Cav and Tour de San Luis

Richmond Racer
Richmond Racer Posts: 8,561
edited January 2013 in Pro race
Apparently Cav's taking Boonen's place at the Tour de San Luis next month, instead of starting his season in Qatar.

That's a bit hilly for Cav for first race of the year, innit? Read a few days ago that he'd be skipping Oman after Qatar as the Oman parcours is hillier than last year.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/cavendi ... e-san-luis
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  • Yellow Peril
    Yellow Peril Posts: 4,466
    Richmond Racer wrote:
    Apparently Cav's taking Boonen's place at the Tour de San Luis next month, instead of starting his season in Qatar.

    That's a bit hilly for Cav for first race of the year, innit? Read a few days ago that he'd be skipping Oman after Qatar as the Oman parcours is hillier than last year.

    http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/cavendi ... e-san-luis


    Maybe he's starting his GT jersey prep early and feels that if he is going to compete with the likes of sagan he's going to have to climb better.
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  • Richmond Racer
    Richmond Racer Posts: 8,561
    Interesting possibility...
  • The_Slowboat
    The_Slowboat Posts: 30
    Tour wise you'd think OPQS just won't be allowing Sagan anywhere near the breakaway given the intermediates he hoovered up this year, but going off the tour profile is the risk of elimination in the mountains increased?
  • Richmond Racer
    Richmond Racer Posts: 8,561
    I'm gonna put it out there now: although the cycling world seems to have decided that Sagan is the Second Coming (including Sagan himself who claimed in a recent interview that no one can beat him), he has to follow up on 2012. Let's see him back it up.

    There's one thing about Cav: since and incl 2008, year on year he produces without fail especially in the Tour.
  • Yellow Peril
    Yellow Peril Posts: 4,466
    Richmond Racer wrote:
    I'm gonna put it out there now: although the cycling world seems to have decided that Sagan is the Second Coming (including Sagan himself who claimed in a recent interview that no one can beat him), he has to follow up on 2012. Let's see him back it up.

    There's one thing about Cav: since and incl 2008, year on year he produces without fail especially in the Tour.

    Agreed again but I think it is fair to say Sagan climbs a bit better than Cav but I don't think you can beat the Manxman for tenacity.
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  • Paul 8v
    Paul 8v Posts: 5,458
    Sagan is definitely a better climber but if they both get to the finishing straight at the same time my money would be on Cav
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  • sherer
    sherer Posts: 2,460
    Richmond Racer wrote:
    I'm gonna put it out there now: although the cycling world seems to have decided that Sagan is the Second Coming (including Sagan himself who claimed in a recent interview that no one can beat him), he has to follow up on 2012. Let's see him back it up.

    There's one thing about Cav: since and incl 2008, year on year he produces without fail especially in the Tour.

    Don't forget Sagan has been improving year on year too. Not sure if he can do it but would be interesting to see if he tries to become a Grand Tour winner too. he's got a long way to go but I feel he could do it
  • prawny
    prawny Posts: 5,439
    Had sagan claimed to be a top tier sprinter? Watching the highlights of the tour on eurosport the other night it was pretty obvious in a flat sprint he couldn't beat the top guys, his points came from gilbert/valverde (spit) type finishes and intermediates

    Might have got the wrong end of the stick from previous posts though.
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  • blazing_saddles
    blazing_saddles Posts: 21,811
    Cav gets season starter San Luis, while Boonan gets his favourite, pan flat Qatar.
    Mmmm, I wonder how long it will be before the cracks appear?
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  • LeicesterLad
    LeicesterLad Posts: 3,908
    Blazing Saddles wrote:
    Cav gets season starter San Luis, while Boonan gets his favourite, pan flat Qatar.
    Mmmm, I wonder how long it will be before the cracks appear?

    Was thinking the same but didn't want to say it. Is this a glimpse as to who's wearing the trousers at OPQS?
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  • Richmond Racer
    Richmond Racer Posts: 8,561
    LeicesterLad wrote:
    Blazing Saddles wrote:
    Cav gets season starter San Luis, while Boonan gets his favourite, pan flat Qatar.
    Mmmm, I wonder how long it will be before the cracks appear?

    Was thinking the same but didn't want to say it. Is this a glimpse as to who's wearing the trousers at OPQS?


    I'm with you both on this one...for me the first sign that Cav wasnt going to get everything on his own terms was OPQS forcing him to drop Ellingworth as his coach - that was never a problem at Highroad...Problem was that if contract negotiations (when stuff like that would have been sorted out) are a game of poker, Cav showed his hand right from the start with his desperation to make the jump, rather than be courted to leave.

    Just wait for the shenanigans around MSR and to a lesser extent G-W...
  • tailwindhome
    tailwindhome Posts: 18,924
    Might be good for Cavendish to start racing a couple of weeks earlier. For whatever reason he was just plain not ready for Milan San Remo last year.

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  • Richmond Racer
    Richmond Racer Posts: 8,561
    Well, we'll see. Cav needs a lot of help at MSR and I cant see Boonen going for most of the team supporting Cav instead.
  • greasedscotsman
    greasedscotsman Posts: 6,962
    prawny wrote:
    Had sagan claimed to be a top tier sprinter? Watching the highlights of the tour on eurosport the other night it was pretty obvious in a flat sprint he couldn't beat the top guys, his points came from gilbert/valverde (spit) type finishes and intermediates

    Might have got the wrong end of the stick from previous posts though.

    Did the highlights not show the stage to Metz?
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 72,530
    Richmond Racer wrote:
    Well, we'll see. Cav needs a lot of help at MSR and I cant see Boonen going for most of the team supporting Cav instead.

    It's the biggest question in March.

    Cav doesn't mind doing hilly courses to get into some shape. Boonen needs early wins.
    _
  • frenchfighter
    frenchfighter Posts: 30,642
    Cav is big enough to say no if he wants. Qatar is a shit race and very uncomfortable riding in that heat. I'm sure San Luis will be more pleasant plus Cav hasn't ridden it before.

    Boonen rode San Luis last year (and won two stages). He also rode Qatar.
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  • Caller
    Caller Posts: 124
    Does anyone know if the Tour de San Luis will have any Tv coverage in the UK?
    I looked on Eurosport's site but couldn't find anything about it.
  • blazing_saddles
    blazing_saddles Posts: 21,811
    Caller wrote:
    Does anyone know if the Tour de San Luis will have any Tv coverage in the UK?
    I looked on Eurosport's site but couldn't find anything about it.

    Nah.
    Last year was a step up with a static camera at some of the finishes and one at each end of the ITT. (I seem to recall)
    Makes Qatar look like a GT.

    I like the Cav "hilly" theory for M-SR.
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  • inkyfingers
    inkyfingers Posts: 4,400
    I've said it before, but in theory I don't see a need for Cav and Boonen to fall out. Boonen leads at HN/E3/Flanders/Roubaix and Cav leads at KBK/MSR/GW and Le Tour. The only race I can see them disagreeing about seriously is MSR and even Rick reckons Boonen can't win that.

    I'm sure they can split all the other smaller races (PN/TA/TdS etc etc) between them.

    Cav was clearly overweight in the early part of the 2012 season, even allowing for the fact that the WCs jersey makes everybody look fat. Would be good to see him in top shape earlier in the year this year.
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  • iainf72
    iainf72 Posts: 15,784
    prawny wrote:
    Had sagan claimed to be a top tier sprinter? Watching the highlights of the tour on eurosport the other night it was pretty obvious in a flat sprint he couldn't beat the top guys, his points came from gilbert/valverde (spit) type finishes and intermediates

    Might have got the wrong end of the stick from previous posts though.

    With better positioning, he would've beaten Cavendish in Paris last year. But a lost of sprinting is about positioning soooo...

    He's Bettini like - Can climb, but can throw down an astonishing amount of power in a sprint.
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  • Richmond Racer
    Richmond Racer Posts: 8,561
    iainf72 wrote:
    prawny wrote:
    Had sagan claimed to be a top tier sprinter? Watching the highlights of the tour on eurosport the other night it was pretty obvious in a flat sprint he couldn't beat the top guys, his points came from gilbert/valverde (spit) type finishes and intermediates

    Might have got the wrong end of the stick from previous posts though.

    With better positioning, he would've beaten Cavendish in Paris last year. But a lost of sprinting is about positioning soooo...

    He's Bettini like - Can climb, but can throw down an astonishing amount of power in a sprint.


    I'm not a massive fan of his, but I have to say that one of things about Sagan is that he can contest sprints in the absence of a train - unlike most other current sprinters apart from Cav. In the closing stages of some of those Tour sprints, he just hitched rides and locked in on other teams' wheels. Griepel, Goss, Kittel - they need their trains, especially Griepel who gets pushed out of position very easily without one
  • TMR
    TMR Posts: 3,986
    iainf72 wrote:
    prawny wrote:
    Had sagan claimed to be a top tier sprinter? Watching the highlights of the tour on eurosport the other night it was pretty obvious in a flat sprint he couldn't beat the top guys, his points came from gilbert/valverde (spit) type finishes and intermediates

    Might have got the wrong end of the stick from previous posts though.

    With better positioning, he would've beaten Cavendish in Paris last year. But a lost of sprinting is about positioning soooo...

    He's Bettini like - Can climb, but can throw down an astonishing amount of power in a sprint.

    I disagree Iain. He's fast but not that fast. I'd place him in the 2nd tier of sprinters, with the likes of Farrar and Renshaw.

    He is stupidly talented though.
  • islwyn
    islwyn Posts: 650
    Sagan is one to look out for and will be unstoppable in a year or two, Cav still has the upper hand for this year, if he was in OQS for last years TdF, I think we know who would've been in Green.

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  • Richmond Racer
    Richmond Racer Posts: 8,561
    inkyfingers wrote:
    I've said it before, but in theory I don't see a need for Cav and Boonen to fall out. Boonen leads at HN/E3/Flanders/Roubaix and Cav leads at KBK/MSR/GW and Le Tour. The only race I can see them disagreeing about seriously is MSR and even Rick reckons Boonen can't win that.

    I'm sure they can split all the other smaller races (PN/TA/TdS etc etc) between them.

    Cav was clearly overweight in the early part of the 2012 season, even allowing for the fact that the WCs jersey makes everybody look fat. Would be good to see him in top shape earlier in the year this year.


    Are you having a laugh :) He was lighter than usual beginning of last season. He's always on the lardy front after the off-season, but he kept off the cakes end 2011.
  • islwyn
    islwyn Posts: 650
    Richmond Racer wrote:
    Are you having a laugh :) He was lighter than usual beginning of last season.

    Cav admitted himself he wasn't in great shape start of season.
  • Richmond Racer
    Richmond Racer Posts: 8,561
    Islwyn wrote:
    Richmond Racer wrote:
    Are you having a laugh :) He was lighter than usual beginning of last season.

    Cav admitted himself he wasn't in great shape start of season.


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  • frenchfighter
    frenchfighter Posts: 30,642
    You dont want to see a photo of him in the middle east races with his jersey unzipped

    Or maybe you do so:
    Pic20120219_w18.jpg

    But there is another where it is quite obvious he wasnt in tip top form
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  • greasedscotsman
    greasedscotsman Posts: 6,962
    Islwyn wrote:
    Sagan is one to look out for and will be unstoppable in a year or two, Cav still has the upper hand for this year, if he was in OQS for last years TdF, I think we know who would've been in Green.

    You mean Sagan, right? Cavendish finished 201 points behind Sagan last year so he would have had to win another 5 stages. Don't see it myself.

    I don't see how Cavendish has the upper hand at all. Sure in a straight sprint, he is faster, but Sagan is more than capable of a top 5 finish in the flat stages. Whereas in hilly or stages with a small climb at the finish, Cavendish won't pick any points at all.
  • prawny
    prawny Posts: 5,439
    iainf72 wrote:
    prawny wrote:
    Had sagan claimed to be a top tier sprinter? Watching the highlights of the tour on eurosport the other night it was pretty obvious in a flat sprint he couldn't beat the top guys, his points came from gilbert/valverde (spit) type finishes and intermediates

    Might have got the wrong end of the stick from previous posts though.

    With better positioning, he would've beaten Cavendish in Paris last year. But a lost of sprinting is about positioning soooo...

    He's Bettini like - Can climb, but can throw down an astonishing amount of power in a sprint.

    Nah, I don't reckon he would have beaten him, cav went quite early so Sagan was coming back as cav faded but in a straight out sprint I'd pick cav 9/10.

    @ greased, it probably did, but that was one put of how many sprint stages? He's good and I think I'm a fan (as long he doesn't start being all knobbish and wanting cash for interviews and such) but fingers crossed he's clean and he can pick off all the finishes valverde would go for
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  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 72,530
    Sagan seems to be most like Kelly from what I read about Kelly.
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