Vuelta Stage 15 *Spoilers*

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  • TheBigBean
    TheBigBean Posts: 20,564
    And the point I was making was the Estimated Time of Arrival relies on a pre-race forecast which isn't that reliable even if they adjust it on the morning.

    If it is only to satisfy those points, then I would just make it 1 hour and move on.
  • dish_dash
    dish_dash Posts: 5,558
    Warbasse extolling collective action... https://rouleur.cc/journal/racing/vuelt ... d-time-cut
  • RichN95.
    RichN95. Posts: 27,149
    TheBigBean wrote:
    And the point I was making was the Estimated Time of Arrival relies on a pre-race forecast which isn't that reliable even if they adjust it on the morning.
    But the pattern of the race is a far bigger and more unpredictable factor But by using the ETA as a benchmark it guards against freak stages like Sunday. Had the stage panned out as predicted and the autobus had arrived at exactly the same time (a reasonable 5.20pm) there but have been no issue. So what is the actual difference other than the rigid adherence to a flawed mathematical formula written many years ago?
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • TheBigBean
    TheBigBean Posts: 20,564
    dish_dash wrote:
    Warbasse extolling collective action... https://rouleur.cc/journal/racing/vuelt ... d-time-cut

    So it was an empowering experience.
    I can assure you that if our group rode 20 minutes faster that day, the preceding results would not have changed. The 94 riders would be no more fatigued than we already are. We would, however, be less aware of the power we hold.

    That they didn't know the rules.
    Our group was operating under the pretense that there was a rule that stated if over 60 per cent of the group falls outside of the time limit, they could not be cut. I’m not sure what rider stated it first, but it spread through our group quite quickly, easing everyone’s nerves.
  • dish_dash
    dish_dash Posts: 5,558
    BB, I sense you're not digging the vibe, man...
  • TheBigBean
    TheBigBean Posts: 20,564
    dish_dash wrote:
    BB, I sense you're not digging the vibe, man...

    It's ok. I know my place.
    From the couch, computer chair, or work desk, it’s quite easy to throw out some jabs at us ‘lazy’ riders, especially when hidden behind the screens of televisions, smartphones, and laptops.

    I'd love to use his interpretation of force majeure though in a few legal docs.
  • bobmcstuff
    bobmcstuff Posts: 11,196
    TheBigBean wrote:
    Pross wrote:
    I like Rich's solution. It's logical and fair. If it was blatant rule flaunting then this would happen on every mountain stage. I think some don't realise the effort it takes some riders to get through these stages. Look back at the stage in the Tour where Cavendish just about made the cut and look at the effort it took.

    It relies on a pre-race forecast which doesn't take into account weather or road conditions. For example, I would imagine that estimates in TTs (where riders are riding at their maximum) are several minutes out due to these factors. If you extrapolate this over an entire stage it will result it quite a large fudge factor.

    It would also mean that the 93 were not guilty on Stage 15 which in my opinion is a bit ridiculous.

    Despite larger mountains, longer stages, riding in a small group for a bit and climbing legs worse than any in Vuelta, Cavendish still didn't finish 55 mins behind.

    As I said upthread, if they had missed the cut by a small margin, I'd be much more sympathetic.

    You don't think if the time limit had seemed a bit more plausible they might have ridden harder to make it?

    There's clearly an issue with the time cut formula when it comes to short sharp stages that are raced hard from the gun.
  • bobmcstuff
    bobmcstuff Posts: 11,196
    Sam Bewley made the point on Backstage Pass that on the other stage where the break won by 33 minutes, only 12 riders made the time cut (i.e., the break. I assume he is correct as I CBA to fact check). So for everyone complaining about this, if the rules were rigidly enforced there would only have been 12 riders in the race anyway.
  • RichN95.
    RichN95. Posts: 27,149
    As a final thought - I wonder how many people who complained that rules must be enforced watched the race on an illegal internet stream?
    I saw the Cyclinghub.tv Twitter saying 'what's the point of rules of that are not enforced'. As an IP professional I noted the selective morality.
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • iainf72
    iainf72 Posts: 15,784
    RichN95 wrote:
    As a final thought - I wonder how many people who complained that rules must be enforced watched the race on an illegal internet stream?
    I saw the Cyclinghub.tv Twitter saying 'what's the point of rules of that are not enforced'. As an IP professional I noted the selective morality.

    *chuckle*
    Fckin' Quintana … that creep can roll, man.
  • Richmond Racer 2
    Richmond Racer 2 Posts: 4,698
    RichN95 wrote:
    As a final thought - I wonder how many people who complained that rules must be enforced watched the race on an illegal internet stream?
    I saw the Cyclinghub.tv Twitter saying 'what's the point of rules of that are not enforced'. As an IP professional I noted the selective morality.



    *likes*
  • joelsim
    joelsim Posts: 7,552
    http://velonews.competitor.com/2016/09/ ... 2pZJmOP.03

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