Road teams for Rio

Pross

RichN95 wrote:

In 2004 UK went to the Olympics with a Road Race team of Hammond (who did well), Wegelius, Winn and Dangerfield. Now we're arguing whether a two time Tour winner should be selected on a climber's course.

I don't think anyone has suggested he shouldn't be selected. Certainly in my case I was arguing that he is not necessarily our best chance for a win. There's always a chance he can go solo on the last climb or in a group that doesn't contain anyone with a decent sprint (actually, I think Froome could do alright in a flat sprint from a small group of climbers but we've never really seen proof of this in a race situation and I wouldn't back him against Valverde, Alaphillipe or several others including Yates).

dish_dash

Cummings doesn't seem happy to have been left out. Calling for Ellingworth to resign, says conflicted by his role at Team Sky...

effillo

As much as I like Cummings it is hard to disagree with the squad when you look at what they can all do over the roads of TdF and classics. Pete is the only question mark as to where his fitness is, but as he showed earlier in the year in Oz and previously in nationals, he is more than capable of getting away on a course that's a little lumpy. I think it's a good team, I'd be suprised if we got gold, potentially a medal though.

As far as calling for Ellingworth to quit, you have to remember just what he has done for team GB road cycling, is there a better man out there for the job, sky links or no sky links.

gsk82

What did Cummings think he can actually add to the team? It's too tough for him to win and he's not a team player. GB are all in for Froome and have picked a team to support him.

takethehighroad

A good test of how much of a team player Cummings is today. If he has pretentions to say he is, he'll be helping Cav in the crosswinds on the run in to the finish

DeVlaeminck

He probably feels he was under rated at Sky and given the links between Sky and BC that his non-selection is just a continuation of that. To be fair I can see his point but BC tend to go for an all for one approach and if they are going to do that I can't really see why Cummings is that bothered as he isn't going to be that one.

I haven't looked at the parcours beyond knowing it's tough but if there is any chance he could be there in any selection he has shown he can win a race so maybe he thinks he should be there as a second card to play.

TheBigBean

Cummings rode on the front a lot today.

andyp

Whereas Emma Pooley was way off the back in the Giro Rosa. Finished 12 minutes down on a moderately hilly stage.

rick_chasey

For the men's it's a bit irrelevant - they won't get on the podium so not worth falling out over it.

TheBigBean

Rick Chasey wrote:

For the men's it's a bit irrelevant - they won't get on the podium so not worth falling out over it.

That's the most likely outcome, but it would be nice to at least try to win.

PuttyKnees

andyp wrote:

Whereas Emma Pooley was way off the back in the Giro Rosa. Finished 12 minutes down on a moderately hilly stage.

This really doesn't bode well at all. I think that there must be a growing argument to take Weaver to Rio in her place. Since there is no coverage at all of the race it's difficult to know exactly how the race unfolded, but 12 mins behind seems way way off the pace.

awavey

PuttyKnees wrote:

andyp wrote:

Whereas Emma Pooley was way off the back in the Giro Rosa. Finished 12 minutes down on a moderately hilly stage.

This really doesn't bode well at all. I think that there must be a growing argument to take Weaver to Rio in her place. Since there is no coverage at all of the race it's difficult to know exactly how the race unfolded, but 12 mins behind seems way way off the pace.

there are brief highlights of the days stages on the UCI youtube channel, but delayed by a day and obviously dont focus on all the riders, so might not pick up what happened today with the tail group it looks like she was probably in, but she lost 10mins on just todays stage, and finished alone over 5mins off her nearest teammate.

stages 5 & 6 look to be the big mountain stages, and then stage 7 is the ITT.

rick_chasey

TheBigBean wrote:

Rick Chasey wrote:

For the men's it's a bit irrelevant - they won't get on the podium so not worth falling out over it.

That's the most likely outcome, but it would be nice to at least try to win.

In which case, what's the likeliest scenario a Brit wins?

Group goes away, favourites play too much poker, right?

Separately...

I've often wondered why Froome isn't good in one days. I mean miles away.

Maybe this route is selective enough that it will remove the skill element and leave it to legs.

TheBigBean

More likely that the favourites don't ride the race quick enough as they lack teams and enthusiastic riders to drill it on the front. Someone then attacks near the end and wins as the others look at each other.

rick_chasey

Yeah.

If I see GB doing work on the front of the peloton at any point during this race I'll lose my sh!t.

andyp

Details are scant, but it sounds like Emma Pooley put in a good ride on the first big mountain stage in the Giro Rosa. She was, I believe, second over the top of the Mortirolo.

awavey

andyp wrote:

Details are scant, but it sounds like Emma Pooley put in a good ride on the first big mountain stage in the Giro Rosa. She was, I believe, second over the top of the Mortirolo.

yep, I said I thought stage 5 would be one of the ones to look for but how much Mortirolo took out of her for stage 6 as that looks to be another tough set of climbs to contest over.

RichN95.

Italian team announced: Nibali, Aru, D.Caruso, De Marchi and Rosa.

I'm surprised by the absence of Ulissi.

DeadCalm

Rick Chasey wrote:

TheBigBean wrote:

Rick Chasey wrote:

For the men's it's a bit irrelevant - they won't get on the podium so not worth falling out over it.

That's the most likely outcome, but it would be nice to at least try to win.

In which case, what's the likeliest scenario a Brit wins?

Group goes away, favourites play too much poker, right?

Cummings goes in the break. Froome and Yates sit in the group of favourites doing no work. One or other attacks in the final kms of the last climb, assuming the break has been brought back by then.

The selection however suggests they will try to boss the group of favourites in which case there is almost no scenario where they can win unless all the other countries are collectively so in awe of Froome that they basically hand him the win on a plate.

takethehighroad

DeadCalm wrote:

Rick Chasey wrote:

TheBigBean wrote:

Rick Chasey wrote:

For the men's it's a bit irrelevant - they won't get on the podium so not worth falling out over it.

That's the most likely outcome, but it would be nice to at least try to win.

In which case, what's the likeliest scenario a Brit wins?

Group goes away, favourites play too much poker, right?

Cummings goes in the break. Froome and Yates sit in the group of favourites doing no work. One or other attacks in the final kms of the last climb, assuming the break has been brought back by then.

The selection however suggests they will try to boss the group of favourites in which case there is almost no scenario where they can win unless all the other countries are collectively so in awe of Froome that they basically hand him the win on a plate.

You have seen World Championships/Olympics Road Races before yes?

The "break" will be made up of riders from nations just happy to be there (I'm guessing Uzbekistan, Thailand and Brazil)

There will then be a top tier break with about 50-60k to go, where semi favourites will send team mates up the road (aka Voeckler time)

This is potentially the time when you'd send Cummings, but the course will be so selective that this group will naturally come back without too much extra effort from the group, hence not useful to have him in the team.

When you've only got 5 riders there's no room for a free bird like Cummings, as good as I think he is at that role

DeadCalm

TakeTheHighRoad wrote:

DeadCalm wrote:

Rick Chasey wrote:

TheBigBean wrote:

Rick Chasey wrote:

For the men's it's a bit irrelevant - they won't get on the podium so not worth falling out over it.

That's the most likely outcome, but it would be nice to at least try to win.

In which case, what's the likeliest scenario a Brit wins?

Group goes away, favourites play too much poker, right?

Cummings goes in the break. Froome and Yates sit in the group of favourites doing no work. One or other attacks in the final kms of the last climb, assuming the break has been brought back by then.

The selection however suggests they will try to boss the group of favourites in which case there is almost no scenario where they can win unless all the other countries are collectively so in awe of Froome that they basically hand him the win on a plate.

You have seen World Championships/Olympics Road Races before yes?

The "break" will be made up of riders from nations just happy to be there (I'm guessing Uzbekistan, Thailand and Brazil)

There will then be a top tier break with about 50-60k to go, where semi favourites will send team mates up the road (aka Voeckler time)

This is potentially the time when you'd send Cummings, but the course will be so selective that this group will naturally come back without too much extra effort from the group, hence not useful to have him in the team.

When you've only got 5 riders there's no room for a free bird like Cummings, as good as I think he is at that role

Funnily enough, I see a little bit of Voeckler in the way Cummings has been riding recently. Not the TV Tommy showman nonsense but the tactically astute breakaway rider.

The semi favourites group will probably come back, yes. But one or more teams will need to keep it under control. Having Cummings in that break will mean Froome and Yates can simply sit on. In other words I think that Cummings has a slim to zero chance of actually winning it himself but, by appearing to be doing his own thing, can contribute more to Froome's cause than a loyal Stannard hanging with Froome for as long as possible.

phreak

DeadCalm wrote:

TakeTheHighRoad wrote:

DeadCalm wrote:

Rick Chasey wrote:

TheBigBean wrote:

Rick Chasey wrote:

For the men's it's a bit irrelevant - they won't get on the podium so not worth falling out over it.

That's the most likely outcome, but it would be nice to at least try to win.

In which case, what's the likeliest scenario a Brit wins?

Group goes away, favourites play too much poker, right?

Cummings goes in the break. Froome and Yates sit in the group of favourites doing no work. One or other attacks in the final kms of the last climb, assuming the break has been brought back by then.

The selection however suggests they will try to boss the group of favourites in which case there is almost no scenario where they can win unless all the other countries are collectively so in awe of Froome that they basically hand him the win on a plate.

You have seen World Championships/Olympics Road Races before yes?

The "break" will be made up of riders from nations just happy to be there (I'm guessing Uzbekistan, Thailand and Brazil)

There will then be a top tier break with about 50-60k to go, where semi favourites will send team mates up the road (aka Voeckler time)

This is potentially the time when you'd send Cummings, but the course will be so selective that this group will naturally come back without too much extra effort from the group, hence not useful to have him in the team.

When you've only got 5 riders there's no room for a free bird like Cummings, as good as I think he is at that role

Funnily enough, I see a little bit of Voeckler in the way Cummings has been riding recently. Not the TV Tommy showman nonsense but the tactically astute breakaway rider.

The semi favourites group will probably come back, yes. But one or more teams will need to keep it under control. Having Cummings in that break will mean Froome and Yates can simply sit on. In other words I think that Cummings has a slim to zero chance of actually winning it himself but, by appearing to be doing his own thing, can contribute more to Froome's cause than a loyal Stannard hanging with Froome for as long as possible.

Another scenario is that teams think we (Britain) have 1st and 3rd in the Tour in our ranks and won't let any break with a British rider in it get anywhere up the road. I mean would you expect other teams to be happy for a Spanish rider to get in the break so Valverde can sit in the bunch?

As it is, you'd imagine the thinking is that Stannard would be used in the first half of the race, with each of the remaining four then possible when the race gets more selective.

ic.

Peter K has stepped down as Steve Cummings is now in the Rio squad

carbonclem

IC. wrote:

Peter K has stepped down as Steve Cummings is now in the Rio squad

Just saw this. Fair play to lil Pete. Good news for Steve

Mad_Malx

Respect to Pete, that must have been a very difficult call to make.
After seeing Froome doing his ridiculous crossbar pedalling I've changed my mind about GB prospects, and Stevo as a wildcard might help this.
Always strikes me that the RR should be a team sport - it's a bit like giving the hockey/football/volleyball medal to the highest scorer.

MTN Chewbacca

Portugal: Costa, André Cardoso, Zé Mendes, Nélson Oliveira.

Oliveira will do the TT as well.

RichN95.

Quintana has withdrawn - to be replaced by Pantano or Anacona

Zakarin has been excluded as Russians with previous convictions are not welcome.

rick_chasey

Pantano please.

Moraygub

RichN95 wrote:

Quintana has withdrawn - to be replaced by Pantano or Anacona

Zakarin has been excluded as Russians with previous convictions are not welcome.

Is that the case though as i understand it the UCI are of a mind to allow the Russians to compete given that each orginisation are now free to make up their own mind on it.
Zakarin is not banned but would be if he was to compete under a neutral flag like the Russian whistleblower runner.

Edit : Just noticed that they have specified any athlete having had a doping ban is banned. Personally i think that's wrong as other competitors previously banned are allowed to compete.

iainf72

Moraygub wrote:

Edit : Just noticed that they have specified any athlete having had a doping ban is banned. Personally i think that's wrong as other competitors previously banned are allowed to compete.

It will be thrown out by CAS too. You can't punish someone twice for the same offence.