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Parentini Mossa

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  • robbo2011robbo2011 Posts: 1,017
    Interesting review. Just a question, I hope it is not too rude, but what happens to the review samples now? do they stay with you or do you return them?
  • Interesting review. Just a question, I hope it is not too rude, but what happens to the review samples now? do they stay with you or do you return them?

    Not rude at all. It's used now so it gets to stay with me. Which is nice for me, obviously.

    We had a long conversation at the start of the review process about what they were all about. They wanted me to be honest. Indeed, they've already taken my comments about the lack of pocket holes on board for future development. So, when reading, it's important to know that I still have the kit. I suspect that's pretty prevalent on the internet in terms of clothing reviews, though perhaps not hardware.

    I think it's crucially important to review against what the manufacturer claims. If it meets those claims then you can be positive about it. If I can be critical, then I am, see my comments on the Lezyne lights etc. It's all about trust at the end of the day.
    My blog: http://www.roubaixcycling.cc (kit reviews and other musings)
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  • robbo2011robbo2011 Posts: 1,017
    Thanks for the reply. I think it's pretty clear to all that your reviews are honest and open. I was just wondering what happens to the kit, that's all.

    If I may make a comment about the blog. It would be great if more interesting/better pictures could be used in the reviews. At the moment, they don't match the quality of your prose, at least in my opinion. might be something to think about if you want to build it up in the future.
  • Yeah, fair comment, and one I want to address as I go along. It's a tricky one as I want the prose to be real world and don't want to use PR photos if at all possible. Just me and my Galaxy S6 :D But I'll work on it.

    When I lose a stone I may start doing on bike shots :D
    My blog: http://www.roubaixcycling.cc (kit reviews and other musings)
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  • It goes without saying that this is a great review!

    Regarding you using your Mossa in close to or sub-zero temps. I use a Helly Hansen Warm Freeze base layer in these sort of temps. It uses a polypropolene inner and merino outer laminate (Parentini's base layer uses polypropolene too). It fits well under the Mossa and the merino part of the fabric adds a nice layer of warmth, without detriment to the Mossa's technical performance.
  • Thank you very much! I actually have one of those knocking around somewhere. ....
    My blog: http://www.roubaixcycling.cc (kit reviews and other musings)
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  • As censored mentions in his excellent review, key to the Mossa's performance is the fit.

    Because of this, I put together a guide to getting the right size and fit http://parentinitestteam.com/2015/11/06/parentini-mossa-how-to-achieve-the-right-fit-and-size/
  • Yeah, fair comment, and one I want to address as I go along. It's a tricky one as I want the prose to be real world and don't want to use PR photos if at all possible. Just me and my Galaxy S6 :D But I'll work on it.

    When I lose a stone I may start doing on bike shots :D
    Good review, thanks for sharing, I am a Mossa user and do like it alot. been using it all year long.
    as for the photos, why not use official ones? if they suuply you the kit, sure they can supply some shots!

    keep up the good work man.
  • Yeah, fair comment, and one I want to address as I go along. It's a tricky one as I want the prose to be real world and don't want to use PR photos if at all possible. Just me and my Galaxy S6 :D But I'll work on it.

    When I lose a stone I may start doing on bike shots :D
    Good review, thanks for sharing, I am a Mossa user and do like it alot. been using it all year long.
    as for the photos, why not use official ones? if they suuply you the kit, sure they can supply some shots!

    keep up the good work man.

    Theirs are a good representation of the product but I like to ensure you can see what it really looks like. And, thanks!
    My blog: http://www.roubaixcycling.cc (kit reviews and other musings)
    https://twitter.com/roubaixcc
    Facebook? No. Just say no.
  • letap73letap73 Posts: 1,608
    censored ,
    Chapeau on your ability to write reviews, you certainly have a way with words and an ability to express an opinion which real world riders can understand - cycling magazines take note!

    As someone who currently owns a Gabba, Gabba 2 and the Mossa, I personally do not think the Gabba 2 and Mossa are directly comparable in that they work in different temperature ranges - for warmer weather (above 10C) I would favour the Gabba 2 and for below 7C the Mossa is the better option.

    Last winter I alternated between the Mossa and an Alpha jersey - the Assos airjack and ijhabu were both relegated, despite both being very good in their time. The Mossa paired with an appropriate Baselayer - ASSOS interactive layer in my case was sensational in terms of the wide temperature range it would comfortably operate in - the" goldilocks" jacket you alluded to. The Alpha jersey for me did not work as well in terms of temperature range, however, it operated a little better than the Mossa at around 0C. Both perform very well when the conditions are wet and windy.

    Personally I think the Mossa is directly comparable to the Alpha jersey. censored - as I know you are huge fan of the Alpha jersey it would be interesting to see how you compare the two.
  • Thanks letap. It's an interesting one. I wanted, really, to address the myth. As I said I don't think that's Castelli's fault at all. I do blame quite a lot of the cycling press though. I think I could happily survive with the Alpha and Mossa. Indeed, I think I could do without a rain jacket as well. At the moment I need to test a little more extensively at the extremes of temperature and rain. I'm confident the Mossa will breeze the latter, whilst the Castelli works better than claimed to in the wet, I'd definitely trust the Mossa more. So my next test will be to add a slightly heavier base and see how far down in temps I can get. I do have a HH Freeze knocking round somewhere which should work well but I might need to get one with a closer fit.
    My blog: http://www.roubaixcycling.cc (kit reviews and other musings)
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    Facebook? No. Just say no.
  • robbo2011robbo2011 Posts: 1,017
    Last winter I alternated between the Mossa and an Alpha jersey - the Assos airjack and ijhabu were both relegated, despite both being very good in their time. The Mossa paired with an appropriate Baselayer - ASSOS interactive layer in my case was sensational in terms of the wide temperature range it would comfortably operate in - the" goldilocks" jacket you alluded to. The Alpha jersey for me did not work as well in terms of temperature range, however, it operated a little better than the Mossa at around 0C. Both perform very well when the conditions are wet and windy.

    i m going off topic, but your comments about the Airjack chime with me as well. I have also relegated the Airjack to short evening blasts and my short commute as I don't think the performance is as good as the Alpha Jersey (or jacket) on longer rides. Not tried the Mossa but the Alpha Jersey is the stand out winter piece for me.

    The cut and fit of the Airjack is still better than the others though...
  • censored ,
    Chapeau on your ability to write reviews, you certainly have a way with words and an ability to express an opinion which real world riders can understand - cycling magazines take note!

    As someone who currently owns a Gabba, Gabba 2 and the Mossa, I personally do not think the Gabba 2 and Mossa are directly comparable in that they work in different temperature ranges - for warmer weather (above 10C) I would favour the Gabba 2 and for below 7C the Mossa is the better option.

    Last winter I alternated between the Mossa and an Alpha jersey - the Assos airjack and ijhabu were both relegated, despite both being very good in their time. The Mossa paired with an appropriate Baselayer - ASSOS interactive layer in my case was sensational in terms of the wide temperature range it would comfortably operate in - the" goldilocks" jacket you alluded to. The Alpha jersey for me did not work as well in terms of temperature range, however, it operated a little better than the Mossa at around 0C. Both perform very well when the conditions are wet and windy.

    Personally I think the Mossa is directly comparable to the Alpha jersey. censored - as I know you are huge fan of the Alpha jersey it would be interesting to see how you compare the two.

    I think you need to try the Mossa.2 . identical to the Mossa Windtex but with high tech polypropylene fleece. as far as cold weather beater to me it head and shoulders above any, my alpha experience is that it was wet on the inside, it did not breath at all. said that the sweat exportation on the Mossa.2 is slower but that done deliberatly i believe. the Mossa.2 is also waterproof.
  • censored or other longer term mossa users. I was wondering if you could let us all know how the waterproof material fairs after a good amount of use especially after it's been washed - obviously it's not coated like the gabba or pro team jacket, so knowing how well it performs after several washes with normal non bio detergent is a huge selling point. At the moment I spend fortunes on nikwax as I normally wash my jacket after every ride.

    Also, as a side note I noticed Rapha have dropped a new pro team softshell which sounds like it's had a good update with what sounds like a permanent waterproof material - it's tempting but not sure it's worth the extra over the mossa, it does look good though!
  • censored or other longer term mossa users. I was wondering if you could let us all know how the waterproof material fairs after a good amount of use especially after it's been washed - obviously it's not coated like the gabba or pro team jacket, so knowing how well it performs after several washes with normal non bio detergent is a huge selling point. At the moment I spend fortunes on nikwax as I normally wash my jacket after every ride.

    Also, as a side note I noticed Rapha have dropped a new pro team softshell which sounds like it's had a good update with what sounds like a permanent waterproof material - it's tempting but not sure it's worth the extra over the mossa, it does look good though!

    I'll let you know! As to the Rapha, I hated the old one. It's as if they've admitted defeat on it. Just didn't work for me at all. Notice how they've also dropped the taped seams? Not needed if you get the thing right in the first instance.
    My blog: http://www.roubaixcycling.cc (kit reviews and other musings)
    https://twitter.com/roubaixcc
    Facebook? No. Just say no.
  • censored or other longer term mossa users. I was wondering if you could let us all know how the waterproof material fairs after a good amount of use especially after it's been washed - obviously it's not coated like the gabba or pro team jacket, so knowing how well it performs after several washes with normal non bio detergent is a huge selling point. At the moment I spend fortunes on nikwax as I normally wash my jacket after every ride.

    Also, as a side note I noticed Rapha have dropped a new pro team softshell which sounds like it's had a good update with what sounds like a permanent waterproof material - it's tempting but not sure it's worth the extra over the mossa, it does look good though!

    The Mossa has membrane lamination between two outer fabrics, also it is hydro- treated so it has double water resistant element, the membrane does not wear out,i washed mine countless times, no BIO detergent and gentle [email protected] 400. even if the water repellent wears out the Mossa remains waterproof, thats why it beats any other foul weather piece of kit out there.
    Hope that helps.
  • Thanks Clincher - this alone makes it a massive selling point as I'll probably save about £200 a year if I don't have to buy nikwax every month!

    Now do I buy the short sleeve and some k dry arm warmers so that it can be used in some spring classic races or do I just go for the long sleeve version as it'll probably spend most of it's time paired with arm warmers anyway and use a short sleeve gabba for the races if it's too cold for a race jersey?

    Size wise I can just get away with a medium from the sizing chart although I'm worried about it being quite short and unfortunately nowhere close to me stock it. I have an old size pro team jacket in large which is far too big for me.
  • PTestTeamPTestTeam Posts: 395
    Thanks Clincher - this alone makes it a massive selling point as I'll probably save about £200 a year if I don't have to buy nikwax every month!

    Now do I buy the short sleeve and some k dry arm warmers so that it can be used in some spring classic races or do I just go for the long sleeve version as it'll probably spend most of it's time paired with arm warmers anyway and use a short sleeve gabba for the races if it's too cold for a race jersey?

    Size wise I can just get away with a medium from the sizing chart although I'm worried about it being quite short and unfortunately nowhere close to me stock it. I have an old size pro team jacket in large which is far too big for me.

    Why would you use armwarmers with a long sleeve jersey? What some guys do is buy the short sleeve version, and use the K Dry arm warmers with a long sleeve base layer. This might be more flexible for you.

    Target Coaching in Glasgow are a Parentini dealer http://parentinitestteam.com/parentini-dealers/

    Also, do you know that the Mossa can be printed in your club or team's kit design? That way you can race using it. A minimum of 5 orders for them, if you can get enough team mates interested. Custom clothing is orders through [email protected]
  • I meant if I bought the short sleeve it would spend most of it's time paired with arm warmers anyway so it's probably not the right way to do it if I want the most waterproof solution.

    I'll give Iain at Target Coaching a shout to see if he has any in stock that I can try. A club member I ride with has a medium but he works shifts with the police so it's been impossible to try his on so far.

    I did read about it on the Parentini site - it's definitely interesting and I think there's a club order going through for kit at the moment but not including jackets, I'll see if I can get any interest before I order mine in black. How does it work with pricing and order sizes?
  • Thanks Clincher - this alone makes it a massive selling point as I'll probably save about £200 a year if I don't have to buy nikwax every month!

    Now do I buy the short sleeve and some k dry arm warmers so that it can be used in some spring classic races or do I just go for the long sleeve version as it'll probably spend most of it's time paired with arm warmers anyway and use a short sleeve gabba for the races if it's too cold for a race jersey?

    Size wise I can just get away with a medium from the sizing chart although I'm worried about it being quite short and unfortunately nowhere close to me stock it. I have an old size pro team jacket in large which is far too big for me.

    I would recommend Short sleeves and Paretini K Dry Arm warmers, its versatile and can be used in spring and early Winter.
    for very cold weather i use the Mossa.2.
    two garments and i done done for Winter wardrobe.
  • PTestTeamPTestTeam Posts: 395
    I meant if I bought the short sleeve it would spend most of it's time paired with arm warmers anyway so it's probably not the right way to do it if I want the most waterproof solution.

    I'll give Iain at Target Coaching a shout to see if he has any in stock that I can try. A club member I ride with has a medium but he works shifts with the police so it's been impossible to try his on so far.

    I did read about it on the Parentini site - it's definitely interesting and I think there's a club order going through for kit at the moment but not including jackets, I'll see if I can get any interest before I order mine in black. How does it work with pricing and order sizes?

    If you contact Ali at [email protected], he can give you all the info, pricing etc you need if you want to go down the club custom route
  • Just waiting to commute home, need to pick a time when the heavens open..............
    My blog: http://www.roubaixcycling.cc (kit reviews and other musings)
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  • veronese68veronese68 Posts: 24,583 Lives Here
    Just waiting to commute home, need to pick a time when the heavens open..............
    That's dedication for you.
    How come I've not noticed your blog before? It's a good one.
  • I've had a Mossa for nearly a year now. I've only tried on the gabba and alpha in shops. I'd agree with nearly everything censored says in his review.

    Essentially, the Mossa is a no frills race cut design made from a technical material. The gabba and alpha on the other hand have more detailing in terms of differing fabric thicknesses, zipped pockets, drainage holes etc.

    For me the material works very well. It is windproof, and breathable, and mostly waterproof. Unlike censored I do get some water ingress around the seems in heavy rain. I think my water repellent has worn off as water no longer 'beads up' and runs off the jacket, however it's still waterproof.

    For a zone 2/3 ride over 10 degrees I tend to only wear it if raining, and I'll pair it with vest. Between 5-10 degrees I'll put a thin wicking long sleeve base-layer on. Below 5 degrees I'll go to a thicker baselayer. Once it gets to around zero I go to my bontrager winter jacket.

    If i'm doing a ride with family or a club run which may involve long stops (zone 1/2) I tend to move those temperatures up 5 degrees.

    It is the material that really makes the mossa though. The fit is also good, but whilst some of this can be attributed to the cut, it is also down to teh stretchy nature of the material (not found in wind-stopper or goretex). I wear this jacket for 90% of my winter training, however I think it could be improved with a simple zip pocket and a flap covering the front zip.

    Essentially, like censored points out, there is no miracle jacket. If you sweat, not matter how breathable your waterproof claims to be, it won't dry out as fast as your summer jersey at 20 degrees.
  • Thanks Veroness and Thomas.

    I've updated my review slightly following last night's commute. I get no seam ingress, yet, and, as thomas says this might happen when the DWR wears out.

    One thing I've fed back to Parentini today is the left sleeve. The black stripe is a stiched in piece of extra but additional material. So it creates two additional seams which may mean more ingress. The left arm is continous and the seam is "round the back" so that arm is much better protected because the material is 100% waterproof.

    They've already taken my comments on board so I hope to see Mossa.ver 3 (not to be confsued with Mossa.2 which is the winter version of current Mossa) do away with that stripe. As I say it's not actually problematic but, given that it is design only, can be jettisoned.
    My blog: http://www.roubaixcycling.cc (kit reviews and other musings)
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  • flasherflasher Posts: 1,731
    I like the look of the asymmetric design, I may have to buy one!
  • Have to say, 5-6 degrees today. Craft base layer for a bit more warmth. I love this thing. Just love it.
    My blog: http://www.roubaixcycling.cc (kit reviews and other musings)
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    Facebook? No. Just say no.
  • PTestTeamPTestTeam Posts: 395
    Thanks Veroness and Thomas.

    I've updated my review slightly following last night's commute. I get no seam ingress, yet, and, as thomas says this might happen when the DWR wears out.

    One thing I've fed back to Parentini today is the left sleeve. The black stripe is a stiched in piece of extra but additional material. So it creates two additional seams which may mean more ingress. The left arm is continous and the seam is "round the back" so that arm is much better protected because the material is 100% waterproof.

    They've already taken my comments on board so I hope to see Mossa.ver 3 (not to be confsued with Mossa.2 which is the winter version of current Mossa) do away with that stripe. As I say it's not actually problematic but, given that it is design only, can be jettisoned.

    I've just recently treated my year old my Mossa with NikWax Wash and TX.Direct just to add that extra level of protection of DWR. It's like new again. Superb stuff and all easily done int he washing machine.

    Just make sure you look after the Mossa and it should look after you. http://parentinitestteam.com/2015/07/30/caring-for-your-cycle-clothing/
  • meanredspidermeanredspider Posts: 12,337
    So the Lusso Aqua Repel is made of the same material as the Mossa by a UK company and includes a zipped pocket. Why wouldn't one buy one of these (£116) rather than the Mossa?

    https://www.merlincycles.com/lusso-aqua-repel-cycling-jacket-85405.html

    Interesting on the review. The company I used to work for gave people products to test to build a good reputation. Testers tend to believe they are being harder on the product but, in fact, give better scores than the general public who have bought the product. It's an interesting dynamic.
    ROAD < Scott Foil HMX Di2, Volagi Liscio Di2, Jamis Renegade Elite Di2, Cube Reaction Race > ROUGH
  • Well, you'd have to test them back to back to come up with any opinions definitely I guess. There's more to it than the material itself. Fit and quality is important.

    In terms of bias, it's up to you to decide what to believe. But, the thing is, I'm about to leave for work again. I have a wardrobe full of stuff. Yet, even though today will be dry, I'm taking the Mossa again. Indeed, you'll see, from the classifieds, that I even sold my rain coat as I didn't perceive a need for it anymore.

    Lusso's own website appears to be down at the moment, would be nice to see some other pics. There are some good reviews on twitter as well of it.
    My blog: http://www.roubaixcycling.cc (kit reviews and other musings)
    https://twitter.com/roubaixcc
    Facebook? No. Just say no.
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