"Ninjas"

pblakeney

mfin wrote:

Bikes`n`guns wrote:

mfin wrote:

Fluro colours out in the lanes often make you stand out. It's the lack of that kind of colour naturally occurring in those environments that makes it so. It is pretty obvious.

Whether you choose to wear stuff like this is up to you. There are so many variables involved in accidents that it is too difficult to generalise.

I can think of plenty of times which riders in dark clothing I haven't seen until quite late when driving in the day, but I can't think of a single example of the same happening when a rider is dressed 'loud'. Now I know that's not in any way a statistic that proves anything, and we're talking B-roads and lanes here, but I am constantly aware of the potential presence of cyclists as I am one.

I'll never understand how people can say all colours are the same, as it's proven with car colours, green get accidents more in this country for example, so do black.

I've got no agenda here as I don't wear fluro myself, and do wear some black kit, but I also lessen the chances of being hit by not riding like a turd who assumes for one second people have seen me (an amazing amount of people don't do this).

Contrast.

Yep, the contrast being that I've articulated it reasonably well using basic communication skills and you haven't at all

Put your fluro in front of a field of rapeseed.

fenix

You're really plucking at straws now. How many Miles of your riding is done past rape seed ?

Bright colours stand out. Actually rapeseed proves the point. Flowers are Bright to attract the insects. You can see rapeseed miles off. Dress in black and ride down a hedgerow and you won't stand out as much as you would in Bright colour. If every ride you do doesn't prove this then I think your eyesight is playing up.

pblakeney

Fenix wrote:

You're really plucking at straws now. How many Miles of your riding is done past rape seed ?

Bright colours stand out. Actually rapeseed proves the point. Flowers are Bright to attract the insects. You can see rapeseed miles off. Dress in black and ride down a hedgerow and you won't stand out as much as you would in Bright colour. If every ride you do doesn't prove this then I think your eyesight is playing up.

First question, quite a lot in Spring.
Second question, my eyesight is fine. I was driving in dull conditions through rain today and could see dark dressed pedestrians 100m away. Drivers using SMIDSY are either liars or are not paying attention.

cougie

Bikes`n`guns wrote:

That shows that reflective material is visible at 100m Bright yellow is not more visible than black.

When will people realise that it is CONTRAST that makes people notice you.

Where do you get that from? In the first test in low light - so not darkness - fluo yellow was more visible than a rear light. 100m away they could see it. As opposed to 20m for black.

I'm not talking about darkness here - as it's bleeding obvious that reflectives are a good idea if cars have headlights on.

mfin

PBlakeney wrote:

Fenix wrote:

You're really plucking at straws now. How many Miles of your riding is done past rape seed ?

Bright colours stand out. Actually rapeseed proves the point. Flowers are Bright to attract the insects. You can see rapeseed miles off. Dress in black and ride down a hedgerow and you won't stand out as much as you would in Bright colour. If every ride you do doesn't prove this then I think your eyesight is playing up.

First question, quite a lot in Spring.
Second question, my eyesight is fine. I was driving in dull conditions through rain today and could see dark dressed pedestrians 100m away. Drivers using SMIDSY are either liars or are not paying attention.

Ah, did you see every dark dressed pedestrian 100m away though? You can't possibly know. You might be the most aware driver in the world, but loads of people aren't, they are the ones who hit people.

As for SMIDSY drivers, absolutely they aren't paying attention (unless they are hitting people on purpose and lying, which must be next to naff all of them ever), which is why people who are more noticeably dressed are more likely to grab these people's attention, that's the whole point.

You're not showing much logic at all.

Your example of Fluro not being good against a rape seed background is simply ridiculous, do you really think for massive amounts of cycling even in that season you are in the eyeline of drivers upon a rapeseed background? Plus ignoring green hedges which are actually in the way most of the time. Rubbish.

Wear what you want, I don't wear Fluro, but don't ignore basic logic in these arguments.

tangled_metal

Cheap flashing light worse than hi viz? Buy a good flashing light then! My preference is cateye x2 which has IIRC 100 lumens visible from a very wide angle. I also use up to 2 other lights with it on a mix of different flashing patterns and one not flashing. That's on the rear. The front has a 300 lumen cateye light and a 50 lumen back up. I switch between flashing and non-flashing, one on each. They also have reasonable side visibility. Then winter commutes I put on wheel lighting on the front wheel. My bike has reflective tyres, mudguards and other reflective patches. In.daylight I'll put rear x2 light and a battery light I have attached to my rack. That's if the light is a bit dull, overcast or raining. If sunny and good visibility I rely on drivers looking where they're going and my road position.

However, I wear whatever clothes I want to for the cycling I do. Commuting in winter I'm wearing clothes that will keep me warm if it's cold or I'm wet. Summer I'm wearing shorts and whatever wicking t-shirt I have that's clean. Leisure cycling isn't much.different. I'm not into full on Lycra, more a baggies and loose t-shirt cyclist (although it's usually a snug fitting walking base layer). I don't own hi viz tops. My most hi viz is red / black with reflectives on right shoulder and back.

So, how much more visible will yellow really make me? You're visible or your not. I'm pretty sure I'm visible since I've never been hit or had any near miss that's not attributable to an ignorant driver who saw me but didn't give be sufficient distance. So far.the worst offenders are buses, some of those trucks with extending trailers without a bed used to carry concrete beams and the occasional artic.

So yellow vest might make the driver see me at 100m away and without it about 50m. Hmmm! The driver is 0m away when I'm hit so provided they have enough time to slow, stop or manoeuvre around me then I'll visible enough. Seriously if wearing hi viz is so critical then how have I lived as long as I have? I've never had an accident or even come close. Well close once when I got honked violently by a car that had snuck up on me. He'd run quietly down a bit of a hill quicker than I expected to about 1 foot from my rear wheel before deliberately trying to give me the shock of my life. It was and it made me swerve so bad that I nearly came off and under his wheel. That wouldn't have happened if the guy wasn't a real tool who had seen me and wanted his anti-cyclist fun. Driving a little white van too but IME white van drivers tend to be reasonable drivers.

So whilst I see that bright, hi viz is more visible than what I wear I still feel I'm more than visible.enough to be safe. If it makes you lot happy I'll consider hiviz when I decide to buy cycling specific jacket. Oh, I'll also put on a helmet too. I'll be completely safe then.

fenix

Of course its not critical to wear fluo. But it's not a bad idea.
So in your scenarios youd be visible for twice as long in fluo than black. So the driver has double the time to actually see you there and take appropriate action.

If the driver iis good then you'd be fine. If its a bad, blind, distracted driver than why wouldn't you wear kit that gives you a greater chance ?

I've been riding decades and the roads have never been worse. After losing friends to drivers hitting them in broad daylight iim not prepared to leave my safety to luck.

Bright light. Bright colours. It's by no means foolproof but it's a lot better than no lights and black colours.

bikes`n`guns

mfin wrote:

Bikes`n`guns wrote:

mfin wrote:

Fluro colours out in the lanes often make you stand out. It's the lack of that kind of colour naturally occurring in those environments that makes it so. It is pretty obvious.

Whether you choose to wear stuff like this is up to you. There are so many variables involved in accidents that it is too difficult to generalise.

I can think of plenty of times which riders in dark clothing I haven't seen until quite late when driving in the day, but I can't think of a single example of the same happening when a rider is dressed 'loud'. Now I know that's not in any way a statistic that proves anything, and we're talking B-roads and lanes here, but I am constantly aware of the potential presence of cyclists as I am one.

I'll never understand how people can say all colours are the same, as it's proven with car colours, green get accidents more in this country for example, so do black.

I've got no agenda here as I don't wear fluro myself, and do wear some black kit, but I also lessen the chances of being hit by not riding like a turd who assumes for one second people have seen me (an amazing amount of people don't do this).

Contrast.

Yep, the contrast being that I've articulated it reasonably well using basic communication skills and you haven't at all

Cheers for that. I bow to your superior communication skills .

Less so to your being a dick skills.