headset issue gt halfords bike

spenand
spenand Posts: 11
edited July 2014 in MTB workshop & tech
Hi

I purchased a GT agressor 3 from halfords a few years ago. was a good spec but didn't last too well.

anyway i have used it for spares and now want to get it running again so need parts. GT won't help at all, it wasn't even made by them apparantly.

my issue is the headset, not sure what happened but forks/handle bar were all of a sudden loose in the front of the frame a bit where forks go. i took apart and i think ball bearings had gone missing. so i tried a spare from my trax bike but it must be the wrong size and it still feels loose. you can see in picture, looks ok but i must need bigger ball bearing ring
do i need new stem or just ball bearing ring thing? top and bottom.

measurements are as follows:
top of frame width 2inch
tube width where ball bearing ring goes 1 5/8 inches
top of fork width 1 1/8 inches

pics hopefully attached

https://www.flickr.com/photos/125052299@N06/

Comments

  • cooldad
    cooldad Posts: 32,599
    Pics of all the bits might help, or read Parktools to set up/adjust properly.
    I don't do smileys.

    There is no secret ingredient - Kung Fu Panda

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    Parktools
  • spenand
    spenand Posts: 11
    i thought i was being very helpful with those measurements and pics!

    i am no bike pro this is about as good as it gets!

    its just as if that ball bearing ring doesn't come in enough so the fork sits tight up against it
  • The Rookie
    The Rookie Posts: 27,812
    So how did you build it up, did you tighten the bolts holding the stem to the steerer before to the top cap which preloads the bearings?

    the bearings can't fall out until you undo it all.....probably just needed a 30 second adjustment.

    Loose ball headsets only use one size in 99.9% of cases.

    Sounds like the problem is the nut holding the spanner! :wink:
    Currently riding a Whyte T130C, X0 drivetrain, Magura Trail brakes converted to mixed wheel size (homebuilt wheels) with 140mm Fox 34 Rhythm and RP23 suspension. 12.2Kg.
  • spenand
    spenand Posts: 11
    edited June 2014
    lol

    quite simple they is an allen key for top of stem, undid that, then allen key which scres into top of fork or something i guess. and that was it all just comes apart, fork drops out bottom, does that sound right? yes BOTH allen keys bolts were tight!

    the parts i need are £100 to get it going again not really including this stem issue.

    i don't want to buy the other parts if there is no point.

    if those ball bearing rings only come in one size something is seriously a miss!
  • photonic69
    photonic69 Posts: 2,410


    Sometimes. Maybe. Possibly.

  • spenand
    spenand Posts: 11
    mm...

    so the bearings don't touch the fork.

    i'm sure i have all those parts fitted

    the compression ring isn't it eh best of shape just a piece of plastic really

    if the bearings are just one size i am pretty confused what has gone wrong.
  • cooldad
    cooldad Posts: 32,599
    Read Parktools.
    I don't do smileys.

    There is no secret ingredient - Kung Fu Panda

    London Calling on Facebook

    Parktools
  • The Rookie
    The Rookie Posts: 27,812
    edited July 2014
    Insert bearings in cups (held in by the grease that will lubricate them), insert fork, fit top cap and centring ring, fit spacers, fit stem but DO NOT do up retaining bolts, check the steerer is at least 3mm below top of stem, fit top cap and bolt, do up bolt until there is no play in the bearings but not so tight the bars don't turn freely, finally do up stem bolts to stop it turning on the steerer.
    Currently riding a Whyte T130C, X0 drivetrain, Magura Trail brakes converted to mixed wheel size (homebuilt wheels) with 140mm Fox 34 Rhythm and RP23 suspension. 12.2Kg.
  • spenand
    spenand Posts: 11
    the only think i know is there is the fork and cups, i havent touched those.

    after that anything could be missing really, top or bottom.

    will a new headset have everything? including bottom part?

    guessing the cups are ok of course
  • cooldad
    cooldad Posts: 32,599
    Pobably but if you read Parktools, or the link above, you'll have an actual name for the various bits - bottom part might not mean to you what it means to me.
    I don't do smileys.

    There is no secret ingredient - Kung Fu Panda

    London Calling on Facebook

    Parktools
  • spenand
    spenand Posts: 11
    ok i have the ball bearing and crown race for bottom of fork

    for top i have ball bearing, top race, compression ring, spacers, top cap and bolt.

    start nut is in the fork

    the frame with cups haven't been taken apart, and the forks haven't been taken apart.
  • The Rookie
    The Rookie Posts: 27,812
    Nothing goes on the bottom of the fork, it all goes on the steerer.....want to start again?
    Currently riding a Whyte T130C, X0 drivetrain, Magura Trail brakes converted to mixed wheel size (homebuilt wheels) with 140mm Fox 34 Rhythm and RP23 suspension. 12.2Kg.
  • photonic69
    photonic69 Posts: 2,410
    Stop being such a pedant, Rookie.

    Spenand - what you said seems correct and as per picture link. When the stem is on the steerer is there a gap of at least 2-3mm from top of stem to top of steerer? If so, still keeping stem bolts LOOSE tighten up bolt on top cap until all play is taken up and steerer/forks turn smoothly in head tube and bearings. When happy set stem straight over front wheel and tighten stem bolts.


    Sometimes. Maybe. Possibly.

  • spenand
    spenand Posts: 11
    ok

    i have done that. no improvement

    the parts i have are:
    ball bearing and crown race for bottom of steerer
    ball bearing and top race and compression ring for top of steerer

    i'll tell you exactly what happens. if i put the breaks on the handles bars move forard a few mm

    headset bearing adjustment seems to decribe my problem on park tools

    but i can't lossen or tighten my race's they are just light plastic washers?
  • supersonic
    supersonic Posts: 82,708
    Are you using the top bolt to adjust the bearings while the stem bolts are loose?
  • The Rookie
    The Rookie Posts: 27,812
    Your races are not light plastic washers - you've already said you have balls, photos I think!
    Currently riding a Whyte T130C, X0 drivetrain, Magura Trail brakes converted to mixed wheel size (homebuilt wheels) with 140mm Fox 34 Rhythm and RP23 suspension. 12.2Kg.
  • spenand
    spenand Posts: 11
    I am using the top bolt to adjust wuth handle bars loose
  • supersonic
    supersonic Posts: 82,708
    You don't loosen the bars. You loosen the stem/steerer clamp bolts.
  • cooldad
    cooldad Posts: 32,599
    I think that's what he means.
    Picture of all the various odd sounding bits would help.
    I don't do smileys.

    There is no secret ingredient - Kung Fu Panda

    London Calling on Facebook

    Parktools
  • spenand
    spenand Posts: 11
    Hopefully this has everything needed only comment to make is lower bearing ring already in is havent taken cups out.

    This is all parts with top nut tight


    https://www.flickr.com/gp/125052299@N06/Nfvhc7
  • cooldad
    cooldad Posts: 32,599
    edited July 2014
    That's a bunch of random pictures. But as one of the bearings obviously has a bunch of balls missing that's not going to work very well.

    Can't even see if the crown race is fitted.
    How about laying the bits out all in one pic?

    Or just buy a new headset - probably a tenner from Halfords.
    I don't do smileys.

    There is no secret ingredient - Kung Fu Panda

    London Calling on Facebook

    Parktools
  • spenand
    spenand Posts: 11
    That is all the bits fit the headset like i said excluding bottom bearing

    So im trying to establish if all is there.

    I now fitting is correct as i have followed guides
  • photonic69
    photonic69 Posts: 2,410


    Sometimes. Maybe. Possibly.

  • cooldad
    cooldad Posts: 32,599
    spenand wrote:
    That is all the bits fit the headset like i said excluding bottom bearing

    So im trying to establish if all is there.

    I now fitting is correct as i have followed guides
    How do you know it's fitted correctly if you don't know if you have all the bits?
    I don't do smileys.

    There is no secret ingredient - Kung Fu Panda

    London Calling on Facebook

    Parktools
  • cooldad
    cooldad Posts: 32,599
    PhotoNic69 wrote:
    If you do, throw the grease away.
    I don't do smileys.

    There is no secret ingredient - Kung Fu Panda

    London Calling on Facebook

    Parktools