BREXIT - Is This Really Still Rumbling On? 😴
Comments
-
Parental leave and family commitments are a challenge to handle in any small professional business, especially one requiring long/unsociable hours.Dorset_Boy said:I have a sister who is a vet. Aparently, in their drive for equality in the profession, a disproportionately large number of females were offered places at vet school over the last 10-15 years or so. Now a lot of them have or are having families and don't want to work full time or the on call shift patterns, and this is a major problem for practices.
1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
garden's not big enoughrjsterry said:
You can always not have the pet. Just possibly, highly qualified professionals should be charging a decent amount when it costs them £100k to qualify.surrey_commuter said:
Mine charges like a wounded buffalo and drives an open top sports carelbowloh said:The cost per hour of treatment on your bill is generally not that much (certainly compared to a private doctor or a lawyer). They deliberately charge you relatively little for a vets time as otherwise more people would refuse to pay. The practise makes their money on the mark up for the drugs and tests etc i believe.
Or are you a horse owner?0 -
The shift patterns are often shit though. When in private practice the wife was expected to work 08.00-18.00 most days, with pretty much no breaks, on the days she was on lates it was like 11.00-21.00 and often on those lates she didn't come home until 23.00. Then it was 1 in four weekends on top of that (both Saturday and Sunday). I wouldn't want those hours, i'd want to work "part time" and end up working what equates to a regular 9-5.Dorset_Boy said:I have a sister who is a vet. Aparently, in their drive for equality in the profession, a disproportionately large number of females were offered places at vet school over the last 10-15 years or so. Now a lot of them have or are having families and don't want to work full time or the on call shift patterns, and this is a major problem for practices.
0 -
It's always a surprise to me that it seems to be the most difficult degree course to get a place on when those capable of the required grades could go for pretty much any course then go out and earn more.elbowloh said:
The shift patterns are often censored though. When in private practice the wife was expected to work 08.00-18.00 most days, with pretty much no breaks, on the days she was on lates it was like 11.00-21.00 and often on those lates she didn't come home until 23.00. Then it was 1 in four weekends on top of that (both Saturday and Sunday). I wouldn't want those hours, i'd want to work "part time" and end up working what equates to a regular 9-5.Dorset_Boy said:I have a sister who is a vet. Aparently, in their drive for equality in the profession, a disproportionately large number of females were offered places at vet school over the last 10-15 years or so. Now a lot of them have or are having families and don't want to work full time or the on call shift patterns, and this is a major problem for practices.
0 -
oh, and those Saturdays and Sundays were 9.00-21.00.Pross said:
It's always a surprise to me that it seems to be the most difficult degree course to get a place on when those capable of the required grades could go for pretty much any course then go out and earn more.elbowloh said:
The shift patterns are often censored though. When in private practice the wife was expected to work 08.00-18.00 most days, with pretty much no breaks, on the days she was on lates it was like 11.00-21.00 and often on those lates she didn't come home until 23.00. Then it was 1 in four weekends on top of that (both Saturday and Sunday). I wouldn't want those hours, i'd want to work "part time" and end up working what equates to a regular 9-5.Dorset_Boy said:I have a sister who is a vet. Aparently, in their drive for equality in the profession, a disproportionately large number of females were offered places at vet school over the last 10-15 years or so. Now a lot of them have or are having families and don't want to work full time or the on call shift patterns, and this is a major problem for practices.
The vet school courses have masses of applicants, it seems the practices were fine to burn their staff out as there were plenty more coming through the pipeline.0 -
Not all about the money?The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.0 -
For the vets themselves, many of them choose the profession, because they love animals (many are veggie or vegan for example), without realising that they actually spend a lot of their time putting animals to sleep, which is horrific for them.pblakeney said:Not all about the money?
For many, the worst thing is having to deal with the human clients who are quite often a-holes.
Just to note, most of this is just my own opinions from being around the wife and her colleagues often.0 -
-
Have you seen the shit NHS staff deal with at A&E? Its like that.rick_chasey said:Oh poor poor them, having to deal with people. Heavens above.
My wife has been threatened with violence by pet owners, is often sworn at. She's had people hanging around outside the door, day after day trying to harangue them on their way out of work.
She has to deal with 50 kilo aggressive dogs whose owners refuse to restrain or muzzle.
Do you get that in your job Rick? Don't be a dick when you have no idea what it's like.
3 -
I assume the issue is dealing with the way humans treat the animals.rick_chasey said:Oh poor poor them, having to deal with people. Heavens above.
0 -
There's that too.Pross said:
I assume the issue is dealing with the way humans treat the animals.rick_chasey said:Oh poor poor them, having to deal with people. Heavens above.
She has had to confiscate animals from owns who have mistreated them and also report owners to the RSPCA for criminal investigation and prosecution. There are also those who use their dogs for fighting and then bring them in for treatment (charity sector vets).
However, its mainly the threats of physical violence.0 -
Sure, I don't get threatened with violence.
I'm just commenting via my own prejudices. I have always thought it weird when people like animals more than people - always thought it was some sort of weird projection and lacking reality but what do I know (clue - not very much).
Don't take what I say all that seriously, honest!0 -
Oh, then to a lesser extent are the tw@ts who have Googled stuff in the internet and thibknthey know better how to treat their pet than the vet.1
-
Two of my best friends are vets and whenever all 3 of us together a lot of the conversation is them moaning about clients. Agree on the shifts too elbowloh - only one of them has kids but his wife does a phenomenal amount of solo childcare evenings and weekends.- Genesis Croix de Fer
- Dolan Tuono0 -
Why do you do that?rick_chasey said:
I'm just commenting via my own prejudices.0 -
We all do! Might as well point out where it's been highlighted, indirectly or otherwise by other posters.0
-
Are Brexit voting truck drivers still considered stupid and guilty of voting for something that would make them worse off because they failed to understand the lump of labour fallacy?0
-
Certainly my racist homophobic grandmother did, but I didn't consider it to be one of her finest features.rick_chasey said:We all do! Might as well point out where it's been highlighted, indirectly or otherwise by other posters.
0 -
are they domestic or pan-Europe?TheBigBean said:Are Brexit voting truck drivers still considered stupid and guilty of voting for something that would make them worse off because they failed to understand the lump of labour fallacy?
0 -
Pan-Europe ones are surely happy too, no? More pay for local work.surrey_commuter said:
are they domestic or pan-Europe?TheBigBean said:Are Brexit voting truck drivers still considered stupid and guilty of voting for something that would make them worse off because they failed to understand the lump of labour fallacy?
0 -
The first step to being less prejudiced is recognising where you are being prejudiced. We all have them.TheBigBean said:
Certainly my racist homophobic grandmother did, but I didn't consider it to be one of her finest features.rick_chasey said:We all do! Might as well point out where it's been highlighted, indirectly or otherwise by other posters.
Sometimes certain prejudices are reasonable or justified, some aren't.
I don't think having pop psychology theories on why some people prefer animals to humans is at the same level as being a racist homophobe but ymmv.0 -
Recognition is good, but only as means to prevention not as an excuse in advance. Otherwise you justify "I know it's a bit racist to say this, but..."rick_chasey said:
The first step to being less prejudiced is recognising where you are being prejudiced. We all have them.TheBigBean said:
Certainly my racist homophobic grandmother did, but I didn't consider it to be one of her finest features.rick_chasey said:We all do! Might as well point out where it's been highlighted, indirectly or otherwise by other posters.
Sometimes certain prejudices are reasonable or justified, some aren't.
I don't think having pop psychology theories on why some people prefer animals to humans is at the same level as being a racist homophobe but ymmv.
0 -
But I'm not justifying racism, am I? To be clear.
Some prejudices are very tolerable, some really are not.
You seem to have your own prejudices about recruiters who you feel you can't trust to not let the market you know you're looking for a job. I'm sure you find that very reasonable and are comfortable with that.
0 -
That's based on knowing the people involved, so not a prejudice! If I fancied a career change and was using unknown recruiters I wouldn't be so sceptical although it is a lot of information to provide an unregulated company.rick_chasey said:But I'm not justifying racism, am I? To be clear.
Some prejudices are very tolerable, some really are not.
You seem to have your own prejudices about recruiters who you feel you can't trust to not let the market you know you're looking for a job. I'm sure you find that very reasonable and are comfortable with that.
And age is a protected characteristic just like race. Animals are not.
0 -
I'm surprised to read this.elbowloh said:
oh, and those Saturdays and Sundays were 9.00-21.00.Pross said:
It's always a surprise to me that it seems to be the most difficult degree course to get a place on when those capable of the required grades could go for pretty much any course then go out and earn more.elbowloh said:
The shift patterns are often censored though. When in private practice the wife was expected to work 08.00-18.00 most days, with pretty much no breaks, on the days she was on lates it was like 11.00-21.00 and often on those lates she didn't come home until 23.00. Then it was 1 in four weekends on top of that (both Saturday and Sunday). I wouldn't want those hours, i'd want to work "part time" and end up working what equates to a regular 9-5.Dorset_Boy said:I have a sister who is a vet. Aparently, in their drive for equality in the profession, a disproportionately large number of females were offered places at vet school over the last 10-15 years or so. Now a lot of them have or are having families and don't want to work full time or the on call shift patterns, and this is a major problem for practices.
The vet school courses have masses of applicants, it seems the practices were fine to burn their staff out as there were plenty more coming through the pipeline.
In late Autumn 2018 on a coastal walk, I encounted a vet and his daughters and we got chatting. He told me that because the UK doesn't train as many vets (both surgeons and nurses) as it requires, about half of all vets in the UK are from the EU, like he was. He also said that many of them (i.e. vets from the EU) would have once regarded themselves as settled in the UK, as he had, however, because of Brexit he thought a good quarter of them, himself included, were seriously thinking of returning to the EU, and that in fact between the Brexit vote and when we met, 5-10% had already returned to the EU.
That doesn't sound like the situation you describe, unless in the last few years there has coincidentally been a sudden and major increase in the number of new UK-trained vets graduating.
0 -
elbowloh said:
There's that too.Pross said:
I assume the issue is dealing with the way humans treat the animals.rick_chasey said:Oh poor poor them, having to deal with people. Heavens above.
She has had to confiscate animals from owns who have mistreated them and also report owners to the RSPCA for criminal investigation and prosecution. There are also those who use their dogs for fighting and then bring them in for treatment (charity sector vets).
However, its mainly the threats of physical violence.
I remember once at the farm, the vet was an hour late. When he arrived, eventually, he looked rather shaken. He explained that an old lady, whose only companion was an old dog, had come into the surgery, and sadly, they had to recommend putting the pet to sleep, having talked through the options. Once they had put the old dog to sleep, the old lady then said "And when will he wake up?" They then spent the next hour consoling her.0 -
Yeah, I meant by pipeline both immigrants and uni's. I think it's more like 30% are non UK citizens, mainly (in my experience) Spanish and Italians.jimmyjams said:
I'm surprised to read this.elbowloh said:
oh, and those Saturdays and Sundays were 9.00-21.00.Pross said:
It's always a surprise to me that it seems to be the most difficult degree course to get a place on when those capable of the required grades could go for pretty much any course then go out and earn more.elbowloh said:
The shift patterns are often censored though. When in private practice the wife was expected to work 08.00-18.00 most days, with pretty much no breaks, on the days she was on lates it was like 11.00-21.00 and often on those lates she didn't come home until 23.00. Then it was 1 in four weekends on top of that (both Saturday and Sunday). I wouldn't want those hours, i'd want to work "part time" and end up working what equates to a regular 9-5.Dorset_Boy said:I have a sister who is a vet. Aparently, in their drive for equality in the profession, a disproportionately large number of females were offered places at vet school over the last 10-15 years or so. Now a lot of them have or are having families and don't want to work full time or the on call shift patterns, and this is a major problem for practices.
The vet school courses have masses of applicants, it seems the practices were fine to burn their staff out as there were plenty more coming through the pipeline.
In late Autumn 2018 on a coastal walk, I encounted a vet and his daughters and we got chatting. He told me that because the UK doesn't train as many vets (both surgeons and nurses) as it requires, about half of all vets in the UK are from the EU, like he was. He also said that many of them (i.e. vets from the EU) would have once regarded themselves as settled in the UK, as he had, however, because of Brexit he thought a good quarter of them, himself included, were seriously thinking of returning to the EU, and that in fact between the Brexit vote and when we met, 5-10% had already returned to the EU.
That doesn't sound like the situation you describe, unless in the last few years there has coincidentally been a sudden and major increase in the number of new UK-trained vets graduating.
Only anecdotal, but all the EU vets I know have stayed in the UK.0 -
Feel like this opinion might not be the most well researched. Not saying a slaughter house would be the first pick of many, but there are a lot that don't want to go anywhere near dog and horse owners.ddraver said:The problem there is that UK vets want to play with horses and puppies rather than check that one of the 500 cows covered in sh1te about to be slaughtered for Findus lasagne hasn't got TB...
Although if you want to 100% large animals you need to live in a very rural location.0 -
Live in such a rural location next door to a vet, whole side of family are vets and best family friends are vets but...feel away
Dragging the Brexit thread back to Brexit, another problem JJs walking companion may have mentioned is that all the vast majority of vets working in ports or doing CHED-P type checks were EU vetsWe're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
- @ddraver0