Near Miss On Cycle Path

Dr Nosh · October 2008

Rounded a corner on the cycle path back from the office this afternoon and was confronted with a yellow tractor blocking the complete width of the path joined to a grass cutting device trimming the verges.
Didnt leave much room for evasive actions apart from throwing out the anchors and swerving onto the verge on the opposite side from the wildly rotating grass cutter.

Not a bloody 'road works' sign in sight.

If this maintenance activity was on a public road there would be loads of plastic bollards, and yellow jacket jobsworths about.

Furious, the tractor driver carried just carried on.

Feel like complaining to the local council, although last time I wrote to them complaining about dogs carp all over the path, the response I received - complete with spelling and grammatical errors - was not even worth the paper it was printed on.

Arrrrrgh!!!

peanut · October 2008

take a picture tomorrow and send it to the local paper and the Chief Executive of the Council

spen666 · October 2008

Several things come to mind

Firstly- you should not be riding so fast that you cannot stop if there is something around a corner or bend - if you can't see the path ahead is clear, then perhaps you should have been going slower.

Secondly- the traffic on a road would be going faster and hence more warning should be given.

Thirdly - remember the Highway Code advises that you shouldn't be using cyclepaths if travelling at speed

I wasn't there and can't say if you were riding too fast

Dr Nosh · October 2008

Well, I thank you for your useful advice.

Are you a safety and health officer by any chance?

Mithras · November 2008

Dr Nosh wrote:

Well, I thank you for your useful advice.

Are you a safety and health officer by any chance?

No he's not that, however I can't help but agree with Spen!
You should only ride at a speed where you can safely stop in the distance you can see!

(Spen it's not right..I'm sure every post I used to put in was countering yours, now I seem to be backing you up! :roll: )

chuckcork · November 2008

A couple of guys in our club could have done with that advice, riding around a corner on a road at dusk they came across two dog walkers and the ensuing split 3 of them went down, one ended up breaking a shoulder, another split his helmet though was OK.

While dog walkers come in for some criticism at times, this was a quite road, such roads frequently have people walking along them (in ireland anyway), and they were going too fast for the unexpected on what isn't a race track, and were totally unprepared for it.

The injured party is off work, and being a self employed painter it has cost him, and has not cycling in the month since.

As Mithras said, you shouldn't outride your visual stopping distance, and the faster you go the less time to stop particularly on 2 wheels!

peanut · November 2008

yes thats all very true about cycling within a safe stopping didtance particularly when view is restricted but the valid point the OP was making is that contractors( public or private) have legal obligations to ensure that road and path users are warned of possible restrictions etc. If this was a Council contractor there would be very strict Policies and Proceedures guidelines and risk assessments etc to follow which this person clearly did not.

downfader · November 2008

peanut wrote:

yes thats all very true about cycling within a safe stopping didtance particularly when view is restricted but the valid point the OP was making is that contractors( public or private) have legal obligations to ensure that road and path users are warned of possible restrictions etc. If this was a Council contractor there would be very strict Policies and Proceedures guidelines and risk assessments etc to follow which this person clearly did not.

Um no. Morally perhaps, but legally not unless its on a public road. I often encounter tractors, walkers, dogs and so on around cyclepaths like the local common and so account for corners and blind spots by slowing down.

Even on roads, knowing how some will behave, I will be cautious around corners and near junctions... probably more so in future.

peanut · November 2008

downfader wrote:

[

Um no. Morally perhaps, but legally not unless its on a public road.

.

you are incorrect. Local Authorities and contractors working on any public or private land where members of the public can have access are obliged to follow policy and proceedural guidelines regarding operating machinery etc There are numerous applicable health and safety guidelines and recommendations also. I'm sure if you contact your Local Authority or do a google search you will find some advice and information on this.
Incidentally I work for a Local Authority Property Services Div

Mithras · November 2008

It doesn't matter whether there is a moral or legal or obligation to give a warning, the point is YOU need to take responsiblity for your own safety. There is far to much of this american blame culture about. No point in losing an arm in a grass cutter and blaming it on someone else's lack of responsiblity.
I nearly came to grief on a footpath whilst going to an emergency call, it was dark, I saw the two pedestrians, I didn't see the two black dogs they had on extendable leads across the path until the last second.....My Responsiblity and my fault!

downfader · November 2008

peanut wrote:

downfader wrote:

[

Um no. Morally perhaps, but legally not unless its on a public road.

.

you are incorrect. Local Authorities and contractors working on any public or private land where members of the public can have access are obliged to follow policy and proceedural guidelines regarding operating machinery etc There are numerous applicable health and safety guidelines and recommendations also. I'm sure if you contact your Local Authority or do a google search you will find some advice and information on this.
Incidentally I work for a Local Authority Property Services Div

Fair enough but that sounds like policy rather than law.. I'll concede you prolly know more than me, lol, I was just going by what I was told at work (I work in a hospital doing catering).

peanut · November 2008

downfader wrote:

[

Fair enough but that sounds like policy rather than law.. I'll concede you prolly know more than me, lol, I was just going by what I was told at work (I work in a hospital doing catering).

whats the food like lol

downfader · November 2008

peanut wrote:

downfader wrote:

[

Fair enough but that sounds like policy rather than law.. I'll concede you prolly know more than me, lol, I was just going by what I was told at work (I work in a hospital doing catering).

whats the food like lol

Hand on heart... better than it used to be. Trouble is catering is being sold off to private companies across the UK and we could be next - so that means it could be turds for dinner there soon. :roll:

spen666 · November 2008

peanut wrote:

downfader wrote:

[

Um no. Morally perhaps, but legally not unless its on a public road.

.

you are incorrect. Local Authorities and contractors working on any public or private land where members of the public can have access are obliged to follow policy and proceedural guidelines regarding operating machinery etc There are numerous applicable health and safety guidelines and recommendations also. I'm sure if you contact your Local Authority or do a google search you will find some advice and information on this.
Incidentally I work for a Local Authority Property Services Div

What is the legal authority for this?

spen666 · November 2008

peanut wrote:

downfader wrote:

[

Fair enough but that sounds like policy rather than law.. I'll concede you prolly know more than me, lol, I was just going by what I was told at work (I work in a hospital doing catering).

whats the food like lol

Are you planning a visit? :oops:

Dr Nosh · November 2008

Well, I was guilty of using 'excitable' words, but I was pretty cross about the situation.

I did have to brake, but not that hard, AND under control to take the LH verge.

You know, further up the path I met a mother with a pushchair walking towards the grass cutting tractor. She would not be able to get past even at walking pace.

She turned round and had quite a distance to walk to avoid the tractor.

My point is about the total lack of signage warning of the mobile work - Important for both cyclists and pedestrians.

I do think that the local council would have been liable if an accident had occured , not just me riding into the tractor, but what about a pedestrian trying to walk past the tractor and getting hit by a flying discarded beer can picked up by the cutter blades and flung out.
The council had not carried out risk assessment and completed a method statement before starting the works.
This RA and MS would obviously be the same for many grass cutting activities, but should still be considered for each particular job. I was under the impression that under H&S law RA and MS had to be completed to prove, in the case of an accident, all possible care was taken to consider the risks, avoid the risk by,for example in this case putting up signage /or closing stretches of the path.

spen666 · November 2008

Dr Nosh wrote:

Well, I was guilty of using 'excitable' words, but I was pretty cross about the situation.

I did have to brake, but not that hard, AND under control to take the LH verge.

You know, further up the path I met a mother with a pushchair walking towards the grass cutting tractor. She would not be able to get past even at walking pace.

She turned round and had quite a distance to walk to avoid the tractor.

My point is about the total lack of signage warning of the mobile work - Important for both cyclists and pedestrians.

I do think that the local council would have been liable if an accident had occured , not just me riding into the tractor, but what about a pedestrian trying to walk past the tractor and getting hit by a flying discarded beer can picked up by the cutter blades and flung out.
The council had not carried out risk assessment and completed a method statement before starting the works.

how do you know this?

Perhaps they had but came to different conclusions to you.

Perhaps people need to take some responsibility for their own actions

This RA and MS would obviously be the same for many grass cutting activities, but should still be considered for each particular job. I was under the impression that under H&S law RA and MS had to be completed to prove, in the case of an accident, all possible care was taken to consider the risks, avoid the risk by,for example in this case putting up signage /or closing stretches of the path.

How far away do you want these signs.

first you appear to be complaining that you did not have enough warning to slow down safely, now you see to be objecting because mother may have to walk the long way round.

I'm a little confused at your problem, save it seems to come across that you are upset that your cycling speed was affected by essential (?) maintenance works.

OffTheBackAdam · November 2008

Couldn't you hear the tractor & cutter & smell the cut grass?

Poacher · November 2008

Spen - the Highway Code does not advise that you shouldn't be using cyclepaths if travelling at speed. It should do, but it doesn't. I think you're referring to the DfT's draft code of conduct for cyclists.

Near Miss On Cycle Path

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