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104th Liège - Bastogne - Liège, 258.5kms :April 22nd 2018 *Spoilers*

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  • ProssPross Posts: 29,642
    It never ceases to surprise me that regular watchers of cycling continue to get shocked by the same tactics they’ve seen for years. The importance of World Tour points also gets overlooked.
  • jam1ejam1e Posts: 1,060
    I’m not sure it counts as a tactic, it’s more of a tactical vacuum. The fact it happens a lot is beside the point.
  • bobmcstuffbobmcstuff Posts: 10,220
    jam1e wrote:
    I’m not sure it counts as a tactic, it’s more of a tactical vacuum. The fact it happens a lot is beside the point.

    Or, great tactics from QS.

    Calling not wanting to drag a couple of fast finishers to the line, one of whom has an excuse to sit on, a tactical vacuum is just silly.

    Also forgetting that at one point it looked like Vanendert had a good chance to bridge (the gap went from 35-40s down to 18-19s very quickly), plus Woods and Bardet did get away too.
  • thegibdogthegibdog Posts: 2,106
    I don't think anyone is shocked, just pointing out that some teams should've acted differently if they wanted to win.

    Cosmo's take on it:
    http://cyclocosm.com/2018/04/how-the-ra ... iege-2018/
  • thegibdogthegibdog Posts: 2,106
    bobmcstuff wrote:
    Also forgetting that at one point it looked like Vanendert had a good chance to bridge (the gap went from 35-40s down to 18-19s very quickly), plus Woods and Bardet did get away too.
    Vanendert would've bridged if his teammate had sat on the front of the chase group to peg the gap.
  • rick_chaseyrick_chasey Posts: 57,448 Lives Here
    Some fans are always palpably disappointed when the strongest doesn’t win.
  • ellerslierdellerslierd Posts: 266
    In “The Rider” by Tim Krabbe, he describes his frustration that the peloton is like a cage/prison. Once you have missed the move, then even if you have the legs there isn’t much that you can do, especially with riders in the group with a reason not to work.

    He also points out a particular rider who they all know does too much work and finishes nowhere, and wonders where they would be without him.

    Some people think road racing is about going fast - but it is so much more than that, which is why we love it.
  • DeVlaeminckDeVlaeminck Posts: 7,317
    I don't think it's disappointment the strongest doesn't win more that it took a long time for any real action to start and once it started effectively it was over once Jngels got a gap - bar a brief moment when it looked like one rider might bridge.

    To work or play poker is a balance but it does seem to me it more often than not tips too far towards playing poker. On Sunday there were a lot of riders in that group so if the collective contributed no individual was going to be called in to do much - alternatively those teams with two riders surely had to commit a man to the chase. Pozzo looked to have enough left and Gasparotto can sprint or alternatively Gasparotto chased and Pozzo attacks in an incline. As has already been noted same with Van's team.
    [Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]
  • ShutupJensShutupJens Posts: 1,373
    thegibdog wrote:
    bobmcstuff wrote:
    Also forgetting that at one point it looked like Vanendert had a good chance to bridge (the gap went from 35-40s down to 18-19s very quickly), plus Woods and Bardet did get away too.
    Vanendert would've bridged if his teammate had sat on the front of the chase group to peg the gap.

    Not convinced by this, if he had the legs to bridge then surely he'd have had the legs to stay in the top 10
  • DeVlaeminckDeVlaeminck Posts: 7,317
    ShutupJens wrote:
    thegibdog wrote:
    bobmcstuff wrote:
    Also forgetting that at one point it looked like Vanendert had a good chance to bridge (the gap went from 35-40s down to 18-19s very quickly), plus Woods and Bardet did get away too.
    Vanendert would've bridged if his teammate had sat on the front of the chase group to peg the gap.

    Not convinced by this, if he had the legs to bridge then surely he'd have had the legs to stay in the top 10


    No doubt he would have done had he not tried to bridge across - if you go all in to cross a gap like that and don't make it it takes a huge toll.
    [Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]
  • thegibdogthegibdog Posts: 2,106
    ShutupJens wrote:
    thegibdog wrote:
    bobmcstuff wrote:
    Also forgetting that at one point it looked like Vanendert had a good chance to bridge (the gap went from 35-40s down to 18-19s very quickly), plus Woods and Bardet did get away too.
    Vanendert would've bridged if his teammate had sat on the front of the chase group to peg the gap.
    Not convinced by this, if he had the legs to bridge then surely he'd have had the legs to stay in the top 10
    He closed 25s on the climb, so if the chase had restricted the gap to this he would've made it across. Not saying that he would've won, mind.
  • ShutupJensShutupJens Posts: 1,373
    thegibdog wrote:
    ShutupJens wrote:
    thegibdog wrote:
    bobmcstuff wrote:
    Also forgetting that at one point it looked like Vanendert had a good chance to bridge (the gap went from 35-40s down to 18-19s very quickly), plus Woods and Bardet did get away too.
    Vanendert would've bridged if his teammate had sat on the front of the chase group to peg the gap.
    Not convinced by this, if he had the legs to bridge then surely he'd have had the legs to stay in the top 10
    He closed 25s on the climb, so if the chase had restricted the gap to this he would've made it across. Not saying that he would've won, mind.

    Apologies I misunderstood what you were saying - yeah he came close didn't he, must have felt awful coming so close but still finishing outside the top 10
  • m.r.m.m.r.m. Posts: 2,421
    It's the kind of lesson that often breeds wheelsuckers :wink:
    PTP Champion 2019
  • rick_chaseyrick_chasey Posts: 57,448 Lives Here
    Watched pieces of this.

    Valverde is a good example of what happens if you put in a big attack and it doesn’t stick.

    Got monstered later on.
  • Vino'sGhostVino'sGhost Posts: 4,129
    Watched pieces of this.

    Valverde is a good example of what happens if you put in a big attack and it doesn’t stick.

    Got monstered later on.

    yep he looked pretty exhausted by the end as they all did. I suppose thats one of the points about the monuments, the time the difficulty the distance, all add up to the point where theyre dammed if they do and dammed if they dont.
  • Vino'sGhostVino'sGhost Posts: 4,129
    thegibdog wrote:
    ShutupJens wrote:
    thegibdog wrote:
    bobmcstuff wrote:
    Also forgetting that at one point it looked like Vanendert had a good chance to bridge (the gap went from 35-40s down to 18-19s very quickly), plus Woods and Bardet did get away too.
    Vanendert would've bridged if his teammate had sat on the front of the chase group to peg the gap.
    Not convinced by this, if he had the legs to bridge then surely he'd have had the legs to stay in the top 10
    He closed 25s on the climb, so if the chase had restricted the gap to this he would've made it across. Not saying that he would've won, mind.

    A lot of these late "surges" looked like just that, a one last effort. Im not sure he'd have got across, the gap could have been 25s at the foot of the climb but the effort to get there at that point may have taken the edge or the belief off. Who knows
  • philbar72philbar72 Posts: 2,228
    Vanandaert would probably not have been able to get past in a kick even if he would have closed the gap, also did you see his body shape compared to Jungels, on the various climbs and descents. He wasn’t making it easy for himself, at all…

    Anyway Jungels looks like he will be in form for the giro. Another day or 2 in the Maglia rosa?
  • DeVlaeminckDeVlaeminck Posts: 7,317
    philbar72 wrote:
    Vanandaert would probably not have been able to get past in a kick even if he would have closed the gap, also did you see his body shape compared to Jungels, on the various climbs and descents. He wasn’t making it easy for himself, at all…

    Anyway Jungels looks like he will be in form for the giro. Another day or 2 in the Maglia rosa?


    Body shape...how do you mean ?
    [Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]
  • andypandyp Posts: 8,712
    philbar72 wrote:
    Anyway Jungels looks like he will be in form for the giro. Another day or 2 in the Maglia rosa?

    He's riding the Tour this year, instead of the Giro.
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