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Who buys a Ti Bike these days?

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Posts

  • First.AspectFirst.Aspect Posts: 3,608
    Imposter wrote:
    Imposter wrote:
    keef66 wrote:
    I'm still keen to experience the fabled magic carpet ride of a Ti framed bike.

    Prepare to be underwhelmed...
    I thought it was supposed to be springy and make you feel connected to the road. Unlike wooden carbon fibre or stiff aluminium. But steel is real and it's a game of two halves isn't it?

    Apparently, "it surges forward with every turn of the pedals, willing you to go faster and faster.." I believe that phrase has been in use in bike reviews since the early 80s...
    That's the road.cc review of the latest anything. They used it for a review of chamois cream on Tuesday.
  • kingrollokingrollo Posts: 3,147
    My thoughts on ti are that it used to mean hand made...but nowadays u get mass produced to....

    Not necessarily a bad thing - but ti doesn't shout 'high end' like it used to...

    All imo of course...
  • First.AspectFirst.Aspect Posts: 3,608
    kingrollo wrote:
    My thoughts on ti are that it used to mean hand made...but nowadays u get mass produced to....

    Not necessarily a bad thing - but ti doesn't shout 'high end' like it used to...

    All imo of course...
    When you think of hand made, do you have in mind a man wearing rubber gloves putting the electrodes in the melt by hand, a man with an anvil beating the metal into sheets and bending and welding them into tubes, or do you just mean some bloke with a tig welder sticking the ends of tubes together? Because if.its just the last bit I'm pretty sure they are all hand made. Only the cheapest ones are the result of child labour though.
  • pblakeneypblakeney Posts: 11,348
    kingrollo wrote:
    My thoughts on ti are that it used to mean hand made...but nowadays u get mass produced to....

    Not necessarily a bad thing - but ti doesn't shout 'high end' like it used to...

    All imo of course...
    I think I would get one of these given a lottery win. Made to measure, obviously.
    And different wheels. Strikes me as being high end.

    http://www.passoni.it/topgenesis.php?n=9&passoni=1#
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • step83step83 Posts: 3,737
    Imposter wrote:
    Imposter wrote:
    keef66 wrote:
    I'm still keen to experience the fabled magic carpet ride of a Ti framed bike.

    Prepare to be underwhelmed...
    I thought it was supposed to be springy and make you feel connected to the road. Unlike wooden carbon fibre or stiff aluminium. But steel is real and it's a game of two halves isn't it?

    Apparently, "it surges forward with every turn of the pedals, willing you to go faster and faster.." I believe that phrase has been in use in bike reviews since the early 80s...

    I think any bike you pedal hard "Surges forward with every turn of the pedal" if it somehow surges forward without pedalling, its likely to be a motorcycle
  • keef66keef66 Posts: 13,286
    Right, you lot have talked me out of it. I'm now thinking my forever bike when I raid my pension pot is going to be custom built in some kind of fancy steel...
  • imposter2.0imposter2.0 Posts: 10,861
    step83 wrote:
    I think any bike you pedal hard "Surges forward with every turn of the pedal" if it somehow surges forward without pedalling, its likely to be a motorcycle

    That's kinda the point....
  • veronese68veronese68 Posts: 22,385 Lives Here
    kingrollo wrote:
    My thoughts on ti are that it used to mean hand made...but nowadays u get mass produced to....

    Not necessarily a bad thing - but ti doesn't shout 'high end' like it used to...

    All imo of course...
    As Step said further up the thread ti is harder to weld as it can't be done under normal atmospheric conditions so is more labour intensive and requires more specialist equipment.
    I'd think ti is more comparable to a stainless steel like 953 than other steels, then the price for ti looks more attractive.
  • step83step83 Posts: 3,737
    keef66 wrote:
    Right, you lot have talked me out of it. I'm now thinking my forever bike when I raid my pension pot is going to be custom built in some kind of fancy steel...


    953, spirit or XCR. To be honest though at that end of the market a custom Ti will probably cost about the same (maybe a smidge more because special welding), depending which type of Ti you go with, ones actually harder to work but both are more than suitable for bikes.

    If your going custom find a frame maker you like/get on with an discuss options, they will give you the pro's an cons an whats suited to your build.
  • First.AspectFirst.Aspect Posts: 3,608
    keef66 wrote:
    Right, you lot have talked me out of it. I'm now thinking my forever bike when I raid my pension pot is going to be custom built in some kind of fancy steel...
    You've now given everyone the idea of raiding the pension pot to buy a bike. Why did you do that? I can't unthink it now.
  • kingrollokingrollo Posts: 3,147
    kingrollo wrote:
    My thoughts on ti are that it used to mean hand made...but nowadays u get mass produced to....

    Not necessarily a bad thing - but ti doesn't shout 'high end' like it used to...

    All imo of course...
    When you think of hand made, do you have in mind a man wearing rubber gloves putting the electrodes in the melt by hand, a man with an anvil beating the metal into sheets and bending and welding them into tubes, or do you just mean some bloke with a tig welder sticking the ends of tubes together? Because if.its just the last bit I'm pretty sure they are all hand made. Only the cheapest ones are the result of child labour though.


    No I wasn't thinking any of that.

    I just offered my opinion as to why (imo, imo, and once more imo) as to why titanium doesn't appeal to me like it once did.

    But thanks for the science lesson
  • ugo.santaluciaugo.santalucia Posts: 24,380
    As many are aware, for 3-4 years I have dealt with people who wanted bespoke wheels... many of them had just bought their "forever bike", most of the latter replaced it within 12 months with a new bike.

    You don't get married to a bike and love for bikes comes and goes... fairly soon you will be attracted to a younger, fitter bike, so don't bother with the "forever" thing
  • alan_shermanalan_sherman Posts: 1,153
    I've had my Enigma Esprit for probably 10 years now. I love the fact that it still rides well and looks like new. The new price has doubled in that time though!

    I have a bit of an OCD thing about scratches. Ti, unpainted resolves that.
  • fenixfenix Posts: 5,283
    I think my third bike was my dream bike. Custom steel. My paint scheme. Pro team issue groupset and wheels. The best you could buy at the time and it wasn't hugely expensive but I was young and didnt have a mortgage.

    Lovely bike but it still got replaced a while later with carbon fibre.

    I was thinking of a Colnago for my 50th but 4 decades of cycling have shown me that its really not about the bike.
    Just get a nice one and maintain it.

    Current best bike is 7 years old I think and I'm perfectly happy with it - I'll only replace it if it breaks or I get a burning need for a new one. I'd not raid the pension pot for a bike - you can pay absolutely silly money for the top of the range stuff now - its far more than it was 30 years ago - and its so marginal the improvement. Keep the cash and take the bike off to ride some Alps or something.
  • WheelspinnerWheelspinner Posts: 4,689
    keef66 wrote:
    Right, you lot have talked me out of it. I'm now thinking my forever bike when I raid my pension pot is going to be custom built in some kind of fancy steel...
    Nah, this is what you want.

    http://hollandcycles.com/holland-exogrid/
  • keef66 wrote:
    Right, you lot have talked me out of it. I'm now thinking my forever bike when I raid my pension pot is going to be custom built in some kind of fancy steel...
    Nah, this is what you want.

    http://hollandcycles.com/holland-exogrid/
    Ooh, that's nice. That beats my fave which had been a Bastion road frame with its 3D printed sintered titanium lugs and wound carbon tubes;

    https://bastion-cycles.com/bastion-road-2/

    Or a No22 Reactor with two tone finish;

    https://22bicycles.com/collections/made ... e-to-order
  • handfulhandful Posts: 914
    I recently splashed out on a Ti and really like it but I do think the "magic carpet" is exaggerated. Yes it's more comfortable than my alu and carbon bikes but you still feel bumps and potholes. I didn't expect anything different though and I have no regrets. I do see it as my "forever bike" but that doesn't necessarily mean I won't buy more in the future! I do love the clean classic look of a Ti though and I'm not a huge fan of the latest square formed frames that seem to be the popular choice these days.
    Vaaru Titanium Sram eTap HRD
    Kuota Kharma Evo Rival 22 - fair weather
    Moda Chord with drop bars and Rival shifters - foul weather
    Intense Spider 29er - mud
  • pblakeneypblakeney Posts: 11,348
    fenix wrote:
    Just get a nice one and maintain it.
    That was my plan. Not sure it will be a "forever" bike, but it will be my "good" bike till it is unusable due to bike or rider. :wink: A Colnago Master that I got before the bubble and has covered @ 3k miles per year for 11 years and counting...
    #penniespermile
    #valueformoney
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • First.AspectFirst.Aspect Posts: 3,608
    kingrollo wrote:
    kingrollo wrote:
    My thoughts on ti are that it used to mean hand made...but nowadays u get mass produced to....

    Not necessarily a bad thing - but ti doesn't shout 'high end' like it used to...

    All imo of course...
    When you think of hand made, do you have in mind a man wearing rubber gloves putting the electrodes in the melt by hand, a man with an anvil beating the metal into sheets and bending and welding them into tubes, or do you just mean some bloke with a tig welder sticking the ends of tubes together? Because if.its just the last bit I'm pretty sure they are all hand made. Only the cheapest ones are the result of child labour though.


    No I wasn't thinking any of that.

    I just offered my opinion as to why (imo, imo, and once more imo) as to why titanium doesn't appeal to me like it once did.

    But thanks for the science lesson
    Don't overlook the sociology.
  • A forever bike? Is that like the forever friends you had at primary school? I worry that bike ownership is causing infantilism in some.

    Of the two I have they're markedly different to ride because there are too many variables and differences in the material use and construction to simply say they have that feel of titanium. Of the two it's the bargain-priced Planet X Spitfire that is much nicer to ride but, as I've said before, they're just bikes to be ridden and It's where they take you that's important
  • First.AspectFirst.Aspect Posts: 3,608
    A forever bike? Is that like the forever friends you had at primary school? I worry that bike ownership is causing infantilism in some
    No its more like a house you plan to retire in. Or a wife. Not all of us are philanderers like Ugo. Bad Ugo.
  • I think titanium is like any other material in that you get the light weight more performance orientated frames and you get the more basic straight gauge tubes which are heavier but should last an extremely long time. Modern techniques for titanium allow for butted tubes or even milling tubes to reduce weight. In the past it seemed like titanium was almost indestructible but nowadays it seems like cracks in titanium frames are quite common and also titanium seems to have become more competitive in weight so I'm assuming perhaps wrongly that many titanium frames today are weaker performance orientated frames. Same as steel basically where the straight gauge frames with little or no concern about weight seem to last forever but high end italian frames with exceptional thin tubing are exceptionally weak.

    So I think you have to look at the detail of the specification of a titanium frame to understand its full properties. They aren't all the same. I don't have a titanium bike due to cost but must admit I find the material incredibly appealing. The mere touch of titanium seems somehow special and find bare titanium bikes the most appealing visually. In contrast I don't actually like the looks of CF bikes that much due to their plastic look plus I find retro styling more appealing.

    I'm only a casual cyclist and often leave bikes in areas of potential theft or risk of getting damaged so not really a practical choice for me anyway. There is something like 4 million active regular cyclists in the UK I think of which there are 400,000 approx bicycle thefts per year. If I joined a cycle club and was with my bike all the time then perhaps bragging rights and a nice titanium bike would make sense but a nice titanium bike outside my local tesco while I was inside for 45 minutes would add to my stress levels I think. I remember looking at a Brompton bicycle outside a pub only to see someone at the window looking extremely stressed in my direction while I was looking at it. In fact I moved away from the bike quicker than I planned just because the person looked so upset. I would be exactly the same with a titanium bike.
  • cougiecougie Posts: 22,512
    The whole point of the Brompton is that you take it with you ? Mine is never left outside. Crazy Fool.
  • wongataa wrote:
    I would like a titanium bike because I think titanium looks great unpainted and it doesn't rust.

    It certainly does look great unpainted but that cliche they never rust ! Not one of my bikes of any material ever rusted !
  • wongataa wrote:
    I would like a titanium bike because I think titanium looks great unpainted and it doesn't rust.

    It certainly does look great unpainted but that cliche they never rust ! Not one of my bikes of any material ever rusted !
    You could equally anecdotally claim that from where you're standing the earth is flat, but the earth isn't flat and the chemical reaction of metals with other elements is known.
  • wongataawongataa Posts: 854
    wongataa wrote:
    I would like a titanium bike because I think titanium looks great unpainted and it doesn't rust.

    It certainly does look great unpainted but that cliche they never rust ! Not one of my bikes of any material ever rusted !
    Well only bikes made from iron based materials (steel usually for bikes) can rust. Yes, you can keep steel bikes rust free but that is harder if you want the unpainted look (unless you fork out for stainless steel which can still rust)!
  • ugo.santaluciaugo.santalucia Posts: 24,380
    wongataa wrote:
    I would like a titanium bike because I think titanium looks great unpainted and it doesn't rust.

    It certainly does look great unpainted but that cliche they never rust ! Not one of my bikes of any material ever rusted !
    You could equally anecdotally claim that from where you're standing the earth is flat, but the earth isn't flat and the chemical reaction of metals with other elements is known.

    But that's why steel frames are treated and painted. Rust is only a problem when the paint chips off or somehow moisture makes its way inside the tubes.

    In the vast majority of cases, rust sets in well after the owner has lost any interest in said frame and often comes as a relief, as it offers an excuse to buy a new one
  • MatthewfalleMatthewfalle Posts: 17,571
    , but the earth isn't flat.


    utter rubbish. TROLL.

    Prove it

    #evidenceplease
    Postby team47b » Sun Jun 28, 2015 11:53 am

    De Sisti wrote:
    This is one of the silliest threads I've come across. :lol:

    Recognition at last Matthew, well done!, a justified honour :D
    smithy21 wrote:

    He's right you know.
  • cougie wrote:
    The whole point of the Brompton is that you take it with you ? Mine is never left outside. Crazy Fool.

    It was setup for touring, fully loaded and would have been difficult to dismantle to get into the pub I would of thought and he clearly was maintaining eye contact with it at all times.
  • First.AspectFirst.Aspect Posts: 3,608
    wongataa wrote:
    I would like a titanium bike because I think titanium looks great unpainted and it doesn't rust.

    It certainly does look great unpainted but that cliche they never rust ! Not one of my bikes of any material ever rusted !
    You could equally anecdotally claim that from where you're standing the earth is flat, but the earth isn't flat and the chemical reaction of metals with other elements is known.

    But that's why steel frames are treated and painted. Rust is only a problem when the paint chips off or somehow moisture makes its way inside the tubes.

    In the vast majority of cases, rust sets in well after the owner has lost any interest in said frame and often comes as a relief, as it offers an excuse to buy a new one
    Yes, like when the mascara and eye shadow is washed off, in the morning.
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