Donald Trump

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  • capt_slog
    capt_slog Posts: 3,946
    It was sickening to watch him announcing the assassination.

    I don't know enough of the ins and outs of the politics of Iran to understand whether the act was good or a bad thing (although I suspect it's the latter), but the way he was posing and leaving the gaps for the absent applause had me shouting at the TV.

    Announce it if you wish, just don't stand there and act like a hero. He wouldn't be quite so brave if the Atlantic wasn't between him and Iran


    The older I get, the better I was.

  • pblakeney
    pblakeney Posts: 25,768
    How many Iranians, or supporters, are already in the U.S.A.?
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 72,681
    edited January 2020
    pblakeney said:

    How many Iranians, or supporters, are already in the U.S.A.?

    I don't understand your 'or supporters' bit.

    Plenty of Iranians in the US - there was a whole exodus of people from Iran to the West during the revolution.

    Would suggest it is difficult to assume they are supporters of the current Iranian gov't.
    _
  • pblakeney
    pblakeney Posts: 25,768
    "or supporters" being people who are not Iranian but side with Iranians against the U.S.A.
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 72,681
    pblakeney said:

    "or supporters" being people who are not Iranian but side with Iranians against the U.S.A.

    You're not gonna find many in the US tbh, though I'm sure Fox etc will have their best people out to find them and give them *as much air time as possible*.
    _
  • coopster_the_1st
    coopster_the_1st Posts: 5,158
    pblakeney said:

    "or supporters" being people who are not Iranian but side with Iranians against the U.S.A.

    You mean like the Democrats?

    The political bias of those who hate Trump is seriously clouding their judgement on this matter
  • pblakeney
    pblakeney Posts: 25,768
    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    "or supporters" being people who are not Iranian but side with Iranians against the U.S.A.

    You're not gonna find many in the US tbh, though I'm sure Fox etc will have their best people out to find them and give them *as much air time as possible*.
    You don't need many to be effective.
    You don't think that there are sleepers in the USA, or here?
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 72,681
    edited January 2020
    Oh you are referring to wannabe terrorists?

    Out of interest, is there much difference to Trump threatening to use the US airforce to bomb Iranian cultural sites and Iran suggesting they would want to use terrorists to bomb US cultural sites?
    _
  • pblakeney
    pblakeney Posts: 25,768
    edited January 2020
    Yes, and none.

    Think about a strategy for Iran. They cannot beat the USA in a straight-out war. They cannot defend themselves from attack. Their only strategies are guerrilla warfare or complete surrender.
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 72,681
    pblakeney said:

    Yes, and none.

    Think about a strategy for Iran. They cannot beat the USA in a straight-out war. They cannot defend themselves from attack. Their only strategies are guerrilla warfare or complete surrender.

    The strategy is quite clear. Iran is the main power left in the ME after US waged war against its two neighbours.

    Like any nation it wants the leverage of nuclear weapons. It got some leverage from halting that in return for reduced sanctions. US basically ignored that agreement, so why bother complying?

    The sanctions are hurting, so they need to get their leverage other ways.

    Iran doesn't want a war with the US. It seems only really Bolton and a few other hawks want this war to happen. I doubt even Trump wants it tbh.
    _
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 26,239
    pblakeney said:

    Yes, and none.

    Think about a strategy for Iran. They cannot beat the USA in a straight-out war. They cannot defend themselves from attack. Their only strategies are guerrilla warfare or complete surrender.

    What would winning look like for the USA?
  • Longshot
    Longshot Posts: 940
    kingstongraham said:

    pblakeney said:

    Yes, and none.

    Think about a strategy for Iran. They cannot beat the USA in a straight-out war. They cannot defend themselves from attack. Their only strategies are guerrilla warfare or complete surrender.

    What would winning look like for the USA?
    Bigly. That's what it would look like.
    You can fool some of the people all of the time. Concentrate on those people.
  • pblakeney
    pblakeney Posts: 25,768
    kingstongraham said:

    pblakeney said:

    Yes, and none.

    Think about a strategy for Iran. They cannot beat the USA in a straight-out war. They cannot defend themselves from attack. Their only strategies are guerrilla warfare or complete surrender.

    What would winning look like for the USA?
    Winning would be a puppet in charge and control of the oil and related contracts.
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • step83
    step83 Posts: 4,170
    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    Yes, and none.

    Think about a strategy for Iran. They cannot beat the USA in a straight-out war. They cannot defend themselves from attack. Their only strategies are guerrilla warfare or complete surrender.

    The strategy is quite clear. Iran is the main power left in the ME after US waged war against its two neighbours.

    Like any nation it wants the leverage of nuclear weapons. It got some leverage from halting that in return for reduced sanctions. US basically ignored that agreement, so why bother complying?

    The sanctions are hurting, so they need to get their leverage other ways.

    Iran doesn't want a war with the US. It seems only really Bolton and a few other hawks want this war to happen. I doubt even Trump wants it tbh.
    Trump won't want a war anywhere as it means he goes back on his pledge to get troops out.
    The drone strike was likely motivated along the lines of promoting himself for his next term, showing he "cares for Americans". This despite a lot of evidence is appearing that advisers etc recommended against doing it but it happened none the less.

    Its going to start a tit for tat spate of attacks Iran attacking an embassy and wanting the removal of US personnel from the area which given the situation is probably not a bad idea for both sides.

    It will probably end up in Trump whacking comically crippling sanctions on them and then doing what he likes most which is making a deal.
    Titanium Px Spitfire
    Easty commuter
    Tripster AT
  • orraloon
    orraloon Posts: 12,682
    step83 said:

    It will probably end up in Trump whacking comically crippling sanctions on them and then doing what he likes most which is making a deal.

    The most recent episode of LA's The Forward podcast is with Chris Voss who in his time has been a chief negotiator in the FBI, dealing with hostage situations etc.

    Paraphrasing his view on der Drumpf's 'negotiating' style confirms what we all see: is a bully, punches down, does not negotiate, just plays from position of strength. Which makes the other party start to avoid, withdraw.

    Oh what a happy world we inhabit.
  • step83
    step83 Posts: 4,170
    orraloon said:

    step83 said:

    It will probably end up in Trump whacking comically crippling sanctions on them and then doing what he likes most which is making a deal.

    The most recent episode of LA's The Forward podcast is with Chris Voss who in his time has been a chief negotiator in the FBI, dealing with hostage situations etc.

    Paraphrasing his view on der Drumpf's 'negotiating' style confirms what we all see: is a bully, punches down, does not negotiate, just plays from position of strength. Which makes the other party start to avoid, withdraw.

    Oh what a happy world we inhabit.
    Isn't it just. Stupid thing is his supporters seem blind to his blatant bullying tactics they just think he is protecting Murica

    Either way I would guess the Persian Gulf an more so the Straits of Hormuz are going to be full of rather worried tankers and container vessels currently.
    Titanium Px Spitfire
    Easty commuter
    Tripster AT
  • Longshot
    Longshot Posts: 940
    Not as worried as the lady who works in the ticket office at the Tehran Centre of Culture and Arts.
    You can fool some of the people all of the time. Concentrate on those people.
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 26,239
    His "despite what my secretary of state said about me not wanting to bomb cultural sites because that would be a war crime, I would like to clarify that I do actually want to bomb cultural sites" statement is pretty funny. He'd be more funny if he wasn't actually killing people though.
  • pinno
    pinno Posts: 51,340
    In the ruins of the old industrial sites in Pennsylvania, new technology industry was emerging like a Phoenix form the ashes: Solar power and PV panels. Obama created the climate to produce it.
    But... we know what happens next.

    Odd that a country with all that wealth cannot wean themselves off fossil fuels so that they are not in constant conflict and need of crude oil producing nations.

    One for the irony thread.
    seanoconn - gruagach craic!
  • ballysmate
    ballysmate Posts: 15,921
    pinno said:

    In the ruins of the old industrial sites in Pennsylvania, new technology industry was emerging like a Phoenix form the ashes: Solar power and PV panels. Obama created the climate to produce it.
    But... we know what happens next.

    Odd that a country with all that wealth cannot wean themselves off fossil fuels so that they are not in constant conflict and need of crude oil producing nations.

    One for the irony thread.

    Yeah, Bomber Obama has a lot to answer for. ;)

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jan/09/america-dropped-26171-bombs-2016-obama-legacy
  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 58,492
    ballysmate said:

    pinno said:

    In the ruins of the old industrial sites in Pennsylvania, new technology industry was emerging like a Phoenix form the ashes: Solar power and PV panels. Obama created the climate to produce it.
    But... we know what happens next.

    Odd that a country with all that wealth cannot wean themselves off fossil fuels so that they are not in constant conflict and need of crude oil producing nations.

    One for the irony thread.

    Yeah, Bomber Obama has a lot to answer for. ;)

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jan/09/america-dropped-26171-bombs-2016-obama-legacy
    Maybe Pinno is talking about Global warming when he mentions creating the climate?
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • ballysmate
    ballysmate Posts: 15,921
    Stevo_666 said:

    ballysmate said:

    pinno said:

    In the ruins of the old industrial sites in Pennsylvania, new technology industry was emerging like a Phoenix form the ashes: Solar power and PV panels. Obama created the climate to produce it.
    But... we know what happens next.

    Odd that a country with all that wealth cannot wean themselves off fossil fuels so that they are not in constant conflict and need of crude oil producing nations.

    One for the irony thread.

    Yeah, Bomber Obama has a lot to answer for. ;)

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jan/09/america-dropped-26171-bombs-2016-obama-legacy
    Maybe Pinno is talking about Global warming when he mentions creating the climate?
    Undoubtedly. But never could resist the chance to show that the darling of the left had feet of clay.
    In constant conflict, as Pinno puts it, by bombing the fcuk out of the ME.
  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 58,492
    ballysmate said:

    Stevo_666 said:

    ballysmate said:

    pinno said:

    In the ruins of the old industrial sites in Pennsylvania, new technology industry was emerging like a Phoenix form the ashes: Solar power and PV panels. Obama created the climate to produce it.
    But... we know what happens next.

    Odd that a country with all that wealth cannot wean themselves off fossil fuels so that they are not in constant conflict and need of crude oil producing nations.

    One for the irony thread.

    Yeah, Bomber Obama has a lot to answer for. ;)

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jan/09/america-dropped-26171-bombs-2016-obama-legacy
    Maybe Pinno is talking about Global warming when he mentions creating the climate?
    Undoubtedly. But never could resist the chance to show that the darling of the left had feet of clay.
    In constant conflict, as Pinno puts it, by bombing the fcuk out of the ME.
    A bit like Tony Blair then.
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • ballysmate
    ballysmate Posts: 15,921
    Out bombed Bush AND Blair, so he did.
  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 58,492
    ballysmate said:

    Out bombed Bush AND Blair AND Trump, so he did.

    FTFY.
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • ballysmate
    ballysmate Posts: 15,921
    edited January 2020
    Tbf though, he did tend to leave the big players alone, he preferred to bomb any Tom, D1ck or Abdul.
  • pinno
    pinno Posts: 51,340
    ballysmate said:

    pinno said:

    In the ruins of the old industrial sites in Pennsylvania, new technology industry was emerging like a Phoenix form the ashes: Solar power and PV panels. Obama created the climate to produce it.
    But... we know what happens next.

    Odd that a country with all that wealth cannot wean themselves off fossil fuels so that they are not in constant conflict and need of crude oil producing nations.

    One for the irony thread.

    Yeah, Bomber Obama has a lot to answer for. ;)

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jan/09/america-dropped-26171-bombs-2016-obama-legacy
    That's less than half of what Bush jnr dropped,,, and as for Bush snr... It's what 'Merican president's do.
    seanoconn - gruagach craic!
  • pinno
    pinno Posts: 51,340
    pinno said:

    ballysmate said:

    pinno said:

    In the ruins of the old industrial sites in Pennsylvania, new technology industry was emerging like a Phoenix form the ashes: Solar power and PV panels. Obama created the climate to produce it.
    But... we know what happens next.

    Odd that a country with all that wealth cannot wean themselves off fossil fuels so that they are not in constant conflict and need of crude oil producing nations.

    One for the irony thread.

    Yeah, Bomber Obama has a lot to answer for. ;)

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jan/09/america-dropped-26171-bombs-2016-obama-legacy
    That's less than half of what Bush jnr dropped,,, and as for Bush snr... It's what 'Merican president's do.
    None of the above detracts form a wealthy nation unable to wean themselves off fossil fuel.
    seanoconn - gruagach craic!
  • ballysmate
    ballysmate Posts: 15,921
    pinno said:

    pinno said:

    ballysmate said:

    pinno said:

    In the ruins of the old industrial sites in Pennsylvania, new technology industry was emerging like a Phoenix form the ashes: Solar power and PV panels. Obama created the climate to produce it.
    But... we know what happens next.

    Odd that a country with all that wealth cannot wean themselves off fossil fuels so that they are not in constant conflict and need of crude oil producing nations.

    One for the irony thread.

    Yeah, Bomber Obama has a lot to answer for. ;)

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jan/09/america-dropped-26171-bombs-2016-obama-legacy
    That's less than half of what Bush jnr dropped,,, and as for Bush snr... It's what 'Merican president's do.
    None of the above detracts form a wealthy nation unable to wean themselves off fossil fuel.
    As drone-warrior-in-chief, he spread the use of drones outside the declared battlefields of Afghanistan and Iraq, mainly to Pakistan and Yemen. Obama authorized over 10 times more drone strikes than George W Bush, and automatically painted all males of military age in these regions as combatants, making them fair game for remote controlled killing.

    Yeah, definitely marks him out as one of the good guys.

    And yes, they are unable/unwilling to wean themselves off fossil fuels. But then, so are we, are we not?
  • pinno
    pinno Posts: 51,340
    ballysmate said:


    And yes, they are unable/unwilling to wean themselves off fossil fuels. But then, so are we, are we not?

    Did you click on that Guardian link in my reply to WS?

    seanoconn - gruagach craic!

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