Newbie vintage gearing upgrade advice...

wifflebat

Hi all
I'm looking for a bit of advice if anyone has a mo to help!

I live in a very hilly area and have recently bought an old bike off gumtree to replace an (older) bike...I also bought off gumtree. We're talking 80s here, but I like the thought of a steel frame and saving something from landfill.
The problems with the first one were that the frame was a little small, the handlebars too narrow, the brakes less than useless and the downtube shifters were a death trap. It has a double chainset (52/42) and 7 speed cassette (14-24).

The 'new' bike has Campagnolo brifters, lovely Shimano 105 brakes, big wide h/bars, old mavic wheels etc etc. It is also has a double chainset (52/42) and 7 speed (13-21) cassette.

Now that I've explained what I have, I'd really appreciate some advice on how best to set it up to help with a bit of climbing. I did a 100 mile sportif 2 years ago on the old bike and, although it was flat and I survived, the training on my local roads was murder because of the hills and the gear ratios I had available to me. Am I right in thinking that my 'new' bike's set up is going to be worse?
Would I be better off footling with different cassette options or adding a 30T chainring to the front.
I am friends with several in the MAN UP brigade and I wouldn't hope to be in the granny ring forever but it's kind of tough to get started when I come out of my house and have no option but to go straight down a massive hill...which obviously means I have to come back up it to get home!

Here are some pics of the new bike's set up (pre clean up!).
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/wvf0ogb95rt10xl/AAC37NdbqTe7OjBYtA107ZcQa

Any and all advice very gratefully appreciated as there don't seem to be any model numbers on the Campagnolo stuff and I'm totally confused by all the stuff I've found on google as lots of it seems to refer to the newer sort of kit out there.

arlowood

You might be able to source a 38 tooth front chain ring - that is assuming that your chainset has a standard 130mm BCD.

38 tooth is the minimum size you can fit with a BCD of 130

Otherwise you might be able to find a Miche 7 speed cassette with 13-24 ratios. Not much help but better that the 21 tooth lower sprocket you have at the moment

team47b

You call them cassettes but aren't these freewheels not freehubs?

SJS cycles have all sorts of freewheels, 13-24, 13-28, 13-32 etc this would be the easiest thing to change providing the cage/chain will fit with these sizes.

cycleclinic

D/T shifters are not a death trap at all. I use them and find it easy to shift a ten speed block (non indexed as well) without causing any instability in the bike. you just have to shift before you brake or turn like you are meant to in a car for example.

Your rear wheel has a threaded hub with a screw on freewheel. Campagnolo did not make 7 speed ergo's so you have 8 speed ergo's which will index well I believe on any 7 speed block. You mech however if from the 80's and being camapgnolo will not tolerate anything big in the freewheel department. It looks like a short cage mech to me and those from this brand from this era did not like anything much above a 24T large sprocket. So you maybe stuck.

Replacing the shifters and mech with a modern system like Shimano tourney for 7 speed will sort your problem at a stroke and allow you to fit a touring freewheel but your costs have gone up other wise you will to hope the pic of the mech is misleading and you have longer cage than I think. Your current frewwheel size though suggests you haven't.

52/42 chainset from the 80's well that could be a 144BCD if so 41T is the lowest you can go. It could be a 130BCD chainset but it might be a 144mm BCD. Unless you measure or tell us exactly what you have we cannot tell.

wifflebat

Hi everyone
Thanks very much for your replies. I've measured the distance between adjacent bolt holes and I make it somewhere between 79.5 and 80mm which would make it 135 or 136mm BCD I reckon. I'm not sure what that means as far as my options...

D/T shifters are lethal when I'm riding! I think the narrow handlebars don't help me either, but I've nearly found myself in a hedge several times.

I do have an old front and rear Shimano 105 set up from another old tiny bike I got my hands on a while back (a donor for a wind turbine project - long story!) but I didn't think that the Campy and Shimano stuff spoke to each other. The rear cassette for that was also a 7 speed and had indexed downtube shifters. I've salvaged all of that stuff and still have it somewhere. The frame was cracked but I think everything else was ok.

Could I use that stuff with my current brifters and add a granny ring?

bill57

The chainset looks like a 80's to 90's Campagnolo, which has a BCD of 135mm so you're bang on.

JayKosta

Probably the first thing is to ask other local riders
"what is the largest gearing that I can get away with for the local hills?"

If you need really low gears, then changing both the small front chainring and the freewheel might be necessary.

On my bike, I have 42-52 front, and 14X28 freewheel - that is enough for 'modern highway hills', but not for some of the 'backroad country hills'.

Jay Kosta
Endwell NY USA

wifflebat

Hi again
Thanks for all the info. It would seem that I haven't many options really re a triple chainset despite all the bits and bobs I have accumulated.
The Shimano groupset I have is 1056 stuff which appears to also be only able to deal with double chainrings but a 1057 derailleur would sort that I think...but then would I have a problem with the Campy brifter not working with it?

I reckon there are maybe 3 options then...
a) Get a 1057 front derailleur and a 30t ring and keep the rear set up (I've also got an 8 speed cassette of some sort 13-23). Then worry about how to shift it later. Could get expensivve
b) suck it up
c) get a new bike
d) source a replacement for my 42T ring that's a bit lower. Probably the most straightforward compromise?

wifflebat

Hi again
I have one (hopefully) final question if anyone can help?
I reckon that the cheapest and most straightforward option to improve my setup, granted only slightly, is to try to pick up a replacement freewheel 7 speed...or can I go 8 speed since my Campagnolo shifter is 8 speed?
I'm a bit confused about compatibility though.
What am I looking for? I missed out on a Sachs 8 speed 13-28T on ebay that stated it was Campy/ergo compatible but there is very little else that specifies its compatibility. I asked about another freewheel on ebay and the seller told me that "no one makes 8 speed Campagnolo spaced freewheels". Why have I got an 8 speed shifter then?

Very confused!

JayKosta

Rear gears are 2 basic types -

Old style is FREEWHEEL which screws onto threads on the hub. Typically 5, 6, or 7 gears on the freewheel.

Current (modern) style is CASSETTE assembly which slides onto splines (Campy or Shimano).

If your rear hub is threaded for freewheel, it will not accept a cassette.

Basically, you are fortunate that the 8-speed shifters (which were probably designed for 8-speed cassette) happen to work with your 7-speed freewheel. I suggest staying with 7-speed freewheel, or getting a complete 8-speed rear wheel with cassette.

Jay Kosta
Endwell NY USA

Monty Dog

Smallest chainring you can fit to your crank is 39 so suggest if you want even smaller gears then swapping your chainset to a 34x50 will be your easiest option. You need to determine whether you have a freewheel or cassette - can't tell from your photos but the biggest rear sprocket your rear mech can cope with will be 28 teeth. If you have a threaded hub for a freewheel and try to fit an 8-speed one then the wheel will probably need to be re-spaced/dished.

secretsam

Have a chat with an old, established bike shop - Spa, Rourke, Bob Jackson, to name a few. Mercian also.

They should be able to help you regarding your old Campag bits.

Mind you, looks like a nice bike - may be worth keeping as a 'special flat day cafe poseur' bike

wifflebat

Thanks again folks.
I've decided to alter the front chainring teeth to something a bit more useful for me in the short term then investigate more options with cogs later on.
SecretSam - that's all well and good but I've still to cycle home...up a massive hill!

Thanks again for all your expertise - I understand a little bit more about all this now...I think...

clogg

It can be expensive changing chainrings and the most you will get from it will be a 39-21 lowest gear this gives a gear of 50.1 inch. Changing the freewheel to a 25 tooth (it will fit) will get you a gear of 45 inch, a ratio nearly 10% easier. Costs about £18. see

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Sunrace-7spee ... 58a665a090

wifflebat

Ahhh balls. See I saw freewheel cogs like that but always assumed that the statement 'Shimano compatible' meant that it wasn't Campy compatible.
Well, sure. I'll just do the whole lot and sell all this 105 stuff I have kicking about to fund it all :roll:

JayKosta

On cassettes, there are 2 types of splines - Campy and Shimano .

On freewheels, there are 2 types of threads - English and Italian.

Jay Kosta
Endwell NY USA