The big Coronavirus thread

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Comments

  • nickice
    nickice Posts: 2,439

    But if those of us who have already had it get exposed to it naturally every few months, couldn't that potentially boost the immunity without major symptoms? Those who are at risk get vaccinated with boosters when needed.

    Or a one time vaccine shot with the knowledge that it won't protect you but will mean you get mild disease and then boosters for the more vulnerable (if that even works). That means waiting for a vaccine, though.

    To be honest, I'd take being infected with another coronavirus to have cross-immunity (if I don't already have it) especially that I'm very likely to catch it at work given how many people I interact with. It might be unethical but it beats getting severe disease. Idea for a start-up....
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 26,123
    nickice said:

    But if those of us who have already had it get exposed to it naturally every few months, couldn't that potentially boost the immunity without major symptoms? Those who are at risk get vaccinated with boosters when needed.

    Or a one time vaccine shot with the knowledge that it won't protect you but will mean you get mild disease and then boosters for the more vulnerable (if that even works). That means waiting for a vaccine, though.

    To be honest, I'd take being infected with another coronavirus to have cross-immunity (if I don't already have it) especially that I'm very likely to catch it at work given how many people I interact with. It might be unethical but it beats getting severe disease. Idea for a start-up....
    If that works, I wouldn't say it's unethical. Better than catching this bastard.
  • rjsterry
    rjsterry Posts: 27,483
    nickice said:

    The T-cell stuff is a lot more positive. I still find it interesting why the virus seems to be dying out in London.

    I don't know about this stuff, but wasn't T cell stuff always going to be there.

    I mean, I thought the whole point with the virus in the people who were getting really ill was that they didn't have enough anti-bodies to stop the virus spreading, so then the T-cells ended up attacking anything and everything. Hence the "Cytokine Storm"??
    I don't have much of an understanding, but I thought the T-cells were the first line of defence, so if somebody's T-cells do the job, they don't need antibodies. Even if you do need the antibodies the T-cells still develop protection for the future and then remember for a lot longer, so see study that 100% of people with SARS have the T-cells to fight C-19.

    So if 20% of London has the antibodies it might be the case that another 40% has the T-cells, and herd immunity has been reached.

    I still haven't heard a satisfactory explanation as to why kids don't get it / suffer with it. I don't really buy the one about them having so many colds they are used to fighting it as that doesn't apply to newborns.




    It's been a long time since I studies it but I don't think the T cells stop you getting it, it just means it's very mild.
    The Prof Francois Balloux thread a page back touched on this.
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    Pinnacle Monzonite

    Part of the anti-growth coalition
  • rjsterry
    rjsterry Posts: 27,483
    nickice said:

    But if those of us who have already had it get exposed to it naturally every few months, couldn't that potentially boost the immunity without major symptoms? Those who are at risk get vaccinated with boosters when needed.

    Or a one time vaccine shot with the knowledge that it won't protect you but will mean you get mild disease and then boosters for the more vulnerable (if that even works). That means waiting for a vaccine, though.

    To be honest, I'd take being infected with another coronavirus to have cross-immunity (if I don't already have it) especially that I'm very likely to catch it at work given how many people I interact with. It might be unethical but it beats getting severe disease. Idea for a start-up....
    Finally all those colds that the minions bring home from school are useful for something.
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    Pinnacle Monzonite

    Part of the anti-growth coalition
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 26,123
    rjsterry said:

    nickice said:

    But if those of us who have already had it get exposed to it naturally every few months, couldn't that potentially boost the immunity without major symptoms? Those who are at risk get vaccinated with boosters when needed.

    Or a one time vaccine shot with the knowledge that it won't protect you but will mean you get mild disease and then boosters for the more vulnerable (if that even works). That means waiting for a vaccine, though.

    To be honest, I'd take being infected with another coronavirus to have cross-immunity (if I don't already have it) especially that I'm very likely to catch it at work given how many people I interact with. It might be unethical but it beats getting severe disease. Idea for a start-up....
    Finally all those colds that the minions bring home from school are useful for something.
    I was just thinking that my cycle commuting and self congratulation on avoiding catching any colds from the public on transport isn't looking so smart now :smiley:
  • First.Aspect
    First.Aspect Posts: 14,498
    Whether this is the effect.of the virus or the body's own immune system seems unclear. If the latter, then although not good news at least it can be mitigated in future.
  • nickice
    nickice Posts: 2,439

    nickice said:

    But if those of us who have already had it get exposed to it naturally every few months, couldn't that potentially boost the immunity without major symptoms? Those who are at risk get vaccinated with boosters when needed.

    Or a one time vaccine shot with the knowledge that it won't protect you but will mean you get mild disease and then boosters for the more vulnerable (if that even works). That means waiting for a vaccine, though.

    To be honest, I'd take being infected with another coronavirus to have cross-immunity (if I don't already have it) especially that I'm very likely to catch it at work given how many people I interact with. It might be unethical but it beats getting severe disease. Idea for a start-up....
    If that works, I wouldn't say it's unethical. Better than catching this censored .
    Unethical for whoever is deliberately infecting me though.
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 72,218

    Whether this is the effect.of the virus or the body's own immune system seems unclear. If the latter, then although not good news at least it can be mitigated in future.
    I do find it remarkable how little is still known about it and how it affects the body.
  • nickice
    nickice Posts: 2,439

    Whether this is the effect.of the virus or the body's own immune system seems unclear. If the latter, then although not good news at least it can be mitigated in future.
    I do find it remarkable how little is still known about it and how it affects the body.
    It has been known for a while that it's a disease of the endothelium.
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 72,218
    nickice said:

    Whether this is the effect.of the virus or the body's own immune system seems unclear. If the latter, then although not good news at least it can be mitigated in future.
    I do find it remarkable how little is still known about it and how it affects the body.
    It has been known for a while that it's a disease of the endothelium.
    Non-sequitur
  • nickice
    nickice Posts: 2,439

    nickice said:

    Whether this is the effect.of the virus or the body's own immune system seems unclear. If the latter, then although not good news at least it can be mitigated in future.
    I do find it remarkable how little is still known about it and how it affects the body.
    It has been known for a while that it's a disease of the endothelium.
    Non-sequitur
    You're posting sky news links about it affecting the whole body but this is not particularly new information. Do you know what the endothelium is?
  • First.Aspect
    First.Aspect Posts: 14,498
    nickice said:

    nickice said:

    Whether this is the effect.of the virus or the body's own immune system seems unclear. If the latter, then although not good news at least it can be mitigated in future.
    I do find it remarkable how little is still known about it and how it affects the body.
    It has been known for a while that it's a disease of the endothelium.
    Non-sequitur
    You're posting sky news links about it affecting the whole body but this is not particularly new information. Do you know what the endothelium is?
    It was one of the early postulates, you are right; at least in part to try to explain these wide ranging symptoms. Still a long way from "known" though Nick.

    Another explanation is that a lot of these symptoms are a result of the body attacking itself - which also seems to be relatively well documented in some of the fatalities. So why not the severe cases also?
  • nickice
    nickice Posts: 2,439

    nickice said:

    nickice said:

    Whether this is the effect.of the virus or the body's own immune system seems unclear. If the latter, then although not good news at least it can be mitigated in future.
    I do find it remarkable how little is still known about it and how it affects the body.
    It has been known for a while that it's a disease of the endothelium.
    Non-sequitur
    You're posting sky news links about it affecting the whole body but this is not particularly new information. Do you know what the endothelium is?
    It was one of the early postulates, you are right; at least in part to try to explain these wide ranging symptoms. Still a long way from "known" though Nick.

    Another explanation is that a lot of these symptoms are a result of the body attacking itself - which also seems to be relatively well documented in some of the fatalities. So why not the severe cases also?
    That information has been out there for weeks. I posted it here quite a while ago
  • nickice said:

    nickice said:

    nickice said:

    Whether this is the effect.of the virus or the body's own immune system seems unclear. If the latter, then although not good news at least it can be mitigated in future.
    I do find it remarkable how little is still known about it and how it affects the body.
    It has been known for a while that it's a disease of the endothelium.
    Non-sequitur
    You're posting sky news links about it affecting the whole body but this is not particularly new information. Do you know what the endothelium is?
    It was one of the early postulates, you are right; at least in part to try to explain these wide ranging symptoms. Still a long way from "known" though Nick.

    Another explanation is that a lot of these symptoms are a result of the body attacking itself - which also seems to be relatively well documented in some of the fatalities. So why not the severe cases also?
    That information has been out there for weeks. I posted it here quite a while ago
    @nickice you were definitely posting this in May, if not April.

    Some people just don't want learn about the virus and would prefer to try and maintain hysteria so they can justify them irrationality of being scared.
  • First.Aspect
    First.Aspect Posts: 14,498
    nickice said:

    nickice said:

    nickice said:

    Whether this is the effect.of the virus or the body's own immune system seems unclear. If the latter, then although not good news at least it can be mitigated in future.
    I do find it remarkable how little is still known about it and how it affects the body.
    It has been known for a while that it's a disease of the endothelium.
    Non-sequitur
    You're posting sky news links about it affecting the whole body but this is not particularly new information. Do you know what the endothelium is?
    It was one of the early postulates, you are right; at least in part to try to explain these wide ranging symptoms. Still a long way from "known" though Nick.

    Another explanation is that a lot of these symptoms are a result of the body attacking itself - which also seems to be relatively well documented in some of the fatalities. So why not the severe cases also?
    That information has been out there for weeks. I posted it here quite a while ago
    I was posting it before you as well. The point is that no one actually knows yet, so you are in danger of being over-definitive.
  • coopster_the_1st
    coopster_the_1st Posts: 5,158
    edited July 2020
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-53392148

    Winter wave of coronavirus 'could be worse than first'

    I'm looking forward to how the media and the lockdown loonies are going to twist themselves in knots over this, at the same time as criticising the Swedish approach.

    This one should play out over the next 8 months, as the two top Swedish epidemiologists predicted.
  • nickice
    nickice Posts: 2,439

    nickice said:

    nickice said:

    nickice said:

    Whether this is the effect.of the virus or the body's own immune system seems unclear. If the latter, then although not good news at least it can be mitigated in future.
    I do find it remarkable how little is still known about it and how it affects the body.
    It has been known for a while that it's a disease of the endothelium.
    Non-sequitur
    You're posting sky news links about it affecting the whole body but this is not particularly new information. Do you know what the endothelium is?
    It was one of the early postulates, you are right; at least in part to try to explain these wide ranging symptoms. Still a long way from "known" though Nick.

    Another explanation is that a lot of these symptoms are a result of the body attacking itself - which also seems to be relatively well documented in some of the fatalities. So why not the severe cases also?
    That information has been out there for weeks. I posted it here quite a while ago
    I was posting it before you as well. The point is that no one actually knows yet, so you are in danger of being over-definitive.
    When was that then and why does it matter?
  • nickice
    nickice Posts: 2,439

    nickice said:

    nickice said:

    nickice said:

    Whether this is the effect.of the virus or the body's own immune system seems unclear. If the latter, then although not good news at least it can be mitigated in future.
    I do find it remarkable how little is still known about it and how it affects the body.
    It has been known for a while that it's a disease of the endothelium.
    Non-sequitur
    You're posting sky news links about it affecting the whole body but this is not particularly new information. Do you know what the endothelium is?
    It was one of the early postulates, you are right; at least in part to try to explain these wide ranging symptoms. Still a long way from "known" though Nick.

    Another explanation is that a lot of these symptoms are a result of the body attacking itself - which also seems to be relatively well documented in some of the fatalities. So why not the severe cases also?
    That information has been out there for weeks. I posted it here quite a while ago
    @nickice you were definitely posting this in May, if not April.

    Some people just don't want learn about the virus and would prefer to try and maintain hysteria so they can justify them irrationality of being scared.
    Some people have had plenty of time to do some basic reading on this, but haven't.
  • tailwindhome
    tailwindhome Posts: 18,878

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-53392148

    Winter wave of coronavirus 'could be worse than first'

    I'm looking forward to how the media and the lockdown loonies are going to twist themselves in knots over this, at the same time as criticising the Swedish approach.

    This one should play out over the next 8 months, as the two top Swedish epidemiologists predicted.

    This you?

    The hysteria yesterday was the long term effects to a miniscule minority of those infected. Today, it's the 120k C19 deaths over the winter.

    “New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 26,123

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-53392148

    Winter wave of coronavirus 'could be worse than first'

    I'm looking forward to how the media and the lockdown loonies are going to twist themselves in knots over this, at the same time as criticising the Swedish approach.

    This one should play out over the next 8 months, as the two top Swedish epidemiologists predicted.

    Can you explain to me why you think Sweden's approach means they are not going to get a bad second wave? Based on the deaths per million so far of Sweden (548) and the UK (660), if it is just the numbers game you predicted at the start, they've got further to go than us.
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 26,123
    Total all cause deaths for week to 3rd July is 43 below 5 year average.


  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 26,123
    I think this graph is possibly what has got the government worried and prompted the mask announcement. Once you lose control, it really goes.




  • Pross
    Pross Posts: 40,207
    What countries are the other dodgy looking lines on there? I assume one of them is Brazil but there's another two at least on a sharp upward trajectory even if they're a bit lower in numbers.
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 26,123
    Pross said:

    What countries are the other dodgy looking lines on there? I assume one of them is Brazil but there's another two at least on a sharp upward trajectory even if they're a bit lower in numbers.

    India and South Africa
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 72,218

    I think this graph is possibly what has got the government worried and prompted the mask announcement. Once you lose control, it really goes.




    I saw a good chart that plotted that line against deaths too, which made for interesting reading.
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 26,123
    edited July 2020
  • First.Aspect
    First.Aspect Posts: 14,498

    I think this graph is possibly what has got the government worried and prompted the mask announcement. Once you lose control, it really goes.




    Does Trump think they are polling numbers?
  • pblakeney
    pblakeney Posts: 25,586

    I think this graph is possibly what has got the government worried and prompted the mask announcement. Once you lose control, it really goes.




    Does Trump think they are polling numbers?
    World leaders, right?
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.