new 105 group set

Old_Timer

Grill wrote:

Get it here for 300 quid: http://www.merlincycles.com/shimano-105-5700-groupset-oem-66608.html

Shouldn't cost more than 60-70 quid to get it fitted, or you can just do it yourself.

Grill, that is the "Old" 5700 group, does Merlin offr the newer 5800, 11 speed group set yet? I couldn't find it in a quick look-see.

+1 on installing the group yourself,it isn't difficult at all.

Grill

Old_Timer wrote:

Grill wrote:

Get it here for 300 quid: http://www.merlincycles.com/shimano-105-5700-groupset-oem-66608.html

Shouldn't cost more than 60-70 quid to get it fitted, or you can just do it yourself.

Grill, that is the "Old" 5700 group, does Merlin offr the newer 5800, 11 speed group set yet? I couldn't find it in a quick look-see.

+1 on installing the group yourself,it isn't difficult at all.

Hasn't been released yet although Chainreaction have it up. I don't think the OP has 11spd compatible wheels so I didn't bother to suggest 5800.

downhill paul

I should have mentioned that first.
I have mavic aksium race wheels, currently with a shimano sora 9 speed rear casette.
I would prefer the 105 10 speed group set instead of the 11.

Old_Timer

Grill wrote:

Old_Timer wrote:

Grill wrote:

Get it here for 300 quid: http://www.merlincycles.com/shimano-105-5700-groupset-oem-66608.html

Shouldn't cost more than 60-70 quid to get it fitted, or you can just do it yourself.

Grill, that is the "Old" 5700 group, does Merlin offr the newer 5800, 11 speed group set yet? I couldn't find it in a quick look-see.

+1 on installing the group yourself,it isn't difficult at all.

Hasn't been released yet although Chainreaction have it up. I don't think the OP has 11spd compatible wheels so I didn't bother to suggest 5800.

The new wheelset is what is holding me back on searching for a 5800 group. My CAAD 10 Rival had Fulcrum Racing7 that are in perfect condition, so no need to replace them. I would like to try a 5700 or a 6700 Ultegra if a silver set showed up at a decent price. And, if wishes were horses, beggars would ride....

iPete

It is probably vastly cheaper to buy an entire group but you could mix and match to get a great 10 speed setup?

Currently running 10 speed with 5700 levers, 6700 BB and mechs with a 6800 (52/36) chainset.

downhill paul

So how long can I expect a FSA BB30 bottom bracket to last?
also will there be any difference in performance between the FSA gossamer and shimano 105 crank set?

itboffin

i'm really not impressed with the 5700, 6700 or di2, clunky shifting and seemingly lots of trimming needed whilst riding yet my 5600, 7900 work perfectly in all gears, smooth shifting in fact sometimes so smooth I could barely tell i'd shifted.

price pushing down quality perhaps?

on the campag side of things my centaur & record kit never misses a beat, ever!

Bozman

itboffin wrote:

i'm really not impressed with the 5700, 6700 or di2, clunky shifting and seemingly lots of trimming needed whilst riding yet my 5600, 7900 work perfectly in all gears, smooth shifting in fact sometimes so smooth I could barely tell i'd shifted.

price pushing down quality perhaps?

on the campag side of things my centaur & record kit never misses a beat, ever!

6800 shifts better than 7900 it's lighter and smoother to shift, when I tried 9000 I found next no difference between that and the Ultegra.
I always looked at 7800 as probably the best shift ever but the latest gen are pretty much there.

Grill

itboffin wrote:

i'm really not impressed with the 5700, 6700 or di2, clunky shifting and seemingly lots of trimming needed whilst riding yet my 5600, 7900 work perfectly in all gears, smooth shifting in fact sometimes so smooth I could barely tell i'd shifted.

price pushing down quality perhaps?

on the campag side of things my centaur & record kit never misses a beat, ever!

Errr did you just say that Di2 has clunky shifting with lots of trimming? Because that's pretty much the antithesis of Di2...

downhill paul

I'm still trying to find out what affect, if any the FSA gossamer crank set will have on shifting when coupled with a 105 front derailleur and 105 STI shifters. I'm currently running shimano sora on my allez sport.
I know it will be an upgrade, but just how much of an upgrade will it be.
also, how long will a FSA BB30 bottom bracket last compared to a shimano bottom bracket?

Bozman

FSA chainsets work fine with Shimano kit, I used them for years without an issue and the pick up is great.

BBs, I usually got 8k+ out of a Shimano Hollowtech II bottom bracket and between 400 and 1000 miles out of BB30 bearings.

downhill paul

You were getting 8000 miles out of a shimano bottom bracket and only 400 to 1000 miles out of a FSA bottom bracket?
is that the point where the whole bottom bracket needs replacing, or simply cleaning and re lubing?
I think if the former is the case, I'll steer clear of anything with an FSA logo on it.

markhewitt1978

That's got to be 4,000 to 10,000?

Grill

Nope. I never saw more than 1,000 miles out of BB30 whereas 8k+ out of Shimano seems to be the norm.

markhewitt1978

Grill wrote:

Nope. I never saw more than 1,000 miles out of BB30.

Astonishing!

How Far is too Far

I have a 2011 Supersix on original BB30 bearings with over 10,000 miles on it now. They have been regressed 3 or 4 times in that time still fine with no play.

Rich...

Bozman

markhewitt1978 wrote:

That's got to be 4,000 to 10,000?

No, 400 - 1000 miles. The main issue was winter/rain which would lead to water ingress, it got to the stage where I would take the crank out if I'd been out in the wet and dry the BB out and regrease.
Throughout the summer the crank would be out every 4 weeks so I could clean and grease everything, this was something that I'd never had to do with HTII, Megaexo or GPX.
Needless to say I won't be buying another frame with a BB30 bottom bracket, at the moment I've got one bike with BB86 pressfit and that not much better(1200 winter miles and I had brown water running out of the BB).

Grill

Bozman wrote:

markhewitt1978 wrote:

That's got to be 4,000 to 10,000?

No, 400 - 1000 miles. The main issue was winter/rain which would lead to water ingress, it got to the stage where I would take the crank out if I'd been out in the wet and dry the BB out and regrease.
Throughout the summer the crank would be out every 4 weeks so I could clean and grease everything, this was something that I'd never had to do with HTII, Megaexo or GPX.
Needless to say I won't be buying another frame with a BB30 bottom bracket, at the moment I've got one bike with BB86 pressfit and that not much better(1200 winter miles and I had brown water running out of the BB).

My Foil has BB86 and is still on its first BB (over 7000 miles of 4 season weather). My other Foil and Plasma also ha no issues.

Bozman

Grill wrote:

Bozman wrote:

markhewitt1978 wrote:

That's got to be 4,000 to 10,000?

No, 400 - 1000 miles. The main issue was winter/rain which would lead to water ingress, it got to the stage where I would take the crank out if I'd been out in the wet and dry the BB out and regrease.
Throughout the summer the crank would be out every 4 weeks so I could clean and grease everything, this was something that I'd never had to do with HTII, Megaexo or GPX.
Needless to say I won't be buying another frame with a BB30 bottom bracket, at the moment I've got one bike with BB86 pressfit and that not much better(1200 winter miles and I had brown water running out of the BB).

My Foil has BB86 and is still on its first BB (over 7000 miles of 4 season weather). My other Foil and Plasma also ha no issues.

SRAM GPX pressfit.

Grill

Bozman wrote:

Grill wrote:

Bozman wrote:

markhewitt1978 wrote:

That's got to be 4,000 to 10,000?

No, 400 - 1000 miles. The main issue was winter/rain which would lead to water ingress, it got to the stage where I would take the crank out if I'd been out in the wet and dry the BB out and regrease.
Throughout the summer the crank would be out every 4 weeks so I could clean and grease everything, this was something that I'd never had to do with HTII, Megaexo or GPX.
Needless to say I won't be buying another frame with a BB30 bottom bracket, at the moment I've got one bike with BB86 pressfit and that not much better(1200 winter miles and I had brown water running out of the BB).

My Foil has BB86 and is still on its first BB (over 7000 miles of 4 season weather). My other Foil and Plasma also ha no issues.

SRAM GPX pressfit.

Got it, I'm on Shimano. If it ain't broke...

downhill paul

I only ride in the dry, I used to ride in the rain with my first road bike and my mountain bike.
after a while I got sick of spending so long cleaning, drying and re lubing anything that might rust.
sometimes I spent more time cleaning my bike than I did riding it.
hopefully only riding in the dry would make a bottom bracket last longer.
I'm still not sure if I want to take the plunge and buy a bike with a BB30 bottom bracket.

Old_Timer

If a BB is only giving you that low a mileage out of its bearings there are bigger problems, than it being a BB30 or PF30, with that type of set up. There are problems with the seals in the cartridges if you are rebuilding that often, or the grease is not up to standards for the application. I sincerely doubt that any of you aren't doing the necessary maintenance, I'd thing this group does more than normal amounts of service. However, I have been known to be wrong on a regular basis :roll: , flame away. :shock:

Do they salt the roads in the UK during the winters? If the councils do, I could understand some accelerated wear from the salts' corrosive actions but wet weather and road grime getting to a bearing that is sealed seems excessive to me. Here in the US even the riders up north where a lot of salt is applied to the roads in the winter the bearings aren't going out that fast. Maybe looking at a bearing manufacturer like Timken (not sure of the UK or EU bearing manufacturers) for bearings or upgraded seals would help you extend the life span of a BB. I understand that the factory bearings for a BB30 or a PF30 are somewhat odd in their size but a high quality bearing manufacturer could supply better bearings or just quality wiper seals.

Seals should be greased along the wiper lip before installation, too. If not they will have small tears that allow grit and road salts in to the bearings. Quality water proof grease is important in keeping bearings alive for decent periods, as well.

markhewitt1978

Old_Timer wrote:

Do they salt the roads in the UK during the winters?

Oh yes! Massive amounts of it every day from about October until March. I've come back from rides where the tyres and much of the rest of the bike is white from the stuff, and I've got a salty taste in my mouth for hours after. It's the reason many here have winter bikes which have cheaper components which can be sacrificed to the salt.

Old_Timer

Thanks, I didn't know if the salting was done in the UK. If it a substantial, as you say, there is part of the problem. I always wondered why I saw the large amount of "Winter" or "Training" bicycles advertised in the magazines from the UK. I am fortunate in that I live in a semi-tropical climate on the Gulf of Mexico. No salting at all here, just a lot of road grime and crud to clean out.

One thought, if a pressure washer is used a lot and aimed into the BB, it is blowing the lube out and pushing more salt and crud into the bearings, even if they are sealed. I avoid using a pressure washer, totally. Just a random thought in an empty chamber.

downhill paul

I have never used a BB30 bottom bracket, only shimano. which is why I was asking how long I can expect a BB30 to last.
salt on the roads is a problem here in the UK. it causes damage to everything from cars and bikes, even the roads themselves. I have only ever used a pressure washer on my mountain bike because of how dirty it got.
I would get home on a regular basis with half of the grit and mud from the trail stuck to my bike. but even after a regular cleaning with a pressure washer, I never had any bearing problems with the bottom bracket, the wheels or the headset. in that respect I guess I was just lucky.
I have only ever used a hose and a bucket of hot water to clean my road bikes, which both have shimano bottom brackets, so far I haven't had any issues. which is something I would like to continue.

Old_Timer

Paul,
I've seen people use a pressure washer for years and not have any ill effects on their bicycle or dirt bike, and I've seen relatively new equipment get ruined bearings from a pressure washer blowing all the grease out of a "sealed" bearing, too. I suppose its the luck of the draw, mainly. I had not using one drilled into me by the old guys that taught me dirt bikes and wrenching. It carries over to my current habits.

Even the choice of cleaners had its good and bad products. Simple Green is popular here, strong detergent action for breaking down grease and grime, easy job to clean up a dirty motorcycle or bicycle. Only problem is that its corrosive to aluminum, it will pit the surface badly, our FAA had an air-worthyness directive about not using it on aircraft as does the US Navy for aircraft. Other products do this the same, its a crap shoot until you see the results and learn the hard way. I keep with a mild dish washing detergent, much as you said, and warm water with a good set of Park Tool Co. brushes for cleaning my CAAD 10. To each their own, we learn by our mistakes, etc... :roll: