Wiggins selfish

245

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  • slowbikeslowbike Posts: 8,346
    Hadn't Froome already announced that he wasn't on form? Why bury yourself, risk crashing a breaking bones, for someone who is unlikely to win anyway...
  • salsiccia1salsiccia1 Posts: 3,236
    slowbike wrote:
    Hadn't Froome already announced that he wasn't on form? Why bury yourself, risk crashing a breaking bones, for someone who is unlikely to win anyway...

    For queen and country, mun. Keep up.
    It's only a bit of sport, Mun. Relax and enjoy the racing.
  • The most embarrassing thing about the Worlds however is that the British team is unable to ride well in the rain, WTF! Those conditions tradtionally would have been described as favourable to the Brits I would have thought. The average keen UK cyclist does more grim weather riding than our European colleagues by virtue of the fact our weather is on the whole worse. And does'nt Wiggo live in Yorkshire or Lancashire, where there is lots of hills and it rains a lot? Does he abort and get his wife to come and pick him up if it rains? He needs to man up. On the other hand it does give me a crumb of comfort that although he would crush me in any other aspect of cycling I can safely say I am a better descender than Brad if there is even a hint of rain.

    Just because you hold the passport of a place and have a house in an area with a particular type of climate it doesnt mean anything. I mean there was a joke a few years back that Rabobank were distinctly censored in crosswinds, always missing the split, which was hilarious when you consider that it is impossible to ride anywhere in the Netherlands with no wind (apart from on 2 or 3 weird days of the year).

    Your whole argument is simply reductive. I grew up somewhere with ramps between 10-20%, I am not J-Rod. I grew up somewhere with no mountains yet I can spin away for hours up a mountain. I ride now on pan-flat roads in lots of wind but I haven't magically become a rouleur putting out big numbers as that would involve growing half a metre and putting on 30-40kg. I grew up somewhere with rain. Everytime I spend any period of time riding in the rain no matter what I wear I end up with a UTI.

    Everyone is different and reacts differently to different types of conditions. Apparently Heinrich Haussler loves the freezing cold, a man who grew up in Australia, while Thor Hushovd hates it, a man who grew up in Norway.
    Correlation is not causation.
  • slowbikeslowbike Posts: 8,346
    salsiccia1 wrote:
    slowbike wrote:
    Hadn't Froome already announced that he wasn't on form? Why bury yourself, risk crashing a breaking bones, for someone who is unlikely to win anyway...

    For queen and country, mun. Keep up.

    Do you think that's what Froome was saying to Wiggo?! ;)
  • slowbike wrote:
    salsiccia1 wrote:
    slowbike wrote:
    Hadn't Froome already announced that he wasn't on form? Why bury yourself, risk crashing a breaking bones, for someone who is unlikely to win anyway...

    For queen and country, mun. Keep up.

    Do you think that's what Froome was saying to Wiggo?! ;)


    Dont think Froome got a chance to be close enough to him to say it!
  • RichN95.RichN95. Posts: 22,547
    Everyone is different and reacts differently to different types of conditions. Apparently Heinrich Haussler loves the freezing cold, a man who grew up in Australia, while Thor Hushovd hates it, a man who grew up in Norway.
    The strange ones were always Armstrong and Ullrich - the one from baking hot Texas hated the heat and loved the cold and rain while the one from windswept Baltic Coast (and a ginger to boot) loved the heat but hated the rain and cold.
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • The most embarrassing thing about the Worlds however is that the British team is unable to ride well in the rain, WTF! Those conditions tradtionally would have been described as favourable to the Brits I would have thought. The average keen UK cyclist does more grim weather riding than our European colleagues by virtue of the fact our weather is on the whole worse. And does'nt Wiggo live in Yorkshire or Lancashire, where there is lots of hills and it rains a lot? Does he abort and get his wife to come and pick him up if it rains? He needs to man up. On the other hand it does give me a crumb of comfort that although he would crush me in any other aspect of cycling I can safely say I am a better descender than Brad if there is even a hint of rain.

    Just because you hold the passport of a place and have a house in an area with a particular type of climate it doesnt mean anything. I mean there was a joke a few years back that Rabobank were distinctly censored in crosswinds, always missing the split, which was hilarious when you consider that it is impossible to ride anywhere in the Netherlands with no wind (apart from on 2 or 3 weird days of the year).

    Your whole argument is simply reductive. I grew up somewhere with ramps between 10-20%, I am not J-Rod. I grew up somewhere with no mountains yet I can spin away for hours up a mountain. I ride now on pan-flat roads in lots of wind but I haven't magically become a rouleur putting out big numbers as that would involve growing half a metre and putting on 30-40kg. I grew up somewhere with rain. Everytime I spend any period of time riding in the rain no matter what I wear I end up with a UTI.

    Everyone is different and reacts differently to different types of conditions. Apparently Heinrich Haussler loves the freezing cold, a man who grew up in Australia, while Thor Hushovd hates it, a man who grew up in Norway.

    Fair enough point taken, riders have their preferences, and maybe I'm wrong but its just my opinion BC as a team should be able to deal with rain a bit better than they did. I think it just looked worse as they got the tactics wrong. Sky may have the Grand Tour strategy down but the Worlds was another example that their approach to 1 day races needs work.
  • dougzzdougzz Posts: 1,833
    ddraver wrote:
    (I think DV was genuinely making a joke there RR ;) I hope so anyway, we don't need a second forum ars*
    Unsure whether your counting is a bit moody or your just super tolerant.
  • knedlickyknedlicky Posts: 3,097
    The most embarrassing thing about the Worlds however is that the British team is unable to ride well in the rain, WTF! Those conditions tradtionally would have been described as favourable to the Brits I would have thought.
    Just because you hold the passport of a place and have a house in an area with a particular type of climate it doesnt mean anything.
    Everyone is different and reacts differently to different types of conditions. Apparently Heinrich Haussler loves the freezing cold, a man who grew up in Australia, while Thor Hushovd hates it, a man who grew up in Norway.
    I know I’m being picky, ATC, because I think your general argument is right, but Haussler and Hushovd aren’t the best examples because Haussler went to Germany in 1999, when 15 years old, and all his next 5 years of formative cycling were then in central Europe where the average daily temperature is below freezing for 3 months of each year, while southern Norway, where Hushovd comes from, actually has a milder climate than central Europe.

    One of the things not mentioned about Brits being poor in rain on the Continent, is the possible psychological influence of the road surface. Road surfaces in the UK are generally rougher than those on the Continent, and faced with smoother wet surfaces abroad, the slight sense of security perhaps felt on rougher UK roads is then missing?
  • knedlickyknedlicky Posts: 3,097
    slowbike wrote:
    Hadn't Froome already announced that he wasn't on form? Why bury yourself, risk crashing a breaking bones, for someone who is unlikely to win anyway...
    I don’t know if Froome said shortly in advance of the RR that he wasn’t in form, but at one stage before the WC I heard he'd declared himself as one of the favourites, and his taking part at the USA Pro Challenge was supposedly training specifically directed at the RR.
  • knedlicky wrote:
    One of the things not mentioned about Brits being poor in rain on the Continent, is the possible psychological influence of the road surface. Road surfaces in the UK are generally rougher than those on the Continent, and faced with smoother wet surfaces abroad, the slight sense of security perhaps felt on rougher UK roads is then missing?

    I wonder if Wiggo suffers from having been a trackie for most of his formative years, which gave him the option of training indoors when the weather is cr*p. Whilst surviving hours in the freezing cold and rain is excellent preparation for a career on the road, there are no particular benefits from such conditions for riding on the track, and the temptation to stay inside and do a session on the boards, rollers or turbo would be overwhelming, one might think.
  • Le CommentateurLe Commentateur Posts: 4,174
    edited October 2013
    :lol:

    These guys are pros who are based on the continent, not some club cyclist on a once-a-year trip. Might as well suggest WIggins is better at left turns because he's a former trackie.

    Wiggins ticked a lot of boxes last year and the pressure to do more in order to reap publicity and income from it must be enormous, especially as he's heading into the latter stage of his racing career. A crash that wipes out his season or becoming a domestique for Froome aren't what his PR people need.
  • :lol:

    These guys are pros who are based on the continent, not some club cyclist on a once-a-year trip. Might as well suggest WIggins is better at left turns because he's a former trackie.

    So why is he so censored at descending in the wet?

    Does he lack the "Descending in the wet" gene or is he technically deficient? Not everyone can handle a bike like Sagan, but (pretty much) all pros can descend in the wet to a comparable level except Sir Brad. When such deficiencies cost you any chance you have of winning a GT that you have stated is your target for the season, then it's legitimate to ask questions.
  • ddraverddraver Posts: 19,288
    :lol:

    These guys are pros who are based on the continent, not some club cyclist on a once-a-year trip. Might as well suggest WIggins is better at left turns because he's a former trackie.

    So why is he so censored at descending in the wet?

    Does he lack the "Descending in the wet" gene or is he technically deficient? Not everyone can handle a bike like Sagan, but (pretty much) all pros can descend in the wet to a comparable level except Sir Brad. When such deficiencies cost you any chance you have of winning a GT that you have stated is your target for the season, then it's legitimate to ask questions.

    Ah so, it was that and not the knee injury or the virus now??

    Seriously the Clinic will be looking at this thread and rolling their eyes and some of the rubbish on here...
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • FleshTuxedoFleshTuxedo Posts: 2,121
    :lol:

    These guys are pros who are based on the continent, not some club cyclist on a once-a-year trip. Might as well suggest WIggins is better at left turns because he's a former trackie.

    So why is he so censored at descending in the wet?

    Does he lack the "Descending in the wet" gene or is he technically deficient? Not everyone can handle a bike like Sagan, but (pretty much) all pros can descend in the wet to a comparable level except Sir Brad. When such deficiencies cost you any chance you have of winning a GT that you have stated is your target for the season, then it's legitimate to ask questions.

    It's a mental thing innit, compare Pineau's descending on TDF and then a couple of months later at Vuelta.
  • ddraver wrote:
    Ah so, it was that and not the knee injury or the virus now??

    Seriously the Clinic will be looking at this thread and rolling their eyes and some of the rubbish on here...

    Wiggins initially lost time on a wet descent, which came before the ITT where he was very competitive and apparently amongst the fastest on the uphill section, so he was physically sound early on in the Giro. I doubt he was anywhere near 2012 form, but he certainly wasn't going badly at all.

    The illness probably did come later - cycling for hours in the rain is notoriously bad for your health - and the knee injury may well be a convenient excuse, but the initial problem Wiggo had in the Giro was descending in the wet. You're not seriously trying to claim that he's not bad at this discipline are you?
  • ddraverddraver Posts: 19,288
    The only reason I am not writing a expletive filled Shouty rant about the utter inanity of 99% the Wiggins/Worlds discussions over the last week is because I'm at work and the keyboard isnt mine, but that's the only reason...

    Seriously, A team that has smashed all of it's season goals rocks up at a race it has zero chance of winning and performs badly and we re all surprised?

    Christ, Holly Willoughby must BLOW YOUR F**CKING MINDS every Saturday night!
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • Coach HCoach H Posts: 1,287
    The average keen UK cyclist does more grim weather riding than our European colleagues by virtue of the fact our weather is on the whole worse. And does'nt Wiggo live in Yorkshire or Lancashire, where there is lots of hills and it rains a lot? Does he abort and get his wife to come and pick him up if it rains? He needs to man up.

    Interesting as I seem to remember this forum discussing a photo of Wiggins training this winter in the rain where some were commenting on how fat he looked. Guess you had to be around then.
    Coach H. (Dont ask me for training advice - 'It's not about the bike')
  • Coach H wrote:
    Interesting as I seem to remember this forum discussing a photo of Wiggins training this winter in the rain where some were commenting on how fat he looked. Guess you had to be around then.

    Maybe the forecast was wrong that day. :D
  • trek_dantrek_dan Posts: 1,366
    ddraver wrote:
    Seriously, A team that has smashed all of it's season goals rocks up at a race it has zero chance of winning and performs badly and we re all surprised?
    What he said
  • adr82adr82 Posts: 4,002
    knedlicky wrote:
    One of the things not mentioned about Brits being poor in rain on the Continent, is the possible psychological influence of the road surface. Road surfaces in the UK are generally rougher than those on the Continent, and faced with smoother wet surfaces abroad, the slight sense of security perhaps felt on rougher UK roads is then missing?
    That's a good point. I thought while watching the earlier events that the road on the WC circuit would be incredibly slick in the wet, and I'm damn sure I'd have been more careful than normal on it!
  • ddraver wrote:
    Seriously, A team that has smashed all of it's season goals rocks up at a race it has zero chance of winning and performs badly and we re all surprised?

    The team didn't perform at all. They all (other than Froome) drifted or shot to the back at the first sign of pressure up front (Cav and Rowe to be expected) after which Froome gave up, despite the rest of the race offering plenty of evidence that a committed "lone raider" could still be prominent until the closing stages.

    It's the wholesale "giving up" or inability to deal with the terrain that seems to be the cause of the debate, not the lack of success. Wiggo had a harder build up to the 2011 Worlds than this year and was still able to do a massive turn on the last lap in accordance with the Cav masterplan. This year, he was out with the washing after the first descent.
  • Daz555Daz555 Posts: 4,040
    On the other hand it does give me a crumb of comfort that although he would crush me in any other aspect of cycling I can safely say I am a better descender than Brad if there is even a hint of rain.
    There is half a chance you might be better in a wet corner than Wiggo, but what about all the pedally downhill bits inbetween? He'd destroy you.
    You only need two tools: WD40 and Duck Tape.
    If it doesn't move and should, use the WD40.
    If it shouldn't move and does, use the tape.
  • slowbikeslowbike Posts: 8,346
    slowbike wrote:
    salsiccia1 wrote:
    slowbike wrote:
    Hadn't Froome already announced that he wasn't on form? Why bury yourself, risk crashing a breaking bones, for someone who is unlikely to win anyway...

    For queen and country, mun. Keep up.

    Do you think that's what Froome was saying to Wiggo?! ;)


    Dont think Froome got a chance to be close enough to him to say it!

    Good move on Wiggo's part then! :mrgreen:
  • knedlicky wrote:
    I know I’m being picky, ATC, because I think your general argument is right, but Haussler and Hushovd aren’t the best examples because Haussler went to Germany in 1999, when 15 years old, and all his next 5 years of formative cycling were then in central Europe where the average daily temperature is below freezing for 3 months of each year, while southern Norway, where Hushovd comes from, actually has a milder climate than central Europe.

    Aye, fair enough, it was the only example I could think of, off the top of my head, Rich had a better one with Lance and Ulle.
    knedlicky wrote:
    One of the things not mentioned about Brits being poor in rain on the Continent, is the possible psychological influence of the road surface. Road surfaces in the UK are generally rougher than those on the Continent, and faced with smoother wet surfaces abroad, the slight sense of security perhaps felt on rougher UK roads is then missing?

    Hmmm good point. I did remark on the time how new that road surface was, it was very shiny slick. It didn't use to be. The roads around Fiesole used to be bloody awful, much like many British roads in fact, but I digress.
    ddraver wrote:
    Christ, Holly Willoughby must BLOW YOUR F**CKING MINDS every Saturday night!

    Who's Holly Willoughby? And what am I missing out on?
    Correlation is not causation.
  • RichN95.RichN95. Posts: 22,547

    Who's Holly Willoughby? And what am I missing out on?
    Boobs mostly.
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • RichN95 wrote:

    Who's Holly Willoughby? And what am I missing out on?
    Boobs mostly.

    I can just look down for those and well... meh. :|
    Correlation is not causation.
  • ddraverddraver Posts: 19,288
    RichN95 wrote:

    Who's Holly Willoughby? And what am I missing out on?
    Boobs mostly.

    ITV are flogging the Surprise Surprise Horse again, Holly is presenting. Appears to be an hour of stuff to make my Aunt and housemate cry...
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • ProssPross Posts: 21,040
    Not saying it has happened to Bard but people's nerve does go. I used to love hammering down hills as fast as possible and never thought of the consequences of a sheep running out or a milk tanker pulling out of a farm entrance when I was doing 50mph. After a break from riding I cam back more cautious and recently I've been getting dropped on narrow descents as I've completely lost my nerve following a high speed racing crash and being involved with a race where someone was killed - I get really nervous watching friends hurtling downhill when I'm thinking a car could come the other way at any moment and there's no way to miss them. So who knows what little voices of doubt are in Wiggins head? Alternatively maybe he is just getting his own back for what he feels was Froome trying to stab him in the back / embarrass him at last year's Tour.
  • ProssPross Posts: 21,040
    ddraver wrote:
    RichN95 wrote:

    Who's Holly Willoughby? And what am I missing out on?
    Boobs mostly.

    ITV are flogging the Surprise Surprise Horse again, Holly is presenting. Appears to be an hour of stuff to make my Aunt and housemate cry...

    and grown men dribble like everything else she presents!
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