New 10 speed stuff?

TommyK
TommyK Posts: 177
edited September 2010 in MTB workshop & tech
Hello dudes,

I call upon your wealth of knowledge once again!!

I have a recent XTR M970 chainset running a single ring up front, I don't want to replace the whole chainset but I want to go 1 x 10 instead of 1 x 9. Does anybody know if a 10 speed chain will run on 9 speed chainrings (XTR's look very thin anyhow) remember that it doesn't have to shift, just run smoothly.

I can't find a 4/104mm 32T 10speed chainring anywhere.

Could really do with the 11-36T cassette you see!

Cheers,

Tom.
-Monkey-like creature, only with less digits!!-

http://www.pinkbike.com/photo/1835856/

Comments

  • RevellRider
    RevellRider Posts: 1,794
    I was asked a very similar question at work today. The tooth profiles are the same, the spacing inside the chain is the same even though the width overall is different, so yes it will work
    Alpha, Beta, Gamma, Epsilon.
  • maddog 2
    maddog 2 Posts: 8,114
    +1
    Facts are meaningless, you can use facts to prove anything that's remotely true! - Homer
  • njee20
    njee20 Posts: 9,613
    It'll be fine, plenty of people have been running 10 speed chains on 9 speed set ups for years.

    You'll just need rear mech, shifters, cassette and chain, and if we believe the blurb they will all have to be from the same manufacturer due to different spacing on the cassettes.
  • Chunkers1980
    Chunkers1980 Posts: 8,035
    I'd go as far as to say you need.

    A 10 spd rear shifter.
    10 spd chain
    10 spd cassette.

    The rest replace with 'proper' 10 speed stuff when it wears out or breaks.
  • njee20
    njee20 Posts: 9,613
    You'll need a rear mech too, the cable pull isn't the same as 9 speed. There are some bodges, but they don't really work!
  • cavegiant
    cavegiant Posts: 1,546
    Am I missunderstanding what you mean by cable pull, or is that not handled by shifter?

    Please explain
    Why would I care about 150g of bike weight, I just ate 400g of cookies while reading this?
  • Chunkers1980
    Chunkers1980 Posts: 8,035
    Been trying to find this out too - it's not very clear and until someone has actual experience of a '9 spd' mech and 10 spd setup I'll not be sure.

    It's about 'actuation ratios' - the amount of movement in the mech given the cable pulled by the shifter. Shimano appear to have made this different for 10spd over 9.
  • RevellRider
    RevellRider Posts: 1,794
    SRAM have done this as well. The new 10 speed rear mechs have had a tweak and won't work with a 9 speed shifter
    Alpha, Beta, Gamma, Epsilon.
  • njee20
    njee20 Posts: 9,613
    Am I missunderstanding what you mean by cable pull, or is that not handled by shifter?

    No, different shifters/mechs have different pull ratios, SRAM 9 speed is 1:1, Shimano 9 speed is 2:1, SRAM 10 speed is 0.7:1 IIRC, I don't know what Shimano 10 speed is, but it's not 2:1.
    Been trying to find this out too - it's not very clear and until someone has actual experience of a '9 spd' mech and 10 spd setup I'll not be sure.

    I know a couple who've tried it and confirmed it doesn't really work properly. There will always be work arounds like pinching the cable the wrong side of the pinch bolt and things which may produce a result you're happy with, but it's not designed to work.
  • TommyK
    TommyK Posts: 177
    Cheers for many great answers, what a difference a thread makes! Njee20 we were arguing about stems just now!

    I was about to take the chain off my road bike just to see how it bedded onto the chainring, I think I will go for an XT cassette, chain, shifter, mech etc. No longer rich enough for XTR, and have you seen the price of an XX cassette??? replaceable sprockets or not, thats a rip!

    Thanks again.
    -Monkey-like creature, only with less digits!!-

    http://www.pinkbike.com/photo/1835856/
  • SuperstarComponents.com
    SuperstarComponents.com Posts: 183
    isnt the chain pitch on new 10 speed shimano not the normal 1/2" or something? Im sure i read that somewhere?
  • TommyK
    TommyK Posts: 177
    I read about them being 'assymetric' meaning that they're directional because the outer plates are different shapes on different sides. I hope they're 1/2", if they're shorter then that'll change all the gearing. Maybe an 11T will be like a 10T etc etc???
    -Monkey-like creature, only with less digits!!-

    http://www.pinkbike.com/photo/1835856/
  • ride_whenever
    ride_whenever Posts: 13,279
    TommyK wrote:
    I read about them being 'assymetric' meaning that they're directional because the outer plates are different shapes on different sides. I hope they're 1/2", if they're shorter then that'll change all the gearing. Maybe an 11T will be like a 10T etc etc???

    No it wouldn't chain/sprocket pitch has nothing to do with gearing, although it does effect what you can fit around a freehub.
    Neeermad
    Carbon 456
    456 lefty
    Pompino
    White Inbred
  • njee20
    njee20 Posts: 9,613
    Yes the Shimano chains are directional, but that's about the chamfering on the outer plates to aid shifting. The MTB chains are even different to the road ones.
    and have you seen the price of an XX cassette??? replaceable sprockets or not, thats a rip!

    It's only the biggest sprocket which is replaceable anyway. I'm wondering how long I can eek my cassette out I must say, they don't seem to last any longer than anything else, but I'm not about to buy another XX one!

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