BREXIT - Is This Really Still Rumbling On? 😴

1…15081509151115131514…2102

Comments

  • tailwindhome
    tailwindhome Posts: 18,938
    Not a lot of unionists on this forum
    “New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!
  • TheBigBean
    TheBigBean Posts: 20,620
    tailwindhome said:

    Not a lot of unionists on this forum

    There's not a lot anywhere. As we've discussed before, they've failed at the PR.
  • surrey_commuter
    surrey_commuter Posts: 18,866
    TheBigBean said:

    tailwindhome said:

    Not a lot of unionists on this forum

    There's not a lot anywhere. As we've discussed before, they've failed at the PR.
    TheBigBean said:

    tailwindhome said:

    Not a lot of unionists on this forum

    There's not a lot anywhere. As we've discussed before, they've failed at the PR.
    It is intriguing that the surge in nationalism seems to be about England rather than the UK.
  • TheBigBean
    TheBigBean Posts: 20,620
    surrey_commuter said:

    TheBigBean said:

    tailwindhome said:

    Not a lot of unionists on this forum

    There's not a lot anywhere. As we've discussed before, they've failed at the PR.
    TheBigBean said:

    tailwindhome said:

    Not a lot of unionists on this forum

    There's not a lot anywhere. As we've discussed before, they've failed at the PR.
    It is intriguing that the surge in nationalism seems to be about England rather than the UK.
    It's rare for people to be nationalist about federations. US is an exception.
  • darkhairedlord
    darkhairedlord Posts: 7,180
    TheBigBean said:

    surrey_commuter said:

    TheBigBean said:

    tailwindhome said:

    Not a lot of unionists on this forum

    There's not a lot anywhere. As we've discussed before, they've failed at the PR.
    TheBigBean said:

    tailwindhome said:

    Not a lot of unionists on this forum

    There's not a lot anywhere. As we've discussed before, they've failed at the PR.
    It is intriguing that the surge in nationalism seems to be about England rather than the UK.
    It's rare for people to be nationalist about federations. US is an exception.
    No it isn't
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 72,691
    Swiss ref on free movement is a big win for stopping it.

    _
  • tailwindhome
    tailwindhome Posts: 18,938
    rick_chasey said:

    Swiss ref on free movement is a big win for stopping it.

    Eh?

    “New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!
  • TheBigBean
    TheBigBean Posts: 20,620
    darkhairedlord said:

    TheBigBean said:

    surrey_commuter said:

    TheBigBean said:

    tailwindhome said:

    Not a lot of unionists on this forum

    There's not a lot anywhere. As we've discussed before, they've failed at the PR.
    TheBigBean said:

    tailwindhome said:

    Not a lot of unionists on this forum

    There's not a lot anywhere. As we've discussed before, they've failed at the PR.
    It is intriguing that the surge in nationalism seems to be about England rather than the UK.
    It's rare for people to be nationalist about federations. US is an exception.
    No it isn't
    Examples? I'll lead with Yugoslavia and Soviet Union
  • sungod
    sungod Posts: 16,547
    https://www.euronews.com/2020/09/27/swiss-voters-reject-referendum-initiative-to-end-eu-freedom-of-movement

    sensible people 1
    fascists 0

    my bike - faster than god's and twice as shiny
  • rjsterry
    rjsterry Posts: 27,663
    TheBigBean said:

    surrey_commuter said:

    TheBigBean said:

    tailwindhome said:

    Not a lot of unionists on this forum

    There's not a lot anywhere. As we've discussed before, they've failed at the PR.
    TheBigBean said:

    tailwindhome said:

    Not a lot of unionists on this forum

    There's not a lot anywhere. As we've discussed before, they've failed at the PR.
    It is intriguing that the surge in nationalism seems to be about England rather than the UK.
    It's rare for people to be nationalist about federations. US is an exception.
    Germany is a federation. So is Brazil, Argentina, Mexico, Canada, Spain, Austria, Australia... 25 in total.
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    Pinnacle Monzonite

    Part of the anti-growth coalition
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 72,691
    tailwindhome said:

    rick_chasey said:

    Swiss ref on free movement is a big win for stopping it.

    Eh?


    Ah too many negatives - confused myself.
    _
  • rjsterry
    rjsterry Posts: 27,663
    tailwindhome said:

    Not a lot of unionists on this forum

    Put me down as broadly unionist in the wider sense, while recognising that it's not really up to me.
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    Pinnacle Monzonite

    Part of the anti-growth coalition
  • tailwindhome
    tailwindhome Posts: 18,938
    edited September 2020
    TheBigBean said:

    surrey_commuter said:

    TheBigBean said:

    tailwindhome said:

    Not a lot of unionists on this forum

    There's not a lot anywhere. As we've discussed before, they've failed at the PR.
    TheBigBean said:

    tailwindhome said:

    Not a lot of unionists on this forum

    There's not a lot anywhere. As we've discussed before, they've failed at the PR.
    It is intriguing that the surge in nationalism seems to be about England rather than the UK.
    It's rare for people to be nationalist about federations. US is an exception.
    Being 'British' has always seemed to something that (and I don't mean this pejoratively) a lot of people felt fairly nationalistic or patriotic about



    “New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!
  • surrey_commuter
    surrey_commuter Posts: 18,866
    tailwindhome said:

    TheBigBean said:

    surrey_commuter said:

    TheBigBean said:

    tailwindhome said:

    Not a lot of unionists on this forum

    There's not a lot anywhere. As we've discussed before, they've failed at the PR.
    TheBigBean said:

    tailwindhome said:

    Not a lot of unionists on this forum

    There's not a lot anywhere. As we've discussed before, they've failed at the PR.
    It is intriguing that the surge in nationalism seems to be about England rather than the UK.
    It's rare for people to be nationalist about federations. US is an exception.
    Being 'British' has always seemed to something that (and I don't mean this pejoratively) felt fairly nationalistic or patriotic about



    Interesting, I see myself as English
  • Pross
    Pross Posts: 40,540
    rjsterry said:

    TheBigBean said:

    surrey_commuter said:

    TheBigBean said:

    tailwindhome said:

    Not a lot of unionists on this forum

    There's not a lot anywhere. As we've discussed before, they've failed at the PR.
    TheBigBean said:

    tailwindhome said:

    Not a lot of unionists on this forum

    There's not a lot anywhere. As we've discussed before, they've failed at the PR.
    It is intriguing that the surge in nationalism seems to be about England rather than the UK.
    It's rare for people to be nationalist about federations. US is an exception.
    Germany is a federation. So is Brazil, Argentina, Mexico, Canada, Spain, Austria, Australia... 25 in total.
    Spain might not be a good example in this case though!
  • rjsterry
    rjsterry Posts: 27,663
    tailwindhome said:

    TheBigBean said:

    surrey_commuter said:

    TheBigBean said:

    tailwindhome said:

    Not a lot of unionists on this forum

    There's not a lot anywhere. As we've discussed before, they've failed at the PR.
    TheBigBean said:

    tailwindhome said:

    Not a lot of unionists on this forum

    There's not a lot anywhere. As we've discussed before, they've failed at the PR.
    It is intriguing that the surge in nationalism seems to be about England rather than the UK.
    It's rare for people to be nationalist about federations. US is an exception.
    Being 'British' has always seemed to something that (and I don't mean this pejoratively) a lot of people felt fairly nationalistic or patriotic about



    I get that in an Irish context. On the other hand I get the impression it is seen as a more accessible (if that's the right word) identity for immigrants or the children of immigrants. Maybe that's partly a result of gaining citizenship. I'll ask my German colleague how he will feel once he's got his dual citizenship.
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    Pinnacle Monzonite

    Part of the anti-growth coalition
  • john80
    john80 Posts: 2,965
    sungod said:

    https://www.euronews.com/2020/09/27/swiss-voters-reject-referendum-initiative-to-end-eu-freedom-of-movement

    sensible people 6
    fascists 4

    Corrected you logic for you.
  • pblakeney
    pblakeney Posts: 25,773
    john80 said:

    sungod said:

    https://www.euronews.com/2020/09/27/swiss-voters-reject-referendum-initiative-to-end-eu-freedom-of-movement

    sensible people 6
    fascists 4

    Corrected you logic for you.
    Only one of them goes through to the next round though. 😉
    Losers be losers.
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • TheBigBean
    TheBigBean Posts: 20,620
    rjsterry said:

    TheBigBean said:

    surrey_commuter said:

    TheBigBean said:

    tailwindhome said:

    Not a lot of unionists on this forum

    There's not a lot anywhere. As we've discussed before, they've failed at the PR.
    TheBigBean said:

    tailwindhome said:

    Not a lot of unionists on this forum

    There's not a lot anywhere. As we've discussed before, they've failed at the PR.
    It is intriguing that the surge in nationalism seems to be about England rather than the UK.
    It's rare for people to be nationalist about federations. US is an exception.
    Germany is a federation. So is Brazil, Argentina, Mexico, Canada, Spain, Austria, Australia... 25 in total.
    Canada has Quebec, and Spain has Basque and Catalonia, so aren't great examples. I think I was lazy in my use of federations, it is less about the political structure and more about whether people have distinct identities. A better counter example is India. Many different regions, languages and people, and becoming increasingly nationalist about India.

    To put it more simply, there are far more independence movements than unification ones.
  • spatt77
    spatt77 Posts: 324
    pblakeney said:

    john80 said:

    sungod said:

    https://www.euronews.com/2020/09/27/swiss-voters-reject-referendum-initiative-to-end-eu-freedom-of-movement

    sensible people 6
    fascists 4

    Corrected you logic for you.
    Only one of them goes through to the next round though. 😉
    Losers be losers.
    you should use that logic with Brexit then! it makes sense;)
  • pblakeney
    pblakeney Posts: 25,773
    spatt77 said:

    pblakeney said:

    john80 said:

    sungod said:

    https://www.euronews.com/2020/09/27/swiss-voters-reject-referendum-initiative-to-end-eu-freedom-of-movement

    sensible people 6
    fascists 4

    Corrected you logic for you.
    Only one of them goes through to the next round though. 😉
    Losers be losers.
    you should use that logic with Brexit then! it makes sense;)
    I accept it but I don't have to like it, and I rarely mention my dislike, just the failings.
    It is fair to point out failings before the process is complete.
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • sungod
    sungod Posts: 16,547
    spatt77 said:

    pblakeney said:

    john80 said:

    sungod said:

    https://www.euronews.com/2020/09/27/swiss-voters-reject-referendum-initiative-to-end-eu-freedom-of-movement

    sensible people 6
    fascists 4

    Corrected you logic for you.
    Only one of them goes through to the next round though. 😉
    Losers be losers.
    you should use that logic with Brexit then! it makes sense;)
    you should use it too, but you don't like real democracy, you only like you interpretation based on selective data

    referendum:
    17.4 million voted leave, based on a bunch of proven lies and overwhelming press bias
    >40 million didn't, millions were too young to vote, you've proven you don't care about them

    outcome: they'll all be stripped of their rights and their future freedoms, not for the life of a parliament, effectively forvever

    general election:
    a minority voted for johnson, a proven liar and traitor
    the majority voted for parties campaigning for second ref/remain

    outcome: the much quoted 'will of the people' is denied by a government of liars

    oh look, surprise, surprise, they've turned out to incompetent, corrupt, self-serving, authoritarian, liars, who would have expected that

    the uk fptp system is deliberately undemocratic, the electoral system was designed that way to favour control by the 'right sort of chaps'

    over the last century there are very few years where the controlling party had more than 50% of the vote, all the others disenfranchised the majority

    it's not about leave/remain, neither outcome would change the corrosive effect of the majority being consistently ignored for decades, it ends in a divided society

    the 'people' don't win, the liars do
    my bike - faster than god's and twice as shiny
  • surrey_commuter
    surrey_commuter Posts: 18,866
    sungod said:

    spatt77 said:

    pblakeney said:

    john80 said:

    sungod said:

    https://www.euronews.com/2020/09/27/swiss-voters-reject-referendum-initiative-to-end-eu-freedom-of-movement

    sensible people 6
    fascists 4

    Corrected you logic for you.
    Only one of them goes through to the next round though. 😉
    Losers be losers.
    you should use that logic with Brexit then! it makes sense;)
    you should use it too, but you don't like real democracy, you only like you interpretation based on selective data

    referendum:
    17.4 million voted leave, based on a bunch of proven lies and overwhelming press bias
    >40 million didn't, millions were too young to vote, you've proven you don't care about them

    outcome: they'll all be stripped of their rights and their future freedoms, not for the life of a parliament, effectively forvever

    general election:
    a minority voted for johnson, a proven liar and traitor
    the majority voted for parties campaigning for second ref/remain

    outcome: the much quoted 'will of the people' is denied by a government of liars

    oh look, surprise, surprise, they've turned out to incompetent, corrupt, self-serving, authoritarian, liars, who would have expected that

    the uk fptp system is deliberately undemocratic, the electoral system was designed that way to favour control by the 'right sort of chaps'

    over the last century there are very few years where the controlling party had more than 50% of the vote, all the others disenfranchised the majority

    it's not about leave/remain, neither outcome would change the corrosive effect of the majority being consistently ignored for decades, it ends in a divided society

    the 'people' don't win, the liars do
    And don’t forget the HoL when you gain admittance through having more faith in your imaginary friend than others or a larger cheque book.

    And the cherry on the cake of our world beating representative democracy is an hereditary monarchy.

    Or we could have a 100 seat Parliament with approx 35 Tories, 25 Labour, 15 Lib Dem’s, 10 UKIP, 6 Greens and various others.
  • morstar
    morstar Posts: 6,190
    surrey_commuter said:

    sungod said:

    spatt77 said:

    pblakeney said:

    john80 said:

    sungod said:

    https://www.euronews.com/2020/09/27/swiss-voters-reject-referendum-initiative-to-end-eu-freedom-of-movement

    sensible people 6
    fascists 4

    Corrected you logic for you.
    Only one of them goes through to the next round though. 😉
    Losers be losers.
    you should use that logic with Brexit then! it makes sense;)
    you should use it too, but you don't like real democracy, you only like you interpretation based on selective data

    referendum:
    17.4 million voted leave, based on a bunch of proven lies and overwhelming press bias
    >40 million didn't, millions were too young to vote, you've proven you don't care about them

    outcome: they'll all be stripped of their rights and their future freedoms, not for the life of a parliament, effectively forvever

    general election:
    a minority voted for johnson, a proven liar and traitor
    the majority voted for parties campaigning for second ref/remain

    outcome: the much quoted 'will of the people' is denied by a government of liars

    oh look, surprise, surprise, they've turned out to incompetent, corrupt, self-serving, authoritarian, liars, who would have expected that

    the uk fptp system is deliberately undemocratic, the electoral system was designed that way to favour control by the 'right sort of chaps'

    over the last century there are very few years where the controlling party had more than 50% of the vote, all the others disenfranchised the majority

    it's not about leave/remain, neither outcome would change the corrosive effect of the majority being consistently ignored for decades, it ends in a divided society

    the 'people' don't win, the liars do
    And don’t forget the HoL when you gain admittance through having more faith in your imaginary friend than others or a larger cheque book.

    And the cherry on the cake of our world beating representative democracy is an hereditary monarchy.

    Or we could have a 100 seat Parliament with approx 35 Tories, 25 Labour, 15 Lib Dem’s, 10 UKIP, 6 Greens and various others.
    It wouldn’t look like that split for long though.

    Hence why it won’t ever change without a radical event.
  • TheBigBean
    TheBigBean Posts: 20,620
    I know you all love curvy bananas, but how about leaky toilets. Only allowed in the UK when regulations were harmonised and worse for the environment.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-54326178
  • bompington
    bompington Posts: 7,674
    edited September 2020
    TheBigBean said:

    I know you all love curvy bananas, but how about leaky toilets. Only allowed in the UK when regulations were harmonised and worse for the environment.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-54326178

    The unintended consequences of the desire to regulate everything - something that is undoubtedly one of the EU's worse features.

    Came across this today: "Unsafe Cars Can Save Lives"
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 72,691
    TheBigBean said:

    I know you all love curvy bananas, but how about leaky toilets. Only allowed in the UK when regulations were harmonised and worse for the environment.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-54326178

    Given the appalling state of all UK plumbing, this story does not remotely surprise me.

    Plainly the EU regs do not take local plumbing abilities into account.

    I'm sure you'll all roll your eyes but I grew up amongst a lot of continental Europeans who moved to the UK and if you wanted them to agree on something all you ever had to do was mention the state of UK plumbing and plumbers and they'd be off for the next 3 hours.
    _
  • TheBigBean
    TheBigBean Posts: 20,620
    rick_chasey said:

    TheBigBean said:

    I know you all love curvy bananas, but how about leaky toilets. Only allowed in the UK when regulations were harmonised and worse for the environment.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-54326178

    Given the appalling state of all UK plumbing, this story does not remotely surprise me.

    Plainly the EU regs do not take local plumbing abilities into account.

    I'm sure you'll all roll your eyes but I grew up amongst a lot of continental Europeans who moved to the UK and if you wanted them to agree on something all you ever had to do was mention the state of UK plumbing and plumbers and they'd be off for the next 3 hours.
    You may be right about UK plumbing, but this isn't about plumbing. A siphon toilet can't leak, and that's why they were the legal requirement for a hundred years. The other type will leak at some point, so irrespective of how good and responsive the plumbers are, the siphon will leak less.

  • TheBigBean
    TheBigBean Posts: 20,620
    bompington said:

    TheBigBean said:

    I know you all love curvy bananas, but how about leaky toilets. Only allowed in the UK when regulations were harmonised and worse for the environment.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-54326178

    The unintended consequences of the desire to regulate everything - something that is undoubtedly one of the EU's worse features.

    Came across this today: "Unsafe Cars Can Save Lives"
    Toss up between India and Bolivia for most scary roads in my view. Completely different reasons.
  • spatt77
    spatt77 Posts: 324
    rick_chasey said:

    TheBigBean said:

    I know you all love curvy bananas, but how about leaky toilets. Only allowed in the UK when regulations were harmonised and worse for the environment.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-54326178

    Given the appalling state of all UK plumbing, this story does not remotely surprise me.

    Plainly the EU regs do not take local plumbing abilities into account.

    I'm sure you'll all roll your eyes but I grew up amongst a lot of continental Europeans who moved to the UK and if you wanted them to agree on something all you ever had to do was mention the state of UK plumbing and plumbers and they'd be off for the next 3 hours.
    We could say the same about European electrical system! not a patch on our 3 pin system!

Categories