme, but just as you don't supersize your dinner after a long ride, try to resist the urge to eat more on an easy/rest day because you supposedly burned x calories in yesterday's session or ride. Avoid eating late in the evening if possible.

    A food diary like myfitnesspal might help identify where you're eating more than you need or ensure you get enough protein without overdoing it. The one time protein intake is particularly important is in the few hours after training, less so at other times.

    If you're tracking weight then weighing weekly is fine but do it at the same time (e.g. unclothed, first thing in the morning after a pee). Fluctuations are not important, it's the long term trend that matters. If you have a bit of a binge (Christmas, a stag weekend etc) don't fret, just ensure you get back into the pattern and resume your normal intake.
    Aspire not to have more, but to be more.
  • super_davosuper_davo Posts: 466
    Some passionate responses but Ugo is right that a pound a week isn't a huge amount in the scheme of things.

    My advice would be if you were following a structured training plan, try to lose the majority of the weight you need to lose during the sweet spot / base phase, and slow it down or maintain during the build and speciality phase. That way, your training isn't compromised by your diet.

    No particular protein / carb / fat % required, just eat sensible quantities of healthy food.
  • hdowhdow Posts: 137
    A pound of fat contains 3,500 kcal. Early weight loss may include some fluid loss (a lot of that is associated with glycogen storage) but the OP is looking for a sustained loss as fitness is built. Take the 2,500 kcal daily requirement and a daily reduction of 500 kcal is at the very top end of recommended calorie deficits of 10 to 20%. Too high a weight loss risks metabolic slowdown which is best avoided

    If the calorie restriction is too great there is a serious risk that lean tissue will be metabolised to provide energy. The OP will not maximise his fitness gains if muscle tissue is lost. The target is 14 pounds over 28 weeks so why take any risks?
  • slowmartslowmart Posts: 3,695
    Thank you for the replies.

    My primary aim is to remain bug free over winter to maximise my gains and as I’m 52 I’m taking a cautious approach to remaining healthy with the increased stresses I’ll be placing on my body.

    This is why I have provisionally set my weight loss goal for winter at half a pound a week which I’ll review as I become more informed on the impact of the training stresses.
    And God created the bicycle, so that man could use it as a means for work and to help him negotiate life's complicated journey.
  • bobmcstuffbobmcstuff Posts: 7,862
    My 2p having followed trainerroad plans for several years now:

    It's much easier to try and do the weight loss you want earlier in the base phase, because in the build and speciality phases the workload is higher with more, higher intensity intervals and worrying about calories etc then is a pain (and can be counterproductive, although if you're only trying to lose half a pound a week that will probably happen without much effort). Personally I try and get to the weight I want to be in base and then focus on eating well and building power during the later phases.

    Unless you're super lean already you can lose a pound a week or maybe more without impacting your training, I'm with ugo on this. Specially in the base phase. Then focus on those VO2 intervals during the later phases...
  • DeVlaeminckDeVlaeminck Posts: 5,305
    When I lost a couple of stone 18 months or so ago I found the weekly weight loss could vary between zero and a couple of pounds - of course some of that variation may be due to different levels of hydration etc etc so I wouldn't stress too much if the scales show you'vevexceeded the recommended weekly loss or not hit your target now and again.

    I don't know about recommended ratios of cards/fats/protein but I did it by cutting out certain foods - sugary stuff and starchy carbs such as bread, pasta, potatoes, rice - it wasn't an atkins type approach as I continued eating plenty of fruit, ate stuff like plain yoghurt and massively upped the amount of veg I ate and all of that stuff has carbs although overall carb intake would have been significantly lower. It was more a change in what I ate than conscious change in quantities. Whether this worked because I reduced my carb intake or because most snacks are carb based so I just snacked less is debatable but whatever it did work.

    As regards ratios my take is that what is important is sufficient of each rather than balance and most of us are eating an excess of all 3. The correct ratio would only really matter if we were ideal weight and eating no more than enough to sustain that.
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  • Ric/RSTSportRic/RSTSport Posts: 686
    Losing (fat) weight is both easy (eat less calories than you expend) and surprisingly difficult - especially if you are training at the same time.

    There's a variety of issues involved from motivation and staying power through to avoiding foods you may like that have little nutritional value.

    I work with a few athletes who have weight loss goals, and i went through similar myself about 5 years ago in my mid 40s where i lost ~8kg over 5 months in the race season.

    With the people i work with, i find it best to generally use a plant based diet for a variety of reasons, including good for health, ample amount of quality carbs to fuel cycle training, plenty of flavours (from herbs and spices, some of which have additional health benefits) and good for reducing inflammation and helping recovery. For those that can't leave meat alone i include that in their diet.

    There's obviously a ton of stuff you can google about plant based diets, or weight loss in general from NHS (which someone else mentioned) through to weird and wacky stuff (probably on the advice of an A list Hollywood celeb!). If you'd like some help though, give me a shout.

    Ric

    p.s. macronutrient ratios may be dependent upon training volume and intensity
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  • keef66keef66 Posts: 13,286
    slowmart wrote:
    So I want to get my diet correct in terms of calorie intake and % of carbs, protein and fat based on 6-7 hours of trading per week.

    I need to lose about half a pound a week for the duration.

    If I tried my hand at trading for 6-7 hours a week I'd probably lose thousands of pounds...

    Was that a typo or do you have a cold?
  • simon_e-2simon_e-2 Posts: 1,667
    slowmart wrote:
    Thank you for the replies.

    My primary aim is to remain bug free over winter to maximise my gains and as I’m 52 I’m taking a cautious approach to remaining healthy with the increased stresses I’ll be placing on my body.

    This is why I have provisionally set my weight loss goal for winter at half a pound a week which I’ll review as I become more informed on the impact of the training stresses.
    Reducing the chance of infection involves various things, of which diet isn't the most important. Sleep is top of those IMHO, regardless of whether you're training or not. It can help your body withstand all kinds of bugs, even when family members are full of colds.

    Avoid doing things that lower your immune system such as training rides where you get cold and wet or burning the candle at both ends. If you work indoors then get outside more; make yourself unpopular by opening windows, which be very significant when a colleague has an infection.

    Regarding weight, I'd look to make the more significant gains in Autumn rather than through the darkest days of Winter and the beginning of the year. I find Autumn a time when I can drop a couple of kg more easily as the days are cooler but not uncomfortably cold. Try training before breakfast to burn more fat as suggested by Adam Hansen in a recent Telegraph interview.

    Don't focus too much on macros but look at what you eat in broader terms. Cutting down sugar and sweet foods is hard but if you persevere then you will also crave them less. Sweet stuff sets you off on an energy rollercoaster that will f..k with your insulin levels and make weight loss more difficult.
    Aspire not to have more, but to be more.
  • ugo.santaluciaugo.santalucia Posts: 24,148
    To avoid bugs, stay away from busy places and kids.

    I get three colds every year: one at the beginning of (Uni) term in October when new students are around, one at the beginning of term 2 when students return from Christmas holidays (this is typically the worst one, keeps me off work for a couple of days) and the final one just after we do our big outreach event in June, when we get year 8 kids from schools (this is a light one, I don't even need to stay home from work)
  • StillGoingStillGoing Posts: 5,003
    A pound a week is really not extreme... of that pound only about half is fat, so that's a deficit of about 2,000 KCal per week, or 300 a day... so if you need 2,500 to keep weight stable, then you just have to cut to 2,200

    My apologies Ugo as I misread the posts. I agree half a stone a week is doable, but preferable around the 2lb a week. Half a lb a week you could do simply by drinking more fluids and going to the bog.
    TACX iFlow - basic, Bushido smart -Rubbish, Elite Kura - not smart, Direto - awful, Tacx Neo1 - perfect.
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