May has gone - ding dong the utter, utter, total failure of a prime minister is gone

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  • robert88
    robert88 Posts: 2,696
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    briantrumpet wrote:
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    It was Mr. Trumpet who brought up a random pair of politicians he didn't like including a foreign leader.
    FTR, Mr Pepper brought them up, and you responded to his 'random pairing' saying it would be funny to see "lefties' blood pressure rising" as a result. Not that facts matter these days.
    Well it has been quite amusing so far.

    https://youtu.be/pHtnutB-06o
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 72,542
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    Rolf F wrote:
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    Rolf F wrote:
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    Rolf F wrote:
    Ludicrous comment of the week on today - that the large number of candidates to replace TM may be an indication of the talent in the Tory party. And this was moments after the suggestion that Priti Patel would be putting herself in the running!

    There's a clod of earth on my garden path that would make a better PM than that lot......
    On that note, who's on the list of talented Lib Dem MPs who can replace 'Formaldehyde Vince'?

    Dunno but it's not quite the point. This is about who will be our next Prime Minister. And they are all worthless. How can a population of 66 million be whittled down to this collection of candidates who would be under qualified to empty the bins?

    Who would you vote for. You still seem to think that the conservative party is some wonderful thing despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary; presumably there are people in there that you think would make a good pm? If so, who? No comedy suggestions please! :wink:
    I'm just saying that people in glass houses... :)

    If you think you can do better, maybe a change of career is on the cards? :wink:

    Who is in a glass house throwing stones?

    And how do you infer that I think I would do any better? I'd be shocking as a PM or indeed an MP. Too absent minded - I'd be both gaff prone and also suffer from the problem of not thinking that I'm always right nor thinking that one party (eg mine whatever that would be) is always right.

    You'd be better than me in politics - you have an unfailing faith in your party despite overwhelming evidence that it is truly pitiful and you are demonstrably good at that politicians favourite - evading a very straightforward question by ignoring it and asking an only slightly relevant question of your own. :wink:
    Just pointing out that the talented Lib Dem leadership list is rather short. Partly a function of the lack Lib Dem MP's granted, but that's not my problem :) However if the 'right on' revolution is coming it may be a relevant point for the UK in the future.

    So which potential Tory leader is better than Ed Davey or Jo Swinson?
    _
  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 58,419
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    Rolf F wrote:
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    Rolf F wrote:
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    Rolf F wrote:
    Ludicrous comment of the week on today - that the large number of candidates to replace TM may be an indication of the talent in the Tory party. And this was moments after the suggestion that Priti Patel would be putting herself in the running!

    There's a clod of earth on my garden path that would make a better PM than that lot......
    On that note, who's on the list of talented Lib Dem MPs who can replace 'Formaldehyde Vince'?

    Dunno but it's not quite the point. This is about who will be our next Prime Minister. And they are all worthless. How can a population of 66 million be whittled down to this collection of candidates who would be under qualified to empty the bins?

    Who would you vote for. You still seem to think that the conservative party is some wonderful thing despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary; presumably there are people in there that you think would make a good pm? If so, who? No comedy suggestions please! :wink:
    I'm just saying that people in glass houses... :)

    If you think you can do better, maybe a change of career is on the cards? :wink:

    Who is in a glass house throwing stones?

    And how do you infer that I think I would do any better? I'd be shocking as a PM or indeed an MP. Too absent minded - I'd be both gaff prone and also suffer from the problem of not thinking that I'm always right nor thinking that one party (eg mine whatever that would be) is always right.

    You'd be better than me in politics - you have an unfailing faith in your party despite overwhelming evidence that it is truly pitiful and you are demonstrably good at that politicians favourite - evading a very straightforward question by ignoring it and asking an only slightly relevant question of your own. :wink:
    Just pointing out that the talented Lib Dem leadership list is rather short. Partly a function of the lack Lib Dem MP's granted, but that's not my problem :) However if the 'right on' revolution is coming it may be a relevant point for the UK in the future.

    So which potential Tory leader is better than Ed Davey or Jo Swinson?
    No idea as I know very little about those two.

    And of course depends what you mean by better - voters having a clue who they are is sometimes good....
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 26,208
    Do you get to vote stevo? Genuinely interested who you would pick as a remain voting conservative.
  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 58,419
    KingstonGraham wrote:
    Do you get to vote stevo? Genuinely interested who you would pick as a remain voting conservative.
    Not a member KG...
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 26,208
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    KingstonGraham wrote:
    Do you get to vote stevo? Genuinely interested who you would pick as a remain voting conservative.
    Not a member KG...

    Shame, they could do with people like you to be honest. Who would you pick if you could?
  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 58,419
    KingstonGraham wrote:
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    KingstonGraham wrote:
    Do you get to vote stevo? Genuinely interested who you would pick as a remain voting conservative.
    Not a member KG...

    Shame, they could do with people like you to be honest. Who would you pick if you could?
    I contribute in other ways :)

    I will need to take a closer look as there are quite a few horses in this particular race and not all are known quantities to me yet.
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • bondurant
    bondurant Posts: 858
    To put it another way, who would you rule out?
  • rolf_f
    rolf_f Posts: 16,015
    Bondurant wrote:
    To put it another way, who would you rule out?

    Give in - I've already tried him on this and it doesn't work. The consummate politician he will just continue to evade the question because, deep down, he knows that they are all crap and that his position is ridiculous but he can't admit it due to his unquestioning love of the Conservative party!

    You will not get Stevo to give you a name. Maybe when it is down to the last two he will tell you who he wouldn't vote for. If you are lucky. But he won't say "Such and such" is good because he knows they won't be.
    Faster than a tent.......
  • briantrumpet
    briantrumpet Posts: 17,845
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    briantrumpet wrote:
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    It was Mr. Trumpet who brought up a random pair of politicians he didn't like including a foreign leader.
    FTR, Mr Pepper brought them up, and you responded to his 'random pairing' saying it would be funny to see "lefties' blood pressure rising" as a result. Not that facts matter these days.
    Well it has been quite amusing so far.
    In any case, not quite random.

    dt-bj.jpg
    https://www.facebook.com/unanglaisendiois
  • darkhairedlord
    darkhairedlord Posts: 7,180
    briantrumpet wrote:
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    briantrumpet wrote:
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    It was Mr. Trumpet who brought up a random pair of politicians he didn't like including a foreign leader.
    FTR, Mr Pepper brought them up, and you responded to his 'random pairing' saying it would be funny to see "lefties' blood pressure rising" as a result. Not that facts matter these days.
    Well it has been quite amusing so far.
    In any case, not quite random.

    dt-bj.jpg
    You would think the ERG would insist on a "birther"
  • rjsterry
    rjsterry Posts: 27,611
    KingstonGraham wrote:
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    KingstonGraham wrote:
    Do you get to vote stevo? Genuinely interested who you would pick as a remain voting conservative.
    Not a member KG...

    Shame, they could do with people like you to be honest. Who would you pick if you could?

    Indeed. Looks like donations have halved and this suggests that they are in real trouble.

    https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/ar ... e-party-48
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    Pinnacle Monzonite

    Part of the anti-growth coalition
  • surrey_commuter
    surrey_commuter Posts: 18,866
    I would describe myself as a "natural Tory" voter but definitely don't have any tribal baggage.

    It is a very uninspiring line up but my choice would be Gove as he has intellectual ballast and over the last three years has shown signs of compromise.
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 26,208
    Surrey Commuter wrote:
    I would describe myself as a "natural Tory" voter but definitely don't have any tribal baggage.

    It is a very uninspiring line up but my choice would be Gove as he has intellectual ballast and over the last three years has shown signs of compromise.

    I know it shouldn't be held against him, but the Alan Partridge-ness of this is amazing.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aKmf7p304go
  • sgt.pepper
    sgt.pepper Posts: 300
    Surrey Commuter wrote:
    I would describe myself as a "natural Tory" voter but definitely don't have any tribal baggage.

    It is a very uninspiring line up but my choice would be Gove as he has intellectual ballast and over the last three years has shown signs of compromise.

    Gove is even more unlikable than May. David Davis is far more reasonable, and would run rings around Corbyn.
  • surfercyclist
    surfercyclist Posts: 894
    Sgt.Pepper wrote:
    Surrey Commuter wrote:
    I would describe myself as a "natural Tory" voter but definitely don't have any tribal baggage.

    It is a very uninspiring line up but my choice would be Gove as he has intellectual ballast and over the last three years has shown signs of compromise.

    Gove is even more unlikable than May. David Davis is far more reasonable, and would run rings around Corbyn.

    Best one(who is not in leadership race and ruled herself out ages ago) is Ruth Davies, leader of Scottish Conservatives.
  • briantrumpet
    briantrumpet Posts: 17,845
    Sgt.Pepper wrote:
    Surrey Commuter wrote:
    I would describe myself as a "natural Tory" voter but definitely don't have any tribal baggage.

    It is a very uninspiring line up but my choice would be Gove as he has intellectual ballast and over the last three years has shown signs of compromise.

    Gove is even more unlikable than May. David Davis is far more reasonable, and would run rings around Corbyn.
    David Davis is, by many accounts, both lazy and dim.

    Perfect.
    https://www.facebook.com/unanglaisendiois
  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 58,419
    Bondurant wrote:
    To put it another way, who would you rule out?
    I can safely rule out Boris at this stage. Ditto Raab.

    There are 12 in the frame now, time to do a bit of reading....
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 58,419
    Rolf F wrote:
    Bondurant wrote:
    To put it another way, who would you rule out?

    Give in - I've already tried him on this and it doesn't work. The consummate politician he will just continue to evade the question because, deep down, he knows that they are all crap and that his position is ridiculous but he can't admit it due to his unquestioning love of the Conservative party!

    You will not get Stevo to give you a name. Maybe when it is down to the last two he will tell you who he wouldn't vote for. If you are lucky. But he won't say "Such and such" is good because he knows they won't be.
    Cough cough :wink:
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • coopster_the_1st
    coopster_the_1st Posts: 5,158
    As one of the few Conservatives on this board and probably the one most in tune with the grass roots of the party this is how I see it.

    The candidates can be put into a few groups:


    Front runners(will win if they make it to the final 2):

    Boris Johnson
    Only one on the list that can bring an immediate halt to the Farage express. Also has leadership experience with his 2 terms as London Mayor. These 2 things combined with his popularity with the grass roots give the best chance of reuniting the Party.

    Dominic Raab
    Would be favourite without Boris in the running. If the MP's 'anyone but Boris(ABB)' plot succeeds Raab should win. If not, suspect he will get the DExEU job again.



    The May v2 deal candidates:

    Sajid Javid
    Strongest of this group of candidates but the grass roots will not risk a May v2 compromise deal candidate again after May's compromise.

    Michael Gove
    A confirmed leaver but is tainted by his support of May v2. I personally don't trust him and I question how many of the grass roots will.

    Jeremy Hunt
    Killed his chances by going down the May v2 deal route.

    Rory Stewart
    Gone strong on social media too early IMO. Again has killed his chances with the grassroots by his support of a May v2 deal. Not comparable as a party leader or PM to any of the 5 above.

    Matt Hancock
    As per Rory Stewart but without the strong social media start.



    Too soon for another female PM:

    May has killed any chance of a female PM this time as while the party wants a Thatcher, there is too much risk that they get another May!

    Esther McVey
    A proper leaver but May's failure has killed the chance that the next PM is a woman.

    Andrea Leadsom
    As above but also tainted by voting for May's horrid deal.



    Outsiders:

    James Cleverly
    The strongest outsider but I'm struggling to see where he will get the support with Boris and Raab in the running. Leavers MP's will not want to risk splitting the vote and not getting a proper Leaver in the final 2.

    Kit Malthouse
    He has a compromise deal named after him and not known outside that. Looks to be entering just to raise his profile for the future.

    Mark Harper
    Who? I doubt half his constituents know who he is. Again only entering to raise his profile.
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 26,208
    Would they really reject all women because of May? I guess so.
  • morstar
    morstar Posts: 6,190
    Coopster the 1st wrote:

    give the best chance of reuniting the Party.

    Too soon for another female PM:

    A reasonable assessment overall. Two interesting points above.

    Do you think anyone can re-unite the party within the remainder of this parliamentary cycle? I'd have thought the leader has two options.
      back the bigger voting block and accept losing the other, or... continue and try to keep both sides happy (Not working for either labour or tory at present)

    Re your second point. Do you genuinely think gender matters? Have we not moved past blaming all women for one womans performance?
  • rolf_f
    rolf_f Posts: 16,015
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    Rolf F wrote:
    Bondurant wrote:
    To put it another way, who would you rule out?

    Give in - I've already tried him on this and it doesn't work. The consummate politician he will just continue to evade the question because, deep down, he knows that they are all crap and that his position is ridiculous but he can't admit it due to his unquestioning love of the Conservative party!

    You will not get Stevo to give you a name. Maybe when it is down to the last two he will tell you who he wouldn't vote for. If you are lucky. But he won't say "Such and such" is good because he knows they won't be.
    Cough cough :wink:
    You need to get that cough seen to; it could be tuberculosis!

    But you are doing well. I'm impressed! :D You do still need to at some point come up with some one you do favour rather than those you don't!
    Faster than a tent.......
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 26,208
    I don't get it - they do know who Boris Johnson is, right?
  • coopster_the_1st
    coopster_the_1st Posts: 5,158
    morstar wrote:
    Coopster the 1st wrote:

    give the best chance of reuniting the Party.

    Too soon for another female PM:

    A reasonable assessment overall. Two interesting points above.

    Do you think anyone can re-unite the party within the remainder of this parliamentary cycle? I'd have thought the leader has two options.
      back the bigger voting block and accept losing the other, or... continue and try to keep both sides happy (Not working for either labour or tory at present)

    Re your second point. Do you genuinely think gender matters? Have we not moved past blaming all women for one womans performance?

    Point 1:
    Boris to me is the only candidate that can stop and reverse the rise of the Brexit party. Additionally he has support of the grass roots. This is the influence that gives the best chance of re-uniting the party by bringing all but the most extreme outliers into line. I don't see any other candidate having this support, and to me this support is what gives him the best chance of re-uniting the party.

    Point 2:
    Yes I believe gender does matter when things go badly or well. Had May been a man the female candidates would have been favourite IMO. The party will not survive if they get another leader like May.
  • chris_bass
    chris_bass Posts: 4,913
    Coopster the 1st wrote:
    Point 2:
    Yes I believe gender does matter when things go badly or well. Had May been a man the female candidates would have been favourite IMO. The party will not survive if they get another leader like May.

    truly unbelievable!

    would you say the same thing about race?

    because one woman wasn't good that means all women will be bad?
    www.conjunctivitis.com - a site for sore eyes
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 72,542
    Guys, why are you engaging with him.

    Seriously.
    _
  • coopster_the_1st
    coopster_the_1st Posts: 5,158
    Chris Bass wrote:
    Coopster the 1st wrote:
    Point 2:
    Yes I believe gender does matter when things go badly or well. Had May been a man the female candidates would have been favourite IMO. The party will not survive if they get another leader like May.

    truly unbelievable!

    would you say the same thing about race?

    because one woman wasn't good that means all women will be bad?

    The Tories wanted another Thatcher as leader and that positive view of one woman influenced how they viewed other female candidates. Was this also wrong?
    May has hugely damaged that positive view for other female candidates in the short term.

    I have no idea why you have brought race into this discussion. Is this how snowflakes think? :roll:
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 26,208
    I think you should count out any other leaders who are 5'7" tall. Not to be trusted.
  • chris_bass
    chris_bass Posts: 4,913
    Coopster the 1st wrote:
    The Tories wanted another Thatcher as leader and that positive view of one woman influenced how they viewed other female candidates. Was this also wrong?
    May has hugely damaged that positive view for other female candidates in the short term.

    I have no idea why you have brought race into this discussion. Is this how snowflakes think? :roll:

    yes that was also wrong if that is what they thought. Although, didn't she get the role because everyone else withdrew or didn't want it?

    I brought race into it because it is also something someone doesn't choose and has no impact on their ability to do something or other people's ability to do anything.

    Theresa May did what she did as PM because she was Theresa May, not because she was a woman.
    www.conjunctivitis.com - a site for sore eyes

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